preposition's text , can you answer ?

[porkar]

as Porkar said that the native speakers know more than us which the English is my second language.
maybe it's different from place to place to say I made and I make according to accent and dialogue.
but if you may Pokar or Zoon van Ijs to answer my last participation about this,


Pokar it's noticeable that your English is your mother language but Zoon van Ijs is educated enough .

PS: yesterday my exam The History of Literature and Thought , it's really very very hard subject . I think it'll go down

"See" is a verb, in this instance it means to notice, not to see with the eyes. "See" can also mean to understand, such as "I see what you mean."
"the home of their friends" is the genitive, meaning the friends possess the house.

 

[Yukiko chan]

" Parents are often upset when their children praise the homes of their friends and regard it as a slur on their
own cooking, or cleaning, or furniture, and often are foolish enough to let the adolescents see that they are annoyed " .

- "the homes of their friends" is in the ....... case
a) dative b) nominative c) genitive d) Norman genitive

It's the Norman genitive. The genitive case would be like "their friends' home". (Someone explained that already in the first page)
But "the homes" by itself is in the accusative case.

-the function of the see is :
a)verb b) infinitive c) complement d)object

here I think it's verb , but most of my friends said , it's complement and that's totally wrong.
because the complement must be SUBJECT or OBJECT.

"See" is a verb of course, but it's in the infinitive form.

 

[porkar]

..
..
. at least giving another possible use of simple present other than the ones I've stated, ..

Example: I am answering the question.
"Sorry, I tend to be a language purist most of the time!"
Another word for that is 'pedantic'.
Here is a useful site: .linguapress.com

 

[porkar]

It's the Norman genitive. The genitive case would be like "their friends' home". ..

"See" is a verb of course, but it's in the infinitive form.

Most people don't bother with Norman or Saxon genitive distinction, mainly because most people don't even bother discussing them; they are not really important in general English usage.

The infinitive of 'see' is 'to see'.

"The infinitive form of the verb is a compound verb made up of the the preposition "to" and the basic form of the verb:

to walk, to paint, to think, to grow, to sing" (from 'en.allexperts.com' - General writing and grammar help).

 

[Yukiko chan]

Example: I am answering the question.

That's the present continuous.

"Sorry, I tend to be a language purist most of the time!"
Another word for that is 'pedantic'.

You can say that...

Here is a useful site: .linguapress.com

The site you referenced is interesting, here's what it says:

In short, the Present Simple is used to express:
a) permanent states and permanent truths.
b) repetitive actions
c) instant actions.
Examples:
a1) I like apples, but I don't like oranges.
a2) I live in London, and I work for a big bank.
a3) Flowers grow well in a warm sunny climate.
a4) Tomorrow never comes
b1) My brother often goes to London.
b2) It snows in winter in New York.
b3) I get up at 6 every morning.
c1) Oh, I understand what you mean.
c2) And now Owen gets the ball, he shoots, and he scores!

"making a decision" as stated in our sentence is neither a permanent state, nor a permanent truth, not even a repetitive action and much less an instant action (like "kick", "shoot", "slam", etc...).
Besides, Half-n-Half, who's a native speaker as well, conceded that in the present tense "I make a decision..." the sentence sounded unnatural. Though I don't think that being native or not is anywhere relevant to our discussion.

Most people don't bother with Norman or Saxon genitive distinction, mainly because most people don't even bother discussing them; they are not really important in general English usage.

Yups, I didn't even know the term "Norman genitive" until I saw it here. But since it was suggested and it's a more accurate answer than "genitive", then it's the best answer.

The infinitive of 'see' is 'to see'.
"The infinitive form of the verb is a compound verb made up of the the preposition "to" and the basic form of the verb:
to walk, to paint, to think, to grow, to sing" (from 'en.allexperts.com' - General writing and grammar help).

Both "see" and "to see" are considered infinitive. The first one is called "bare infinitive", the other one "full infinitive". The choice merely depends on the verb which introduces the sentence (which could be a model verb):
Examples:
- I want to see how it's going to work out.
- I'll let him see how it's going to work out.
- I came to see how it's going to work out.
- I can see how it's going to work out.

 

[Red5]

I think that Zoon van Ijs was right about this :

It's the Norman genitive. The genitive case would be like "their friends' home". (Someone explained that already in the first page)

and porkar when he said this :

The infinitive of 'see' is 'to see'.

"The infinitive form of the verb is a compound verb made up of the the preposition "to" and the basic form of the verb:

to walk, to paint, to think, to grow, to sing" (from 'en.allexperts.com' - General writing and grammar help).

" Parents are often upset when their children praise the homes of their friends and regard it as a slur on their
own cooking, or cleaning, or furniture, and often are foolish enough to let the adolescents see that they are annoyed " .

here in this care I think it's not infinitive , it's verb as we have the options

 

[Yukiko chan]

here in this care I think it's not infinitive , it's verb as we have the options

Hmm, if by "infinitive" they meant the full infinitive (i.e. "to" + verb) then I was mistaken, and as you said, it would be considered as a verb.
If, on the other hand, they meant any form of infinitive, "infinitive" is a better answer, because "see" by itself is considered a "bare infinitive".

This could be a mere difference in terminology by the way. Each school of linguistics has its own principles and methods, and thus its own conceptual terms. I've encountered that when I was studying Arabic, and I see it often with Japanese as well.

 

[porkar]

Where I live I reckon 99% of the native English speakers would say "make a decision" - the other 1% is probably not informed enough to make one.

 

[Yukiko chan]

Fair enough. I have no intention, and no reason, to challenge that.
I've got to admit, I know almost nothing about Australian English... I mean nothing about its particularities compared to British or American.

 

[Red5]

Where I live I reckon 99% of the native English speakers would say "make a decision" - the other 1% is probably not informed enough to make one.

calm down man , but every country has own accent maybe in your country say I make but others say I made, but the problem which of them the lecturer will choose. Maybe she'll choose a option that we won't expect .
Australian English has a lot of differences between American and British accent even among the words.

 

[Hezam]

Like Arabic accents,I like Syrian accent more than the other arabic accents.
Thanks for the answers Zoon van Ijs & porkar..We can learn two accents in one time regarding to you guys.^^

 

[porkar]

calm down man , but every country has own accent maybe in your country say I make but others say I made, but the problem which of them the lecturer will choose. Maybe she'll choose a option that we won't expect .
Australian English has a lot of differences between American and British accent even among the words.

I'm not sure why you said "calm down" but I reckon I should know what people in my own country understand.

You say "make" if it is in present tense or "made" if it is in past tense. I would say 99% of all native English speakers would understand that.

btw, this has nothing to do with accent. Accent is a particular way you speak, not how you write or phrase sentences.

 

[Hezam]

You say "make" if it is in present tense or "made" if it is in past tense.

That's right.
Thanks.

 

[Red5]

I'm not sure why you said "calm down" but I reckon I should know what people in my own country understand.

You say "make" if it is in present tense or "made" if it is in past tense. I would say 99% of all native English speakers would understand that.

btw, this has nothing to do with accent. Accent is a particular way you speak, not how you write or phrase sentences.

"calm down" I said it because I felt that you're angry.
I didn't mean exactly the accent how to speak , I meant the informal language . In term of informal language, people use informal without following any grammatical rules. specially in Black American in their informal language such as ( we wasn't , I is , you was ) I heard that a lot in the movies. so as I told you, some says made and others make.

You say "make" if it is in present tense or "made" if it is in past tense.

that's obviously make in present and made in past, but here I think that "made a decision" is the right way to say , it expresses in the past but you can say it in the present.

 

[Red5]

" Parents are often upset when their children praise the homes of their friends and regard it as a slur on their
own cooking, or cleaning, or furniture, and often are foolish enough to let the adolescents see that they are annoyed " .

-the function of the see is :
a)verb b) infinitive c) complement d)object

today after finishing my poetry exam , I went to my teacher and I told him about the verb SEE .
he told me that the answer is c) complement , I was really shocked .he told me that the verb let in "let the adolescents see" is transitive and it needs object , we consider the verb see as clause or as I understood him we consider the clause adolescents see that they are annoyedlike clause and it's object for the transitive verb let . does that make any sense ?

 

[Yukiko chan]

today after finishing my poetry exam , I went to my teacher and I told him about the verb SEE .
he told me that the answer is c) complement , I was really shocked .he told me that the verb let in "let the adolescents see" is transitive and it needs object , we consider the verb see as clause or as I understood him we consider the clause adolescents see that they are annoyedlike clause and it's object for the transitive verb let . does that make any sense ?

Interesting response!! I've never had an advanced professional course in English grammar, so most of what I know of it comes from personal readings, but so far I haven't encountered anything that would suggest such a response. Though I could still suggest that the object of "let" is "the adolescents". Did you ask your prof about that?

 

[Red5]

I ask my prof what is the matter about the verb see and what the right answer whether it's verb or not , ?
he told me that the verb let is transitive and it need object. so we consider the verb see work like object complement . I really didn't understand any thing but I guess he was right

 

[porkar]

I have been speaking and writing in English for more than 60 years.
I learned grammar and syntax etc in grade school but I have never really needed all that technical information to communicate with others.
Can I ask a some question please?
What is your reason for learning English?

 

[Red5]

Can I ask a some question please?
What is your reason for learning English?

I'm learning English and Japanese in my university and that's mean that I'm student and two year and I'll graduate, but the languages are very common in my country specially English and Japanese and nowadays the Chinese plays a rule.

 

[GreenCat]

today after finishing my poetry exam , I went to my teacher and I told him about the verb SEE .
he told me that the answer is c) complement , I was really shocked .he told me that the verb let in "let the adolescents see" is transitive and it needs object , we consider the verb see as clause or as I understood him we consider the clause adolescents see that they are annoyedlike clause and it's object for the transitive verb let . does that make any sense ?

I don't understand English but...why we see "often" appear twice in a paragraph?

Parents are often upset=clause
when their children praise the homes of their friends and regard it as a slur on their
own cooking or cleaning, or furniture= conditional
often are foolish enough to let the adolescents see that they are annoyed=clause

Parents often are foolish enough to let the adolescents see that they are annoyed

Parents often are foolish enough= sentence
to let the adolescents see that they are annoyed=I forgot what this is called but "to let the adolescents see" part is not a sentence and should not contain any verb without a conjunction.

let somebody see:
This "see" cannot be an object
This cannot be a verb because there already is a verb in the sentence
This cannot be infinitive because to matches up with let
This must be a complement​

From what I read, your teacher is right. Though, I would be most frustrated if I have to face a similar exam paper: why names matter that much!? we don't care!?

 

[porkar]

"Often" is often used when you mean something occurs frequently but not constantly.
e.g. "I often go to the city on Friday."
It means I don't go every Friday, but I go on some Fridays.

Regarding "see" just to confuse you further, 'see' does not necessarily mean to observe with the eyes, but also to understand something. e.g. "I see what you mean." Sorry, English is a difficult language, you may as well get used to it if you choose to learn it.
I would say very few native English speakers have a need for the advanced grammar that you are being taught. Most people in the world converse in a local vernacular or idiom in whatever language they speak.

 

[Hezam]

'see' does not necessarily mean to observe with the eyes, but also to understand something. e.g. "I see what you mean."

It's the same in Arabic,English is very similar with Arabic.

Thank you.