Should Japan Abolish Kanji?

[JimmySeal]

The bottom line is, logistical arguments aside, Japanese culture is inextricably intertwined with kanji, and to abolish it would be to attack Japanese culture at its core. To vehemently call for the abolition of kanji, you must be either ignorant of that fact, or exceedingly callous.

The simple fact that you need to memorize 800 or so kanji simply to become literate is proof in itself that the writing system should be discarded.

It is? How d'you figure?

I can say that I know enough about languages to know when one uses a primitive system.

And...?

It is also capable of using the same features of word similiarities to hint at the probable meaning of a word.

I can guarantee that none of those other languages you know has homonyms to the degree that Japanese does.

Japanese has at least 292 morphemes pronounced "kou," 236 pronounced "shou," and 109 pronounced "kei." And that's just the tip of the iceberg. Can you say anything remotely like that for any other language you know?

 

[orochi]

Japan has one of the highest literacy rates in the world. Even people living on the street can read a newspaper. There is nothing wrong with kanji.

 

[kireikoori]

I think everyone in the world should learn Kanji based characters and Roman characters should be abolished.

 

[bakaKanadajin]

orochi I like your avatar

I'm struggling with kanji and my frustration can peak sometimes as I try to memorize them, and not just their form and stroke order but their different readings and radicals and BAHHH..but, I still dont think abolishing kanji would be a good idea. So many good reasons not to, and very few good reasons to do it.

 

[orochi]

I can't think of a single good reason to abolish kanji. It would totally turn the language upside down and the effort it would take to recover would be tremendous.

 

[bakaKanadajin]

Kanji makes me cry
The elegance and genius of written language is in how simply it can convey complex ideas. Kanji is an archaic, primitive, totally obsolete (am I being redundant here? ) writing system.
It requires memorizing unnecessarily complex and intricate character sets that have multiple meanings, depending on their combinations. Time consuming and difficult to write, they are there only to serve a 'literate' elite and change reading and writing from a gift to everyone to the tool and power source of an elite few.

God damn all kanji, the sooner they adopt an alphabet system such as the West uses, the better life will be for all.

I just noticed this post.I will give you one thing, a language with so many similar sounding words can be confusing when spoken. But that's it. We're discussing the written language here since we're on the topic of kanji. So as a written tool, how can you possibly argue kanji is primitive? If something is difficult, more complex and takes time to master but ultimately yields more versatility and reduces ambiguity..in your opinion it's automatically primitive? What kind of ***-backward logic is that?

 

[orochi]

I'm surprised this thread has gone as long as it has seeing as the OP has made pretty much zero argument for his main points.

"Kanji is an archaic, primitive, totally obsolete"

How is it archaic? How is it primitive? How is it obsolete?

I wish him luck proving a living language to be obsolete. I'm not sure he understands the words he's using.

 

[Chidoriashi]

Orochi> Like I said before, anyone who thinks Kanji should be abolished but cannot read Japanese at, at least, an 8th grade level should not be taken seriously. The think they know what they are talking about, but without knowing the langauge they have no clue. And to all of us who do read Japanese they pretty much sound insane cuz we understand all the things they don't.

 

[orochi]

Yeah, it's sort of like running into an English language forum and declaring that consonants are obsolete and should be removed because they destroy the fragile, simple, perfect system of five vowels that can be used to pronounce anything.

 

[takoyaki girl]

hmmm.. though i myslef is not a fan of kanji.. i dont think they should abolish it. kanji has already been part of the "japan" we know now. and besides, even if kanji gives me a hard time when i travel sometimes, it makes my trip more exciting. (^^,)

 

[Goldiegirl]

It's their language and it works for them. I just don't ever see Japanese becoming a world language. But then who cares? It works in Japan and that's what counts. I think it's beautiful to look at. I wish I knew more than my last name, but that's a start.

 

[orochi]

Japanese being "their language" and whatnot is a moot argument.
Japanese becoming a world language is also a moot statement.
Be more realistic.

 

[Nuala]

You never know what might happen. Orochi, I don't think anyone is expecting Japanese to become the official language of multiple countries anytime soon. If Japan enters a seat of power in the global community, then it could be expected, but not at the moment.

I for one would not want Japan to abolish Kanji, it's sorta like the USA abolishing proper English and replacing it with internet slang like, "lol" or "what". The very prospect of that happening frightens me.

 

[mu99le]

I'd like to see japanese with kanji, written japanese looks prtty good for me, it has kinda good balence mixed with kanji,nihongo.. all cultures have points in sharing during long history no one really cares.

 

[Shidenkai]

Kanji are the soul of modern and old japanese literature... don't leave them!

 

[Sukotto]

it's sorta like the USA abolishing proper English and replacing it with internet slang like, "lol" or "what". The very prospect of that happening frightens me.

This is interesting. Why not? If there is one truism of human language is that it is always evolving. I know there are some people who get upset when you don't use "proper" English. But if you ever study a 2nd language you can see that what is in a dictionary or what you learn is referred to as "textbook language". I maintain that dictionaries are not rule books of a language, but rather more like a guidebook.

漢字は好きです。 I like kanji.
Given the history of how it transfered from Chinese culture into Japanese, at two major times by Japanese studying Buddhism and returning with it (if I am not mistaken), perhaps kanji will be transferred to other cultures and languages as well. Say English. This time perhaps by young people via their interest in video games, anime/manga, and pop music. It wouldn't be a bad thing. We are one big human family anyway, that we can learn other languages is proof of that.

 

[Chidoriashi]

Sukotto> Umm actually it should be 漢字が好きです。 "suki" is never preceded by "wa" in a regular statement. Saying "Kanji wa suki" is like saying Kanji likes..... something. "wa" can only precede "suki" when showing contrast. "魚は嫌いだけど肉は好き" (sakana wa kirai dakedo niku wa suki") I hate fish, but I do like meat.
Not trying to pick on you or anything, but people seem to make this mistake a lot on this forum. So I just thought I would help you out.

Also to add to your comment Kanji was transferred to lots of different cultures. Many south east Asian countries once used Kanji.. or Hanzou (whatever it is called in Chinese)... at one time or another throughout their histories.

 

[Elizabeth]

Sukotto> Umm actually it should be 漢字が好きです。 "suki" is never preceded by "wa" in a regular statement. Saying "Kanji wa suki" is like saying Kanji likes..... something. "wa" can only precede "suki" when showing contrast. "魚は嫌いだけど肉は好き" (sakana wa kirai dakedo niku wa suki") I hate fish, but I do like meat.
Not trying to pick on you or anything, but people seem to make this mistake a lot on this forum. So I just thought I would help you out.

Whether it was deliberate or not, Scott got across his love of kanji over whatever would replace it. The contrast/emphasis need not be explicit to work. Of course we should ask before correcting. It's just difficult since he's hardly around enough anymore...

 

[Chi65]

Can I help, please?
The word is Hanzi (chinese original language and meaning: Han =chinese, zi=sign, note), by the way, and they are the origins for other countries, not the japanese Kanji.
The Japanese took it over from China, left, what was usefull and also reduced some to their better understanding when they created their own systems.
One by Kobo Daishi, also known as Kukai, who invented the first own writing system in Japan, the Hiragana syllable system, whose signs are still easy to relate back to the Hanzi, but fitted the own system more clearly, while the Hanzi, now called Kanji in japanese, as long as they still made sense, simply additionally remained.
To this, much later Katakana was added, which helped integrating foreign words and meanings. Also Katakana still is an even more simplified version of some original Hanzi.
Thus, there is a certain red line between them all.

As for Kobo Daishi, aka Kukai, see for example:

Kūkai - Wikipedia

and

Kukai - Everything2.com

And by the way, no chance to make them give it all up, gladly, its also the base for and beginning of art and visualisings.

Greetings!

(I hope, I have not mixed up Hiragana and Katakana once more, which sometimes happens, if so, just switch the names)

 

[kameron]

No way should Japan abolish Kanji.

Well, Korea abolished Hanja (same thing as kanji) over about 300 years and introduced the "space" instead, seems to work okay. They still use various symbols in South Korea but generally it's only ever for place names or people's names. In North Korea it's been pretty much completely abolished.

If Kanji is phased out it's not gonna be the end of the world, but I love kanji, it's an exciting challenge for me, the JSL (never used that term before) student, and what's more it DOES make Japanese a lot easier to read once you know the characters.

 

[cory_cpd]

no! no abolish. some words sound exactly the same but have totally different meaning but could still be used in the sentence. This is totally wrong but what if a word like brother and *** sound exactly the same "dont" i mean the sentence i love my brother would look .... weird. if you catch my drift.

 

[Chidoriashi]

Elizabeth> I wasn't trying to intrude and I know that getting the meaning across is the most important point. But for those trying to excel at the language stuff like that does become of concern at some point. I mean he clearly loves the language so I imagine he is trying to improve his ability too. Anyhow I'll just send a private message next time to avoid stepping on toes.

 

[joeian]

kanji is just hard for english speaker..

 

[Haruspex]

My opinion is that if Japanese people will ever feel that kanji is a burden, they will abolish it without asking any smart*ss about it. The fact that they haven't yet means that they don't give a damn about whether its handy or not. Besides, imagine the announcement: "Dear people, you have learnt 3000 (supposedly in the better case) symbols for absolutely nothing, as starting today, you will have to write everything with kana."
Yeah, gg, uproar and rebellion.

 

[pipokun]

No way should Japan abolish Kanji.
Well, Korea abolished Hanja (same thing as kanji) over about 300 years and introduced the "space" instead, seems to work okay. They still use various symbols in South Korea but generally it's only ever for place names or people's names. In North Korea it's been pretty much completely abolished.
...

Until 1986, South Korean students did learn hanja, but the ultra-nationalism after the Olympic killed the great Asian heritage there.
If you did not know the above, the nationalistic policy succeeded.