Are Japanese People Too Polite To Be Your Friends?

[KirinMan]

There may be many types of friends from casual to intimate, but at least someone who does not show you a fake smile on a regular basis.

True there are many levels of friends that's for sure, but fake smiles on a regular basis isnt just limited to Japanese people either.

I know plenty of American's that are very much the same.

You know I find it rather curious that people particularly from America complain about Japanese and friendship, where in America where I am from btw, I was taught from a very young age that a person should consider themselves very lucky if they have one or two "true" friends in their lifetime.

I wonder if that perception has changed so much that everyone "expects" everyone that they meet to be their friends.

Just because Japanese people by nature are not as open or free in sharing their thoughts and feelings with others doesn't mean that they are not friends. I personally dont like the assumption that for a person to be considered a friend that I or they have to be all open and sharing with their lifes little secrets.

Hell I really dont care if my "best friend" doesn't choose to share with me the fact that they have fantasies of making out with a sheep. And I also dont care if my Japanese friends dont want to tell me what they "honestly" think about me either. I am secure enough in knowing who and what I am that I dont "need" all that emotional sharing and openess that many westerners seem to need in their friendships.

I know plenty of Japanese that call all of their school mates and people that they work with "friends", where I would just consider them aquaintances. Which goes back to the point of different levels of friendship.

 

[caster51]

but at least someone who does not show you a fake smile on a regular basis

so,you misunderstood about that for 49 years?
that is why....

 

[Ashikaga]

Good questions. The places I am comparing with are the Philippines, India, and California in the United States.
Definition of friends? There may be many types of friends from casual to intimate, but at least someone who does not show you a fake smile on a regular basis.

I think what you are saying is that you can see through the "fakeness" of the smiles on Japanese people becuase you have spent 49 years of your life in Japan. OK. The question is, though, how can you say that you can do the same with people from other countries and California in the US? Do you think you have spent enough time observing and interacting with the people from different countries and California in the US to make a fair comparison with the Japanese?

My best friend is my husband, who is also a Japanese. He is OK. My second best friend is a Japanese housewife, who recently developed bipolar disorder and now she is on medication.

Why am I beginning to think that you are not really what you are telling us you are.... If that is the case, Shame On Me for replying. My apologies in advance if that is not the case and you just added that little piece of info on your second best friend for who-knows-what. It's just that my BS detecter is set rather high when I am on a forum like this.

 

[alantin]

@KirinMan

It was interesting reading your post because I was starting to think that americans in general seem to expect all people they meet to instantly become their friends. (Friend here meaning in a quite deep way.)

It is also interesting to see that people do have quite different definitions for the word "friend", although I thought so from the beginning of the thread.

I also think that a friend is someone very special and rare.
Perhaps not only one or two people in a lifetime though.. Or then again.. Maybe that is quite right.

Also the linguistics is interesting here. In English I might say "a friend of mine" meaning any aquaintenance but there is only perhaps one or two people that I might call that in my own language.

Others are pals or aquaintenances.

I wonder how the japanese actually feel about the words 友達 and 仲間.
And if there is a third word meaning a deeper relationship.


Ps. It was interesting to note that Finland was only three steps below Japan in that list a while ago. Though I knew it was on a quite high place.

 

[KirinMan]

alantin, good post there.

What I am trying to get people to think about is what they think a friend should be and then to hopefully realize that for each person it is different and to generalize about an entire nation of people is probably off the mark.

Each person and situation is different. Just because Japanese people are polite on the surface doesnt mean that they are cold and heartless either. They just show their emotions in different ways.

Doesnt make it any better nor any worse either, it's just their way, and it is a way that I try to copy at times, but I just cant seem to get the hang of smiling and being polite to someone who has been a royal *** to me.

My face gives me away.

 

[FrustratedDave]

I wonder how the Japanese actually feel about the words 友達 and 仲間
And if there is a third word meaning a deeper relationship.

親友、 Best friend
友人、 Friend
友達、 friend
仲間、 part of a group, co-worker
知り合い、acquaintance
知人、 acquaintance
顔見知り、、Someone I know.

That is in order of friendship meaningfulness if you know what I mean?

 

[alantin]

Thanks!
A good and helpful list!




@KirinMan
Being overly polite with a completely expressionless face (or with a smile) to a "royal ***" can be more effective (and insulting if you wish it to be!) than shouting at him.
It's all about articulation and the way it's delivered. ^^
It is another thing if they get it, though..

But this is getting a bit off-topic.. Sorry!

 

[Megumi Kimoto]

Well....my husband can be "too" nice and polite. It can get on my nerves very quickly. I just tell him to "spit it out", just say what you are really thinking....he tends to try and avoid any real conflict or arguments, but I question as to whether that truly makes him happy. He is too nice to too many people, and it seems to me he allows himself to be take advantage of. So yes, I do think Japanese can be too polite. Do I think the nation s full of polite, nice people...nope, some of the rudest things have been said and done to me in Japan. Overall though, it's a cool country.....

Thank you Goldiegirl, for explaining the situation so clearly. That is my point.

 

[pipokun]

...
Definition of friends? There may be many types of friends from casual to intimate, but at least someone who does not show you a fake smile on a regular basis.

It seems to me that you finally got the answer by yourself.
1. There are many people.
2. And some people show you a fake smile on a regular basis, but the others (like you) do not.
3. So it may be an idea for any of us to try to find as many opportunities as possible to meet many types of people.

If you meet the Indian guy, ask him if he has started something new after he came to Japan. It is easier to play a blame game using adjectives such as real, authentic, superficial politeness, or whatever you say than actually starting something new.

*snip*
4. If possible, please kindly join other threads in which you claim some would find Japan too idealized. I've been trying (lazily) to find ones here since you start this thread, but I have yet to find them. Thank you for your bumping.

 

[Otenba]

It may depend on where you look for friends. A shared interest is always great, and I've had lots of long conversations, deep conversations and discussions with people I met at Manji Line parties and we do stay in touch. I also think it depends on how you approach them (most approached me rather than vice-versa though). Speaking English and being "rude" (or at least not adapting to their manners and gestures) is always a minus I think.
I was also told by several Japanese that they make a difference between eg. Europeans and Americans and while they act nice to Americans, they honestly do appreciate Europeans. Maybe that's because Europe hasn't dropped nuclear bombs and junk food on them.

 

[Ashikaga]

I was also told by several Japanese that they make a difference between eg. Europeans and Americans and while they act nice to Americans, they honestly do appreciate Europeans. Maybe that's because Europe hasn't dropped nuclear bombs and junk food on them.

Several Japanese people told you that, heh? I think I know all of them. They all go by the name, Figmentof Yourimagination. Not a very Japanese sounding name, I know.... but that IS their name.

Voicing your opinions is fine but putting the blame on Japanese people for a silly comment like that is wrong. Next time you do something like that, try "a Japanese friend of mine told me that...." or " I have read somewhere that....". Several Japanese told you....

 

[Davey]

Interesting thread with a lot of good replies!!

親友、 Best friend
友人、 Friend
友達、 friend
仲間、 part of a group, co-worker
知り合い、acquaintance
知人、 acquaintance
顔見知り、、Someone I know.

Nice list FrustratedDave, but can you please put some hiragana/ roman letters with it as well?

 

[Kirakira1232]

親友、 Best friend
友人、 Freind
友達、 friend
仲間、 part of a group, co-worker
知り合い、aquaintenance
知人、 aquaintenance
顔見知り、、Someone I know.
That is in order of friendship meaningfullness , if you know what I mean?

Interesting thread with a lot of good replies!!
Nice list FrustratedDave, but can you please put some hiragana/ roman letters with it as well?

In the order of FrustratedDave's list:

Shinyuu （しんゆう） 親友
yuujin (ゆうじん） 友人
tomodachi （ともだち） 友達
nakama （なかま） 仲間
shiriai （しりあい） 知り合い
chijin （ちじん） 知人
kaomishiri （かおみしり） 顔見知り

 

[Otenba]

Several Japanese people told you that, heh? I think I know all of them. They all go by the name, Figmentof Yourimagination. Not a very Japanese sounding name, I know.... but that IS their name.
Voicing your opinions is fine but putting the blame on Japanese people for a silly comment like that is wrong. Next time you do something like that, try "a Japanese friend of mine told me that...." or " I have read somewhere that....". Several Japanese told you....

This isn't the first time you insult me by doubting the truth of my words (and personally, I find it little exciting to post lies as a base of discussion).
Where did I put any blame on anyone? It is a fact that several Japanese people that I met, told me that the Japanese prefer Europeans to Americans.

 

[epigene]

This isn't the first time you insult me by doubting the truth of my words (and personally, I find it little exciting to post lies as a base of discussion).
Where did I put any blame on anyone? It is a fact that several Japanese people that I met, told me that the Japanese prefer Europeans to Americans.

Hasn't it occurred to you that these Japanese had been trying to be nice to you?

They may in fact like Europeans more than Americans, but they don't represent the entire Japanese population.

My personal experience with Westerners had been mostly with Americans, and many I like and some I don't like. With Europeans, I can't tell because I don't know that many.
Their comments probably come from limited personal experiences, in their case coming from knowing some "nice" Europeans and having little experience of getting to know Americans.

 

[Otenba]

It had indeed ocurred to me, but if I were to question every word someone says to me in the flow of a rather frank conversation that lasts hours, I'd have to lock myself up and cut the ties to all human contact because OMG, everyone's a liar. I rather believe what is credible. The Japanese wouldn't be the first to differentiate between Americans and Europeans based on experience and behavioral differences...
I never said my few acquaintances represent all of Japan's population, mind you.

 

[Megumi Kimoto]

I appreciate comments made to share one's own first-hand experience in non-business interaction with Japanese people, sharing one's own preference about friendship, and sharing one's own realistic expectation of friendship with culturally different people.
On the other hand, I am beginning to see signs of some of the Forum Rules being violated, which are:
1. MUTUAL RESPECT
a. … Avoid flaming and other offensive or profane behavior. Don't launch personal attacksﾂ….
b. If you feel a discussion is getting out of hand contact the forum administrator or a moderator, by using the report button, in order to resolve the issue.
3. KEEP YOUR POSTS (FAMILY-) FRIENDLY
4. STAY ON TOPIC
Can anyone tell me where the "report button" is to stop certain individuals from flaming?

 

[pipokun]

You can find the report icon, though I did not use it.

Or just use the section below.
Site Feedback/Admin Contact

 

[FrustratedDave]

It had indeed occurred to me, but if I were to question every word someone says to me in the flow of a rather frank conversation that lasts hours, I'd have to lock myself up and cut the ties to all human contact because OMG, everyone's a liar. I rather believe what is credible. The Japanese wouldn't be the first to differentiate between Americans and Europeans based on experience and behavioral differences...
I never said my few acquaintances represent all of Japan's population, mind you.

No, but it would be advisable to understand that they may just be saying that to make you feel like they really want to be friends with you. And if you believed what most people say I would say try not to be so gullible.

I appreciate comments made to share one's own first-hand experience in non-business interaction with Japanese people, sharing one's own preference about friendship, and sharing one's own realistic expectation of friendship with culturally different people.
On the other hand, I am beginning to see signs of some of the Forum Rules being violated, which are:
1. MUTUAL RESPECT
a. … Avoid flaming and other offensive or profane behavior. Don't launch personal attacks….
b. If you feel a discussion is getting out of hand contact the forum administrator or a moderator, by using the report button, in order to resolve the issue.
3. KEEP YOUR POSTS (FAMILY-) FRIENDLY
4. STAY ON TOPIC
Can anyone tell me where the "report button" is to stop certain individuals from flaming?

Hmm... Another Mael perhaps?

 

[Otenba]

Ofcourse. But then again, by putting down Americans by even calling them names (Monads, lol!), I don't feel so much more welcome as a European. I don't care about being accepted for my origins anyways, but ofcourse they don't know that.

No, I don't believe what most people say, but after a history of backstabs and stuff, I've learned to see through some things. I'm not really gullible, but in cases where blindly believing in the good sides is harmless, it can't be wrong to do so, right?
Btw, dishonest politeness isn't exclusive to the Japanese. "That movie sucked!" - "I'm the director." - "I... I mean, I liked the story and the visuals..."...

Also, not only Japanese first encounters tend to be spiked with little lies in order to please the other. The important thing is what grows from that first encounter and how honest it becomes from there on.

Btw, I'd rather be gullible than lonely.

 

[FrustratedDave]

Btw, I'd rather be gullible than lonely.

All a matter of perspective I think...

 

[Otenba]

Yup, and my perspective is to try and stay positive. Makes enjoying life easier.

 

[FrustratedDave]

Yup, and my perspective is to try and stay positive. Makes enjoying life easier.

But it also makes your opinions clouded and unrealistic...

 

[Otenba]

Almost sounds like it's more "realistic" to be negative about encounters with Japanese people and suspect every Japanese person of being a two-tongued bastard who secretly hates you. How very healthy for possible relations.

 

[Megumi Kimoto]

I suspect one out of every 25 people is a double-tongued, double-faced sociopath, as Martha Stout says.
But the rest are honest.