What about other animals' rights?

[heianbutterfly]

Why is only whaling cruel? I don't eat whale meat and I don't eat much meat at all. But I don't think there's any argument for making Japan stop whaling. I agree with anti-whaling as long as whales are actually endangered and preserving their species is a problem but that isn't the case with all species of whales. So what's the argument then, that it's cruel? Isn't keeping battery hens and pigs in pens so small they don't have even room to turn around far more cruel?

 

[pipokun]

Obesity is an index to measure how cruel people can be against the nature.
The Japanese still shows modesty, I think.

 

[Tokis-Phoenix]

I agree with you heianbutterfly, there is a large amount of other animal cruelty that goes on in the world and its a shame that the large majority of these issues don't get anywhere near as much coverage and attention as issues like whaling- there is also a question of whether whaling really is cruel or not, or whether its just a matter of people not being able to handle whales being killed because people value them more than other animals. I think this is often the case with whaling- it gets a lot of coverage and attention not because it is particularly cruel in comparison to other matters of welfare concerning other animals, but rather because a lot of people are particularly attached to and protective over whales for whatever personal reasons etc.

I do not think whaling is particularly cruel- i do think that when it comes to the matter of slaughter, none of the methods currently being used are very humane and they leave a lot to be desired, and this is why i think whaling is cruel when it comes to this certain respect. But i don't think whaling is that important as a matter in itself when it is compared to other much larger scale and worser forms of animal cruelty, like battery farming for example. I would be far happier to see the end of battery farming than to see the end of whaling.

I do think that if it was gone about in the right way, whaling could have a place in the world that would not be all bad. The commercial hunting of endangered or threatened species should obviously be against the law, but if non-endangered/threatened whales were killed in a humane manner and killed in numbers that did not have a bad impact on the whales population as a whole, then whaling could be alright- it would be little different from responsable deer or boar hunting etc.

 

[MadamePapillon]

Hasn't this been gone over before? Whaling isn't the only animal protection issue out there. Why does everyone keep acting like Japan is the only country being targeted for animal rights issues?

 

[Tokis-Phoenix]

Why does everyone keep acting like Japan is the only country being targeted for animal rights issues?

Its not the only one being targeted for animal rights issues however its the only country that has received so much media attention/coverage for such a thing in recent times- the media has really targeted whaling and Japan. So you can't really blame people for acting like Japan being the only country targeted for animal rights issues when its the only country that has received so much international political and media attention- can you think of any other issues of animal rights/welfare/whatever that have been internationally covered as much as Japan's whaling has?

 

[Sarapva]

I think Canada's seal hunt (which is just about to begin again this year) is also covered internationally probably as much as Japan's whale hunting. But the reason we're discussing Japan's whaling here is because this is the whaling forum. I do agree that there are a lot of equally important animals rights issues, which are beginning to get more media coverage (like factory farms and slaughterhouses). All animals, in my opinion, deserve the same rights and should be respected as living, feeling beings.

 

[Tokis-Phoenix]

I think Canada's seal hunt (which is just about to begin again this year) is also covered internationally probably as much as Japan's whale hunting. But the reason we're discussing Japan's whaling here is because this is the whaling forum. I do agree that there are a lot of equally important animals rights issues, which are beginning to get more media coverage (like factory farms and slaughterhouses). All animals, in my opinion, deserve the same rights and should be respected as living, feeling beings.

Hm i really don't think the other animal issues are being anywhere near as covered politically or in the media as much as whaling- your thread on the seal hunting thing is the first i've heard about it for years (and i keep very up to date with the news), and there has been pretty minimal mention of factory farms and the like in my country.
In the last month or so on the BBC news website, if you type "whaling" into the search engine there's being 18 articles written on whales and whaling in the last month alone. If you type "seal hunt" on the other hand into the search engine, the last news article written about it was last year in October. So there is a massive difference in the amount of media coverage on these two main topics at the least- factory farming and the like barely get a mention on news sites.

Personally, i think there's so much attention being given to whaling- i believe this mass of media coverage is being done mostly because animal rights activists are determined to keep such things in the news via controversial behavior like criminal acts for their cause etc so to help keep the spotlight shone on their causes. But i think people are loosing the point here in this sense- there are far more important things than whaling when it comes to animal rights that need to be sorted (like battery farming), however these causes end up getting left in the dark because ironically of animal rights activist behavior over matters like whaling. I agree with you that animals need to be treated equally and all that, but i think the fact of the matter is that a lot of people really do value some animals more than others, like whales for example.

 

[Sarapva]

It's probably true that people value some animals more than others, though my belief is that it shouldn't be that way. Anything that's alive deserves respect (unless, of course, you're being attacked by an animal or person - in that case you should do what you need to survive).

I get emails from a few different animal rights and environmental groups, so I probably hear about all these different issues more than what's in the media. To me they're all equally important.

 

[david@tokyo]

Similar remarks were made in an Australian newspaper the other day that if you were to measure the Australian government's "concern" about a given issue by the number of press releases they put out, they appear to care far far more about some hundred animals (whales) being killed than they do about people in Tibet getting killed.

This is the same Australian government that puts out press releases defending it's own decisions to kill hundreds of animals (kangaroos) for other reasons.

Of course as far as Australia is concerned, their government need only be worried whether their policies appear consistent and reasonable to Australian people (although to their credit the animal welfare / rights groups have called the Australian government for their hypocrisy).

 

[outspoken_plimpy]

Anything that's alive deserves respect (unless, of course, you're being attacked by an animal or person - in that case you should do what you need to survive).

If by respect you mean that we don't kill them then that would ruin the whole system of nature. We would have to arrest all the carnivores so they don't ruthlessly murder the innocent herbivores, then they (herbivores) would breed out of control and eat all the plants and then die from hunger and all life is obliterated from the face of the earth. BTW, human is a species of animal too, like bears, so we are entitled to affect the ecosystem in which we habitate.

 

[uchimizu]

What about tuna

Hi,

I find it quite strange that some people focus so much on whaling, which is anyways marginal in Japan (it is not like you eat everday whale meat), whereas there are huge issues due to the rarefaction of tuna, one of the most eaten food in Japan (and I must say my favourite sushi), because of overfishing.

Then again, maybe tuna is not sexy enough for environmental groups to get the level of public attention (and funding) they need.

 

[outspoken_plimpy]

The reason whaling is focused on so much is because whaling sells stories. Everyone in Australia is Anti-whaling, and strongly so, and there is a perfect market.

 

[david@tokyo]

Then again, maybe tuna is not sexy enough for environmental groups

Give it time. Who would ever have thought that whales and sharks could be sexy?

 

[RolandtheHeadless]

In the minds of some people certain animals are entitled to favored status. This is largely because these animals are marketed like political candidates.

Whales and wolves and fur seals -- the fund-raising poster children of animal rights organizations. Show a photo of a dead whale or a wolf in a trap or a fur seal being clubbed, and people write checks. That let's these organizations pay big salaries to their officers and managers.

 

[Glopal Citezen]

It is Politics

or called it blindness or one-eyed point of view
and as one participant mentioned about Australian government view on whaling nothing said about killing "excessive" numbersof kangaroos
it is remind me by latest comment by Condoliza Rice American foreign affairs sec. on Russian forces occupying Georgian south Ositia , she said it is not 1968 and telling the russia to back off from Georgia while the USa forces still an occupation forces in many countries

The need a glasses
Arigato

 

[RolandtheHeadless]

"It's not 2003," she meant.

 

[Chaostic Pen]

The problem is Japan is whaling in the Australian's seas, it is against the white people.
I always watched anime such as Naruto and Bleach but when I watch it in the class at TAFE, all the aussies left lol ( but they are nice in general).

The Australian receive thousands of tourists every year from these whales and they have to defend their reputation as a first world country so they have to make a big deal out of it.

I personally think that we Asian need to stick together and look up to each other lol. Japan should look up to Vietnam because we make good lollies and we give you some ^_^

 

[alexlovesrock]

i agree with you completely this is western cultural arrogance. westerners think whales, dogs and cats are cute and shouldnt be killed, but are fine with killing pigs and cows. imagine if india had a lot more world influence, then eating cows would be taboo. im completely vegetarian and have been my whole life. i think if you kill one animal for food, you have no right to accuse someone else of being bad for killing a different animal,,, thats just hypocrisy

 

[Chaostic Pen]

This is my study about white people.

White people are mostly less aggressive than us, they live in cold weathers so they tend to stick up together more and they work together more than us. They know less about other cultures and they can easily be discussed over things that are different from them. They are as tall as Africans but they are white and they possess beautiful body features, that is because they have lived in good life styles for hundreds of years.

In general, we North Asian have small timid body and we have big head. No matter how much we eats we still need a few generation to catch up with Whites and Africans in height and maybe 5-6 generations for our men to look as good as theirs. Furthermore, we Asian always war on each other constantly and because of that we reproduces more in order for our childrens to survive those wars, we possesses small body because small body will consume lesser foods than the big one but we can be highly intelligent because to us, intelligence are power and can help us to take over anything we want to.

Now this is why Westerner hates us, because of our features they can see more evidences of war, hate, anger and other feelings that we possess naturally through wars. For a Westerner, they have lived good and peaceful lives for so long they tend to be more sensitive to see such features we are carrying so they are more easier to hate us and for what we are doing. But because we have admired the Westerner so much and alot of us ended up idolizing them, it made them more acceptant towards us and they started getting to know more about our cultures and our people. And because we are also highly developed people, they finally started to love us.

But the problem is that the Chinese people and perhaps, other South East Asian people that looks like us are giving us a bad image and White people couldn't differentiate the differences between us they might end up hating all of us together. We always worship them making them love us more but that doesn't mean they will respect us, to them we could be just like pets and always have to make them love us for a meal or two, they thought they those armies they have in our countries are to save our lives and we are forever in debt to them.

I've this thought for a long time and this is my first time to ever put it in words and in order to avoid arguements, i will stop right here.