This is a mobile optimized page that loads fast, if you want to load the real page, click this text.

Help Japanese Newspaper Translation

I guess you're not going to do full translation of the previous sentence then.

宇宙で活動するとき、いちばん問題になるのが宇宙ごみです

とき here does not have the same meaning as 中 in 「宇宙ごみ」の中

And you dropped the Ambassador's name.

Japanese names can be difficult, but with NHK News Easy, there's a button to put furigana over everything. Also all names are color-coded differently to distinguish places, organizations, and persons. I don't know if you turned those off for easier reading - they do make things messy - but don't be afraid to turn them back on for a moment if you want that information. They are useful learning tools.


While this is true for natural translation, I think it's useful, at least early in you career of translating native materials, to first translate literally and then adjust phrasing into something more natural. This ensures that you don't miss anything, and helps get a sense of the structure of Japanese.

Also, we do say "I think that I'd like to ..." in English as a way of non-assertively expressing a desire, so there is a near parallel grammar. We're just unlikely to use it when speaking for a government or organization, because the English variant implies a tentativeness or indecision that the Japanese doesn't imply... so not a perfect parallel.




Toritoribe said:
This is off-topic of this thread
Click to expand...
Sorry about that, and thank you for the informative reply and links.
 
ウィーンにある国連日本代表部の引原大使は「宇宙で活動するとき、いちばん問題になるのが宇宙ごみです。
I thought I had translated everything but とき. I'll try again tomorrow so yes, I do want to translate the full sentence .

Like I mentioned, it's the とき which I have trouble with. That whole section actually.
I'm used to seeing で as the marker which expresses the way an action was done or where a certain action took place. So I think in this case, it means that the rest of the sentence is to interpreted in the conext of space.

In the following sentence:
私は 学生 の ときには とても 若かったね。
I understand とき just fine. But the construction is different from:
宇宙で活動するとき,
There's no に particle for one thing. I think するとき modifies 活動, an activity. I think it means the activities done in space but then I don't see why not simply write:
宇宙で活動するとき,
... and get rid of とき altogether. I'ce turned it around in my head to find a way to convey the meaning of that word.
 
とき
接続詞 (= conjunction)
1 When; if; in case
用例
彼は若い時に欧米を漫遊した
He visited Europe and America when he was young―in his youth.

「とき」の英語・英語例文・英語表現 - Weblio和英辞書

｢とき｣は英語でどう表現する？【単語】time...【例文】Only time will show...【その他の表現】an hour... - 1000万語以上収録！英訳・英文・英単語の使い分けならWeblio英和・和英辞書
ejje.weblio.jp

時
2. occasion; case
Only applies to 時
車を運転する時はいくら注意してもしすぎることはない。
You cannot be too careful when you drive a car.

とき - Jisho.org

jisho.org

Zizka said:
I think するとき modifies 活動
Click to expand...
Check how a clause modifies a noun in your textbook. Are there any cases where the modifier is put after the modified noun? You yourself wrote "The dictionary explains that the modifier precedes what is being modified.", no?
 
By previous sentence, I mean,

日本は、２０２５年度ごろまでに「宇宙ごみ」の中の大きな物を片づけることができるようにしたいと考えています。

You made a translation attempt, then we talked about all the pieces, but you didn't re-attempt it.

Zizka said:
I thought I had translated everything but とき.
Click to expand...

Everything except とき and the ambassador's name was in your translation attempt.

But I might point out that you shouldn't simply leave out a word. Sometimes a word may disappear in translation, but before you remove it from your translation you should be sure you know what role it is playing. A lot of politeness-level speech does this... くん、ちゃん、and when attached to names, words like 部長 and 先輩. I mean, you can translate them, at least for titles as honorifics, but it's a very unnatural translation, so you shouldn't for anything other than an extremely literal translation being done for educational purposes.
 
"Only applies to 時"
If I understand this correctly, it means that とき and 時 can have different meanings. In other words, 時 is used for the occasion/meaning definition. Can the writing of a word be determinant in meaning? For example, using kana instead of kanji to write a word?

"Check how a clause modifies a noun in your textbook. Are there any cases where the modifier is put after the modified noun? You yourself wrote "The dictionary explains that the modifier precedes what is being modified.", no?"

That's right. I was under the impression that とき wasn't a noun here. In any case, a "time of doing activities in space" but it's not worded the way I would want it to. Not written to my liking.

日本は、２０２５年度ごろまでに「宇宙ごみ」の中の大きな物を片づけることができるようにしたいと考えています。
"Japan thinks that by around the financial year of 2025, it wants it to be possible to clean up the big objects among the space debris."
That would be my updated translation.

Gotcha regarding your last paragraph. I understand your idea. I left the color coded words activated in the article. So his name is Hikihara. The ambassador Hikihara.
 
Zizka said:
If I understand this correctly, it means that とき and 時 can have different meanings
Click to expand...
とき has all the meanings that 時 has, but 時 does not have all of the meanings that とき has.

That remark means that the definition does not apply to 秋 or 刻、which jisho lists 'other forms'. These are obscure usages though in modern Japanese, and if they were to be used for とき in modern Japanese, furigana would probably be provided. I believe I've seen 刻 once as とき、 in a web novel and with the reading given. (Web novels have a tendency to use lots of obscure kanji).

Zizka said:
"time of doing activities in space"
Click to expand...
That's pretty much exactly what it means, but because it sounds awkward, we would usually translate it as 'when doing activities in space'.

I mean, there are times when ～時 translates better as 'time(s) of ~' or '~ time(s)', it's considerably less likely, but it is the natural translation about as often as it's natural to use those grammars in preference to 'when' for much the same meaning.

Zizka said:
So his name is Hikihara. The ambassador Hikihara.
Click to expand...
Exactly!

Extremely close, but you lost the meaning of ようにする.
 
日本は、２０２５年度ごろまでに「宇宙ごみ」の中の大きな物を片づけることができるようにしたいと考えています。
"Japan thinks that by around the financial year of 2025, it wants it to be possible to bring about the clean up the big objects among the space debris."

I think that's it now.
Is there anything else I've left out that I should've translated before moving on to a new article?
 
Something I've been wanting to do was revisit the link provided about the な-adjectives.

"Not really. Na-adjectives usually can't be used as nouns. The difference in usage is one of the keys to recognize which is which in Japanese grammar. For instance, 静か, which is the stem of a typical na-adjective 静かだ, CAN'T be a noun. We can't make a natural sentence using 静か as a subject or object, i.e., we can't say 静かがある, 静かを探す. We have to say 静かさがある, 静かさを探す instead, with using the noun form of adjectives. We can't use 静かの. 静かに acts only as an adverb "calmly/quietly/softly", etc, etc."

So:
Generally speaking な adjectives are not used as nouns. 静か (quiet) can't be used as a noun. If we want to use it as a noun, we need to use 静かさ which is the same thing as in 高いさ for example. 静かに is possible but it's an adverb because of the に particle.
 

This is not quite right.

～ようにする is 'to (try to) make ~ happen'. This whole modifying clause 「宇宙ごみ」の中の大きな物を片づけることができる is what describes ようにする,
and so describes what they "want to bring about".

Zizka said:
Generally speaking な adjectives are not used as nouns.
Click to expand...
I don't think I would say that. Many な adjectives are regular nouns, e.g., 密（な）

Specific な adjectives like 静か cannot be used as regular nouns. Many of these な-adjectives that cannot be used as regular nouns are common words, but there are probably at least as many な-adjectives that can be used as regular nouns, but they are individually less common then everyday staples like 静か and きれい.

Zizka said:
If we want to use it as a noun, we need to use 静かさ which is the same thing as in 高いさ for example.
Click to expand...
For those specific な-adjectives that can't be directly used as nouns, yes. い-adjectives however drop the final い when taking さ、e.g. 高さ.

Zizka said:
静かに is possible but it's an adverb because of the に particle.
Click to expand...
Yes. All な-adjectives are transformed into adverbs this way, whether or not they can be used as regular nouns.
 
Last edited:
SomeCallMeChris said:
Many な adjectives are regular nouns, e.g., 密（な）
Click to expand...
I can't say which is majority, but 密 can't be used as a noun. We can't make a natural sentence using 密が or 密を, the attributive form is only 密な, not 密の, and 密に is only used adverbially.

SomeCallMeChris said:
All な-adjectives are transformed into adverbs this way, whether or not they can be used as regular nouns.
Click to expand...
And "stem + に" can have another usage "noun + particle に" other than the adverbial one when the stem can be a noun, as I explained in the same post.

〇健康に暮らす: to live healthy
〇静かに暮らす: to live quietly/calmly

〇健康にいい: to be good for health
〇体にいい: to be good for body
×静かにいい ("To be good quietly/calmly" doesn't make sense.)
 
Toritoribe said:
I can't say which is majority, but 密 can't be use as a noun.
Click to expand...
Hmm, I just saw it tagged as a noun in JMdict, but I suppose you're right.

I originally was going to say 秘密, but that's usually used with の rather than な (although JMdict says it is a な adjective also).

Let's say then, 自由 as an example of a regular noun that is a な adjective. I took that straight from your chart so it should be correct.

Edit: Other dictionaries show 密 as a noun too, but don't give examples. I suspect they mean it can be a noun when it's a contraction of 秘密 as opposed to when it means 'thick/dense'. Does that seem right?
 
Last edited:
I'll get started on a new article tomorrow unless there's still something to be addressed.
 
SomeCallMeChris said:
Edit: Other dictionaries show 密 as a noun too, but don't give examples. I suspect they mean it can be a noun when it's a contraction of 秘密 as opposed to when it means 'thick/dense'. Does that seem right?
Click to expand...
Please refer to the following threads. Unfortunately, the definition in dictionaries is not so useful for this matter, as I wrote there.

How to determine when to use "noun の" instead of an adjective?

The examples in the groups below seem to mean the same thing. So how to choose what to use? Where there is an adjective of the same word, why don't we use it? In terms of の, lots of names or proper nouns omit it and simply concatenate the nouns together or adjective and noun together. I...
jref.com

元気じゃありません

A textbook says that the captioned sentence is the negative of the na-adjective 元気な. while the negative of the noun is 元気がありません. Isn't 元気じゃありません also the negative of the noun 元気 too since the syntaxes of the negative to nouns and to na-adjectives are identical? How does one choose which to say...
jref.com
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

J
English -> Romaji translator...
2
Replies
26
Views
302K
haibuihoang
K
How do you say "I love you" in Japanese?
2
Replies
46
Views
491K
Grandpa Frank
Let's play a Shiritori Game - Japanese word game
78 79 80
Replies
2K
Views
305K
thomas
B
How to say "my love" in Japanese
Replies
19
Views
203K
Toritoribe
  • Sticky
How to Type Japanese
4 5 6
Replies
132
Views
107K
Buntaro
Menu
Log in
Register
Cookies are required to use this site. You must accept them to continue using the site. Learn more…