Gentleman10
後輩
- 7 Nov 2006
- 124
- 4
...sofar I think this is the most intelligible post I've read in this argument. I can't agree with you more.
Comfort Women
- Thread starter thomas
- Start date
...sofar I think this is the most intelligible post I've read in this argument. I can't agree with you more.
KirinMan
後輩
- 23 Jan 2007
- 2,173
- 68
You know what, forget it, I hope you enjoy living in your plastic bubble, because the rest of the world is just going to pass you by.
This truly does fit.
KirinMan
後輩
- 23 Jan 2007
- 2,173
- 68
First off just because you may or may not be Japanese doesn't give you the right to talk for the majority of the country. I would never be so bold to say the same thing about my own country, you are showing your arrogance.
You have your opinion, but if by the off chance that the "majority" feel this way it is 100% due to a lack of education in schools about Japanese war crimes and Japanese wartime activities.
I doubt that tha majority are aware of all sides of the issue and only know about what their government feeds them, they can not make an honest judgement or opinion without seeing it from all sides of the story. Many/most(?) Japanese in my opinion are mostly ignorant on this subject.
Your arguments are similar to saying that you are innocent because of your ignorance.
How long do you plan to stay ignorant of what the rest of the world sees as fact?
How long are you going to live in your coccoon of belief that Japan is innocent?
hanachan
先輩
- 10 Mar 2007
- 265
- 16
Thanks. Try to change "Japan/Japanese" to "the US/Americans". It's not so unnatural.
By the way do you ignore the latter half of my post?
KirinMan
後輩
- 23 Jan 2007
- 2,173
- 68
Here is where I stop replying to you on this topic, you know very well that this has nothing to do with the topic at hand.
Geez no, hanachan, I choose not to reply because it would be useless discussing this topic any further with you or origami, I've had fun with you two but to continue the discussion would be the same as banging my head against a wall, and I am not a masochist. Oh don't forget I could be asking you the exact same thing here, wink wink
Just remember this, the preponderance of the evidence supports the claims of the "comfort women". You can stay living in ignorant bliss and go on with your daily life secure in your opinion that Japan did no wrong, but please don't be one bit surprised or shocked when countries like Korea, China, Phillipines etc, continue to distrust Japan and the Japanese Government for refusing to acknowledge what was infact a truly horrific past.
Bye.......
What is the preponderance of the evidence?
The government does not deny the existance of brothels at all. As the Korean testimony in the interview during the war, Korean people would have killed Japanese if Japanese had kidnapped Korean women.
It was the American who interviewed the Koreans then.
I think it was the same military brothel as American, Australia or other countries during the WWII. Sorry I am wrong, but I've never heard of any supports for Chinese or Indian women in the US brothel in China.
I am not playing blame games here.
Han Chan
先輩
- 14 Mar 2006
- 444
- 16
By searching Japanese MOFA's webpage, I now realize that former PM Koizumi actually did write a letter of apology: (Issues regarding History):
"
Letter from Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi to the former comfort women
The Year of 2001
Dear Madam,
On the occasion that the Asian Women's Fund, in cooperation with the Government and the people of Japan, offers atonement from the Japanese people to the former wartime comfort women, I wish to express my feelings as well.
The issue of comfort women, with an involvement of the Japanese military authorities at that time, was a grave affront to the honor and dignity of large numbers of women.
As Prime Minister of Japan, I thus extend anew my most sincere apologies and remorse to all the women who underwent immeasurable and painful experiences and suffered incurable physical and psychological wounds as comfort women.
We must not evade the weight of the past, nor should we evade our responsibilities for the future.
I believe that our country, painfully aware of its moral responsibilities, with feelings of apology and remorse, should face up squarely to its past history and accurately convey it to future generations.
Furthermore, Japan also should take an active part in dealing with violence and other forms of injustice to the honor and dignity of women.
Finally, I pray from the bottom of my heart that each of you will find peace for the rest of your lives.
Respectfully yours,
Junichiro Koizumi
Prime Minister of Japan
"
I now respect Koizumi much more than before! This, though, makes the stance of Abe even more pathetic. "One step forwards and two steps back".
KirinMan
後輩
- 23 Jan 2007
- 2,173
- 68
Han Chan thanks for finding that and sharing it here, it is an official recognition that "something" happened and from what it sounds like a truly heartfelt apology. To the naysayers here on this thread it should also be noted that this is from the Japan Ministry of Foreign Affairs, but I suppose they will find some excuse to not believe it or to downplay it's significance.
Mmmm you are right about Abe, makes him out to look like an arse, particularly since he was Koizumi's hand-picked sucessor.
Mmmm you are right about Abe, makes him out to look like an arse, particularly since he was Koizumi's hand-picked sucessor.
- 1 Nov 2005
- 446
- 39
Han Chan.
I am more than pleased with your research work! I never read that letter before, so I have forwarded this letter from the former Prime Minister of Japan to my group here in the Netherlands "The Foundation of Japanese Honorary Debts"
And YES, you are so right by saying; There are good and bad people everywhere! I learned that long ago.
Han Chan, a Japanese doctor saved my sister's life in May 1943 and I saw a Japanese soldier crying his heart out in August 1945, he had lost his whole family through a big bomb, so the other Japanese told us in broken English and Malay.
I learned very young that nothing is just black and white in life.
I am more than pleased with your research work! I never read that letter before, so I have forwarded this letter from the former Prime Minister of Japan to my group here in the Netherlands "The Foundation of Japanese Honorary Debts"
And YES, you are so right by saying; There are good and bad people everywhere! I learned that long ago.
Han Chan, a Japanese doctor saved my sister's life in May 1943 and I saw a Japanese soldier crying his heart out in August 1945, he had lost his whole family through a big bomb, so the other Japanese told us in broken English and Malay.
I learned very young that nothing is just black and white in life.
As I told you, the govenment did not deny the existence of the brothels.
Buy why were they the war crime?
No bricks are needed, but just your explanation.
KirinMan
後輩
- 23 Jan 2007
- 2,173
- 68
Do you consider rape to be a crime?
Did you read my reply in a previous message? Look through the links and my answer is/are contained there.
Of course, it is a crime, but what about prostitution or military brothel?Do you consider rape to be a crime?
Did you read my reply in a previous message? Look through the links and my answer is/are contained there.
To be fair, the UK also ran the brothel.
D
diceke
Guest
what?
There is nothing wrong with comparing and contrasting issues in different countries. I've seen some people compare Japan and Germany, but they usually refuse to compare Japan to their own country, especially if that highlights negative things in their country.
These history issues are not unique to Japan, and if anyone believes otherwise, he is in blissful ignorance.
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KirinMan
後輩
- 23 Jan 2007
- 2,173
- 68
I guess I would have to look at from the point of 1930's or 1940's law in China, Korea, and the Phillipines. Since the areas that the brothel's were in were occupied territories under Japanese martial law at the time I would be willing to bet that they were not illegal back then right?
Japanese law even today is rather "grey" in the area of that particular sector of the "service" industry.
But that's not really the point is it, the point is how 200,000 or so of these women were forced into servitude and in many cases brutalized, raped, and murdered.
It's like saying that posession is 9/10's of the law, once the girls/women were in the custody of the brothel there was no longer any "crime" committed. When in fact the majority of the women were coerced into "working" there,
then again it was during war time and who did these women have to take their case up for them back then? Not to mention the psycological fear of their captor's.
No matter how many "volunteered" for the work I can not in my mind imagine 200,000 women volunteering to "service" an occupying army during wartime, can you?
leonmarino
Back
- 19 May 2006
- 1,258
- 64
I kind of left this thread because I felt that my questions were being answered only half. But I have now found an interesting clip on YouTube!!
Apart from the hilarious man from Benin (I was pleasantly impressed by his Japanese!!), I think the woman from South Korea makes a good point about why Japanese politicians "have to keep apologizing"; it's because there seems to be no one agreed upon view on Japan's historical past with regards to its wrong-doings in Asia during WW2.
One of the presenters doesn't seem very open to her ideas though.. Saying Korean politicians do the same!? Scary stuff..
ps: Try to see through the ridiculous costumes the presenters (including Takeshi Kitano) are wearing!!
Apart from the hilarious man from Benin (I was pleasantly impressed by his Japanese!!), I think the woman from South Korea makes a good point about why Japanese politicians "have to keep apologizing"; it's because there seems to be no one agreed upon view on Japan's historical past with regards to its wrong-doings in Asia during WW2.
One of the presenters doesn't seem very open to her ideas though.. Saying Korean politicians do the same!? Scary stuff..
ps: Try to see through the ridiculous costumes the presenters (including Takeshi Kitano) are wearing!!
CBT1979
先輩
- 14 Nov 2006
- 134
- 2
Unlike Koizumi, Abe adressed an official apology about the comfort women who "served" the japanese troops overseas during WW2.
I really say much respect to Abe for handling this issue much more apropriate than his predecessor.
Of course the people who want the apology from Japan's government have not always the same intention. Some just want the fact stay true in history, some want compensation.
I don't think that most people especially the still living comfort women want Japan or any other nation apologize every year publicly, but don't want the history textbooks telling something completely different or played down.
The Tenno has not played down this and other issues related to the pacific war and Abe is on the right way to repair the relationships with Japan's neighbours. I cannot do much but pray that Abe's foreign policy succeeds to build friendship and harmony in the region with the leaders of the neighbours.
I really say much respect to Abe for handling this issue much more apropriate than his predecessor.
Of course the people who want the apology from Japan's government have not always the same intention. Some just want the fact stay true in history, some want compensation.
I don't think that most people especially the still living comfort women want Japan or any other nation apologize every year publicly, but don't want the history textbooks telling something completely different or played down.
The Tenno has not played down this and other issues related to the pacific war and Abe is on the right way to repair the relationships with Japan's neighbours. I cannot do much but pray that Abe's foreign policy succeeds to build friendship and harmony in the region with the leaders of the neighbours.
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Han Chan
--(quote)
I now respect Koizumi much more than before! This, though, makes the stance of Abe even more pathetic. "One step forwards and two steps back".
--(unquote)
Mr Koizumi wrote this letter of apology, but did not and still does not admit the fiction either. The fiction that Japanese military "kidnapped 200,000 women" and "forced them to work as sex slaves".
Mr Koizumi only inherited Kono Statement 1993 which was based on interviews with 16 ex-comfort women. At the interview in 1993, no request for hard evidence, no request for third party opinion, no questioning were accepted.
The sentence in Mr Koizumi's letter referring to Japanese military ("with an involvement of the Japanese military authorities at that time") does NOT mean that Japanese military kidnapped women and made them sex slaves.
Please read all my previous posts.
In my March 22 post, I wrote --
--(quote)
4)What Japanese military did were -- warning brokers against illegal or dishonest recruitment, ordering housemasters (employers) to keep his/her house in good sanitary conditions, sending doctors occasionally to houses , taking care of safe transportation of the women. All these were done for the health and safety of soldiers and civilians (prostitutes and housemasters, etc.) outside of Japan. Nothing blamable!
--(unquote)
Anyway, now that you have found Mr Koizumi's letter of apology, you admit requiring further apologies is unfair, don't you?
--(quote)
I now respect Koizumi much more than before! This, though, makes the stance of Abe even more pathetic. "One step forwards and two steps back".
--(unquote)
Mr Koizumi wrote this letter of apology, but did not and still does not admit the fiction either. The fiction that Japanese military "kidnapped 200,000 women" and "forced them to work as sex slaves".
Mr Koizumi only inherited Kono Statement 1993 which was based on interviews with 16 ex-comfort women. At the interview in 1993, no request for hard evidence, no request for third party opinion, no questioning were accepted.
The sentence in Mr Koizumi's letter referring to Japanese military ("with an involvement of the Japanese military authorities at that time") does NOT mean that Japanese military kidnapped women and made them sex slaves.
Please read all my previous posts.
In my March 22 post, I wrote --
--(quote)
4)What Japanese military did were -- warning brokers against illegal or dishonest recruitment, ordering housemasters (employers) to keep his/her house in good sanitary conditions, sending doctors occasionally to houses , taking care of safe transportation of the women. All these were done for the health and safety of soldiers and civilians (prostitutes and housemasters, etc.) outside of Japan. Nothing blamable!
--(unquote)
Anyway, now that you have found Mr Koizumi's letter of apology, you admit requiring further apologies is unfair, don't you?
about korean matter,
at first ,korea requested the Annexation.
some information about indonasia at that time
Asian History: Indonesian / Malay Perspective on Japan
Their purposes,It keeps apologizing to Japan.
Sinocentrism
KirinMan
後輩
- 23 Jan 2007
- 2,173
- 68
Ok so Indonesia threw off Dutch colonial rule, but all that ended up happening is they ended up trading one overlord who happened to be "white" to a Japanese one. This really isn't related to the comfort women issue.
E. Yamazaki
後輩
- 12 Feb 2007
- 3
- 0
Couldn't part of the reason be the view that many Japanese have against Koreans? That Koreans are inferior and unwanted, and so don't deserve an apology?
