Japan Bashing

[Dogen Z]

Now, I'm not particularly fond of the guy, I think he carries a huge chip on his shoulder, but I signed petitions for him.

Isn't he the guy that deliberately goes way out of his way to look for trouble in order to gain notoriety and profit? That is a guaranteed way to be very unpopular with the Japanese community.

He must be as unwelcome as swine flu in his neighborhood. Yet he persists due perhaps to some kind of character defect.

 

[Numark]

People can say anything they want about any person, place or thing they want... They just might be showing their own ignorance and bigotry in the process.

 

[gaijinalways]

It is a little tough in Japan, but it cuts both ways. I often get the "but you have people who discriminate in the US, right" to justify Japanese discriminating againist the foreign whomever because of their appearance, food, etc.

As to Korea, my Japanese wife and I love going there, and we probably plan to return there many times more. We often fly through Seoul as it's a cheaper gateway to Europe, and I always enjoy eating Korean and just seeing different things there (especially now as it's dirt cheap).

As to history, hard to change that. When people try to bury it and lie about it, that's different. When they distort it, which is easy to do when it's an emotional issue like with your family being killed, you can't say too much. Then again, some of my students think that Green Peace and Sea Shepard are terrorists, so I've learned to realize that sometimes people just don't see eye to eye.

 

[Glenski]

Isn't he the guy that deliberately goes way out of his way to look for trouble in order to gain notoriety and profit?

He's not in it for notoriety. That's a totally negative term anyway. He wants to right wrongs, and one way to get noticed is to be loud and in one's face. He's good at that.

Profit? Well, who can say? He has only published a very few items for money. What other moolah do you think he makes with his activism? Certainly not thousands of dollars on the lecture circuit.

 

[Dogen Z]

Bwahahaha! Okay, keeping telling yourself that.

 

[caster51]

Japan Bashing ?

it is as same as 出る杭...as country version under their value

 

[caster51]

this video is very interesting..
The Zainich Korean interviewed a former Zinich Korean who lived in Sakhalin at prewar days and is living in Russia now..
I am very impressed. because they told it without some propaganda or brainwashing by someone..
I think it might be their honest frames of mind about Japan at that time
it starts 2:50


some Korean who naturalized to a Russian ask to a zainichi korean".
Why you do not naturalize to Japanese....
she said, "there is a history matter...."
I think she wanted to hear how the Japanese treated the korean bad

 

[Lledargo]

everyone has their faults, and in turn, every country has its faults, so constructive criticism, and satire is ok. Just saying something sucks is rude

 

[ryuurui]

everyone has their faults, and in turn, every country has its faults, so constructive criticism, and satire is ok. Just saying something sucks is rude

The problem with Japan and unavoidable criticism whether it is constructive or not is not an issue. How can it be constructive, is my question. They do not change, wont change and never changed. In my opinion this country does not evolve. Look at the way the political campaigns are being held - same way they have been shown by the yankees in 50s. Educational system, or rather duck feeding? Have you guys seen how Japanese tourists visit places in Europe? There was this joke once: How was your stay in Paris. I dunno, I have not developed my pics yet. Old people have got no clue what to do with themselves as they have got no job to go to for 18h a day. What kind of constructive feedback are you guys expecting from ppl that cant think constructively.

The matter of the fact is that we are such an insignificant percentage of the population (and by "we" i mean westerners and possibly southern Asians) that we virtually don't exist. For past 10 years of my life in Japan i was asking myself one question. Why the f... are they so anal? Well they like it, apparently, all the karoshi culture and tiny flats, tuna fish size cars and JR trains packed with indifferent mute stressed androids. We are the psychological thorn in the foot. For them, still, world evolves around Japan. They are happy in their cocoon, and do not want to explore. Sad for us, 安全第一 for them.

I am aware of the fact that there are Japanese that are different, but they usually emigrate.

So, now I hav moved from bitching to laying down on a recliner with bag of pop corn and a coke, and I am enjoying the circus freak on planet Japan.

I have heard once a very interesting statement some time ago, "Japan is a lovely country, shame about the people". Ironically, if they were not anal and manual driven protocol droids, we would not have Japan as it is. Safe, clean and organised (perhaps at times too organised). On the other hand it still pisses me off that i cannot BBQ on the beach because its dangerous for the sand.

Criticism is good only then when it's effective. In Japan, 2 bombs were needed to wake them up. How the hell will our criticism change anything, maybe aside of helping us staying sane?

 

[Astroboy]

Criticism is good only then when it's effective. In Japan, 2 bombs were needed to wake them up. How the hell will our criticism change anything, maybe aside of helping us staying sane?

Are you telling ....

1. Your criticism is right.
2. Japan must adopt your criticism for change to your thought.
3. Otherwise, two bombs will be needed again.

I suggest you better to move to a different planet or China/Korea.

 

[Nuala]

Criticism is good only then when it's effective. In Japan, 2 bombs were needed to wake them up. How the hell will our criticism change anything, maybe aside of helping us staying sane?

What are you doing in Japan if you feel this way, ryuurui?

 

[ryuurui]

Why would I move? Japan is a lovely country with many great people. besides I have found here what I really want to in life. There are few things that piss me off, but no place is perfect. I just refuse to give in.

I don't really care if my criticism is right or wrong. It is what i see and feel. I don't ask anyone to agree with it. I am simply spitting out a bit of tension on a forum called "Japan Bashing". That's all.

I know Japanese people less Japanized than you guys lol. You should hear them bitching on their own kind. Everyone is doing it. I complain all the time. If you don't complain and get excited you are either dead or boring.

Japan won't adopt to anything. Only things they have adopted have not changed in 50 years. I guess they lack creativity. I can see it every flipping day at work. Takes them 10 days what we do in 1. Sorry if you don't agree but it's my own experience. Which on other hand can be priceless in disciplines that require patience and endurance. There is always a bad and good side of a coin, merits and demerits.

I don't think bomb will change it. I guess a bit of opening to the world would do.

 

[Perm]

The matter of the fact is that we are such an insignificant percentage of the population (and by "we" i mean westerners and possibly southern Asians) that we virtually don't exist. For past 10 years of my life in Japan i was asking myself one question. Why the f... are they so anal? Well they like it, apparently, all the karoshi culture and tiny flats, tuna fish size cars and JR trains packed with indifferent mute stressed androids. We are the psychological thorn in the foot. For them, still, world evolves around Japan. They are happy in their cocoon, and do not want to explore. Sad for us, ﾋ??窶牢窶佚ｦﾋ?ｪ for them.

I am aware of the fact that there are Japanese that are different, but they usually emigrate.

ryuurui,

Your views are absolutely ridiculous. But I'm assuming you have similar gripes about most countries/people though since despite all these remarks you are still calling Japan your home. Otherwise why would you stay for so long? Why have you and your fellow Japanese misfits not also emigrated?

 

[ryuurui]

ryuurui,
Your views are absolutely ridiculous. But I'm assuming you have similar gripes about most countries/people though since despite all these remarks you are still calling Japan your home. Otherwise why would you stay for so long? Why have you and your fellow Japanese misfits not also emigrated?

Not sure why ridiculous. In Japan there are two levels on which you can live. One: engage in the madness. Two: do your thing and enjoy what's good. I can't get along with the people as simply they are unreachable. They sniff talk and eat work 24/7, with few exceptions.
And country is great, safe, good food, clean and organized. Do I have to embrace the whole joint to enjoy the part of it?

you guys are forgetting one thing. One needs to live and work here, start from 0 to actually be able to express opinion about the place. I have spent here 1/3rd of my life. I would never comment on something I have not got a clue about.

There are many bad and good things people slap on various countries. Since I have not experienced them for me they are only rumors or opinions. What I am talking about here are facts, not other person's views, but what I have actually gone through. Be it bad or good.

It's like with vacations at the sea side. Good: lots of sun and half naked chicks, bad: salty water and sharks. Does it mean one cannoit enjoy his life near the sea, or does it make him ridiculous to say,"I hate sharks but i love swimming in the sea."

 

[Pachipro]

When I lived in Japan, I spent half my life there so I know, what ryuurui, among others, is talking about. It's just how they present themselves that confuse others and make them say, "Then why don't you just leave?"

Once the novelty of Japan wears off, the frustration begins to set in and one develops a love/hate relationship with the country and people. After a while you begin to ignore, and then accept, the things that frustrate you because you can never hope to effect change, and you enjoy the parts that make living there unique and enjoyable. So you stay because the positive far outweighs the negative and you accept it.

Yes, one can feel as ryuurui does and still enjoy living there. I did, as well as more than a few other members presently living there and on this board. One can make a compromise and have an enjoyable life in Japan as long as you KNOW you can never change it and that the Japanese will change at their own pace no matter how much we may disagree with it. After all, it's not our country and we are not Japanese. We may offer our opinion, but it doesn't mean they have to accept it and one should learn to live with that.

There are more than a few things I don't like about where I am presently living here in Tennessee and I do b*tch about it, but it is still enjoyable to an extent and I have stayed here for 20 years because of it just as I did when in Japan. If the negatives outweighed the positives I would have left. The same probably holds true for anyone living anywhere as I don't believe anyone enjoys where they are living 100% and has something to complain about. One must vent frustration now and then to remain sane.

The dangerous part comes when a person truly despises the people and place where they are living, but only stay because they are afraid to make a change or have lived there too long and feel they are too old to make a change, or they stay just for the money. They live miserable lives, forever frustrated, and never fail to let anyone, who will lend an ear, know just how they feel. These people I used to just ignore when I lived in Japan as they are to be pitied more for their fear of making a change for their own betterment. Instead they just bemoan how much they hate their life, Japan, the people, the customs, the food, the housing, etc. without ever really attempting to seriously study the language, culture and people.

 

[ryuurui]

When I lived in Japan, I spent half my life there so I know, what ryuurui, among others, is talking about. It's just how they present themselves that confuse others and make them say, "Then why don't you just leave?"
Once the novelty of Japan wears off, the frustration begins to set in and one develops a love/hate relationship with the country and people. After a while you begin to ignore, and then accept, the things that frustrate you because you can never hope to effect change, and you enjoy the parts that make living there unique and enjoyable. So you stay because the positive far outweighs the negative and you accept it.
Yes, one can feel as ryuurui does and still enjoy living there. I did, as well as more than a few other members presently living there and on this board. One can make a compromise and have an enjoyable life in Japan as long as you KNOW you can never change it and that the Japanese will change at their own pace no matter how much we may disagree with it. After all, it's not our country and we are not Japanese. We may offer our opinion, but it doesn't mean they have to accept it and one should learn to live with that.
There are more than a few things I don't like about where I am presently living here in Tennessee and I do b*tch about it, but it is still enjoyable to an extent and I have stayed here for 20 years because of it just as I did when in Japan. If the negatives outweighed the positives I would have left. The same probably holds true for anyone living anywhere as I don't believe anyone enjoys where they are living 100% and has something to complain about. One must vent frustration now and then to remain sane.
The dangerous part comes when a person truly despises the people and place where they are living, but only stay because they are afraid to make a change or have lived there too long and feel they are too old to make a change, or they stay just for the money. They live miserable lives, forever frustrated, and never fail to let anyone, who will lend an ear, know just how they feel. These people I used to just ignore when I lived in Japan as they are to be pitied more for their fear of making a change for their own betterment. Instead they just bemoan how much they hate their life, Japan, the people, the customs, the food, the housing, etc. without ever really attempting to seriously study the language, culture and people.

Can I have your babies, please? THANK YOU, that is precisely what I am trying to say. One cannot understand it if stays in Japan for too short or never has been here. I am focusing on studying what i truly love - calligraphy and the languages. If they want to kill themselves because of work or retarded "I have to follow the manual/beep" self-destructive ideals - I could not care less.

 

[Perm]

Alright I'm starting to see things from your perspective a little better now. But still, don't all societies have several layers and sub-cultures? If someone came to my hometown - Portland, Oregon, they might come to some conclusions right away about everyone here being a bunch of trendy, coffee-loving and organic food eating hipsters who are nutty for bicycles. And that is true for a large amount of the people here. But it's also very easy to find someone who fits into another sub-culture. I realize that there may be more other sub-cultures here simply due to the fact that there is much more racial diversity that exists here than there is in Japan but I still find it hard to believe that everyone acts like a robot. especially with all the wacky things that come out of their media.
But I do admit that I don't know much about Japan because I've never actually been there. The only reason I'm on this site is because I may study abroad there. And I take back my earlier comment. Reading it back to myself I realized that it comes off a little harsh.

 

[Dogen Z]

I can't stand the westerners who come here and can't lose their western biases, conceit, and arrogance, then proceed to make pronouncements based on limited, fragmented knowledge of Japan, which are supplemented with grossly erroneous assumptions. A lot of them are racist. They've been coming here for over a 100 years and the Japanese are kind of used to them and ignore them.

But they should remember: There are no happy endings in life, so you should at least live where you're comfortable.

 

[Chidoriashi]

I can't stand the westerners who come here and can't lose their western biases, conceit, and arrogance, then proceed to make pronouncements based on limited, fragmented knowledge of Japan, which are supplemented with grossly erroneous assumptions. A lot of them are racist. They've been coming here for over a 100 years and the Japanese are kind of used to them and ignore them.
But they should remember: There are no happy endings in life, so you should at least live where you're comfortable.

Part of the reason they cannot lose their biased is because I imagine many of them are not here long enough.. 1 maybe 2 years (enough time to discover the things/issues they don't like, but not enough time to get over them, or to gain a full understanding of them). ...and some people just like to b*tch and will find fault with anything.

I recall many more things seemed to get on my nerves in my early years here, but not so much anymore, either because I got over it or my perspective changed through experience.

 

[Perm]

I don't think that these issues are unique to westerners going to Japan though. That kind of stuff can happen no matter where you're from or where you're traveling. Even if your intentions are good you can still come off ignorant or stupid. Making blanket statements about the "anal" Japanese or the "biased" westerners isn't really helpful.

 

[ryuurui]

Part of the reason they cannot lose their biased is because I imagine many of them are not here long enough.. 1 maybe 2 years (enough time to discover the things/issues they don't like, but not enough time to get over them, or to gain a full understanding of them). ...and some people just like to b*tch and will find fault with anything.
I recall many more things seemed to get on my nerves in my early years here, but not so much anymore, either because I got over it or my perspective changed through experience.

Exactly.

As to the wacky stuff on TV. Well, this is all explainable. Look at UK, Liverpool and Glasgow football fans were so aggressive that got banned from attending any matches outside UK. Why? The harsh and rigid school system, beatings as penalty etc effected in a outburst of accumulated for generations anger. Tell a kid "you cannot get any of those candies" and surely enough they will be gone after you come back from work.

I saw a program once, where a person that has not answered a question correctly was being moved face up into another guy's naked ***, until it has sunk in it nose into the *** hole. I am all up for crazy stuff, but things like this make me wonder, what is really bothering those people. If there is need for such entertainment, there must be a good cause for it.

Not everyone has to be a robot, but it's under influence of negative stimulants every day. Ride a subway in Tokyo with your eyes wide open. You can smell stress, aloofness, and lack of basic social interactions. They are permanently in a mental cage, tied by strict social conduct that needs to be followed. See them at work. Decisions made in groups, and if you ask one to make a decision, his CPU will fry.

One thing was underlined that other nationalities have different issues. Of course they do. But this is a forum about Japan, so I guessed that is what we should talk about.

 

[Vapor]

I remember when I first came to Japan 5 years ago i would always hear Gaijin but now it seems the country has a different outlook and a certain political correctness. now when certain groups of people are talking about me they say gaikokujin.

 

[jonway]

If you must criticize,

Praise first, then criticize.
After criticizing, suggest for improvement.

Otherwise, what you say doesnt matter. Then dont say it!

 

[ewww]

If you must criticize,

Prolly, You should give strict definition of 'must' here, what could be very hard thou, especially if we will take into account that human being perception depens on the level of stress: more criticism - more stress - less perception.

Praise first, then criticize.
After criticizing, suggestions for improvement.

O0uch, that is a pattern: Japan is very good country (praise). でも earthquakes そしてtsunamis are the most disgusting thing here (criticizin'). We should prohibit them on both levels legislative and executive (suggestion)

Otherwise, what you say doesn't matter. Then don't say it!

He-he, I think that criticism is very useless and it is better to avoid it in any way unless You are not an office worker, who is trying to intrigue coworkers to reach a higher rank. I mean, most of the life situations could be solved without any criticism, and criticism will only complicate things in most cases, cuz any point causes a counterpoint as soon as far.

As any human action, criticism has motivation, and ... it is quite good practice to reveal motivation which makes You critical. That is very good exercise, because, probably, in most cases You will be able to reconsider Your position and avoid useless confrontation.
just 2C

 

[serradag]

The other thread title that is mentioned (why a country sucks so much) is already irritating and unacceptable. Country is word that is to be respected, whichever place it is referred to. If you are a foreigner, you should leave critism to the ones who feels the most of that culture in the first place. You of course have your own opinions, preferances, likes and dislikes due to your past experiences, however you might not be capable of fully understand that detail while you are about to "jump into conclusions". Time would tell you about seeing, reading, learning about that place as a whole; its successes and faults during its history, present and future.