Comfort Women What do you think?

[Halewijn]

Junjunforever means they were unethical because the women were recruited in many cases against their own will.

 

[Masamune_74]

I am not trying to downplay what happened, it happened and it was horrible. However, there are a few things that I would like to voice.
1)Shame on the parents/family members who "sold them"
2)As previously stated this has happened anytime one country invaded another.
3)Why was North Korea left out of the money (or were they, I am not sure)?
4)On January 17, 1993 Prime minister Kiichi Miyazawa presented formal apologies for the suffering of the victims during a trip to South Korea. Was this a formal apology or not?
5)Has anyone here heard this happening with any other countries ie. Russia, Germany, England???

 

[Halewijn]

You know what Shinzo Abe said earlier this, right? Comfort women still don't get true recognition from the Japanese government.

 

[Masamune_74]

so then maybe they should just give them a big GOMENASAI

 

[pipokun]

5)Has anyone here heard this happening with any other countries ie. Russia, Germany, England???

No Russia during the WWII, but there were the military brothels run by many countries.
When the Allied released African nations from the Axis, did they also release women from the brothels?

Halewijn
You know what Shinzo Abe said earlier this, right? Comfort women still don't get true recognition from the Japanese government.

What is the true recognition? Only adovocate groups are claiming like you.

 

[KirinMan]

Only adovocate groups are claiming like you.

Watch out using over generalizations please.

I am pretty sure that Halewijn is not an advocate group, just an individual giving their opinion about this topic.

What is the true recognition?

Mmm I do not think that you really need an answer for that, I think you already know the answer to your own question. Go back and read through this thread and you will find the answer there.

 

[hanbei]

I am angry at the arrogance of the US House of Representatives for blaming Japan on a historic issue irrelevant to US directly.
American should acknowledge their miserable history and the present atrocity in Iraq.

We Japanese blame America for slaughtering good citizens in Hiroshima and Nagasaki with atomic bomb. You American should recognize yourself as the most atrocious rascal in the history. Your criminal deeds were not only the atomic bombings, but also enslavement of African people, blood shedding in Vietnam and Iraq, the discrimination of colored races at the present day in your own country and boosting the cycle of bloodshed with arms export in the whole world.
You American are the pack of hyena which had tore up the resources of Native American.
You American has no eligibility to accuse Japan for comfort women problem in the world war two, which was fabricated by false testimonies.

You American have justified yourself by saying that the atomic bombs were used for sparing the lives of millions people.
Needless to say, your paradoxical excuse was the absolute bullshit added after the ending of the war.
The truth was that the atomic bombings had been conducted mainly for the experimental purpose to assess the destructive capability of the atomic bombs, and the experiment had been conducted on the ground of the racial prejudice. (Richard Rhodes. 1986. The Making of the Atomic Bomb. Simon and Schuster.)

 

[Grandpa Frank]

Hummm??

Guess we know where you studied your history.

Uncle Frank

 

[Calypso Freemo]

It's a stupid subject, you weren't there, you can't comment. If you want to treat people with of the past with dignity, at least give them the dignity of owning and surviving through their own stories with out a bunch soft cocks moralising about their lives on the basis of something they read in a book or a on a web page. People seeking reparation today for so called horrors of the past is all the fashion- it says nothing about the past, it only tells us about the present. Hell, I want to sue the queen of england and all for English atrocities to the Kingdom of Scotland, don't get me started right. People are just too bleedin bored these days, and might i say, too bleedin boring...

 

[Sukotto]

We Japanese blame America for slaughtering good citizens in Hiroshima and Nagasaki with atomic bomb. You American should recognize yourself as the most atrocious rascal in the history. Your criminal deeds were not only the atomic bombings, but also enslavement of African people, blood shedding in Vietnam and Iraq, the discrimination of colored races at the present day in your own country and boosting the cycle of bloodshed with arms export in the whole world.
You American are the pack of hyena which had tore up the resources of Native American.
You American has no eligibility to accuse Japan for comfort women problem in the world war two, which was fabricated by false testimonies.

You American have justified yourself by saying that the atomic bombs were used for sparing the lives of millions people.
Needless to say, your paradoxical excuse was the absolute bullshit added after the ending of the war.
The truth was that the atomic bombings had been conducted mainly for the experimental purpose to assess the destructive capability of the atomic bombs, and the experiment had been conducted on the ground of the racial prejudice. (Richard Rhodes. 1986. The Making of the Atomic Bomb. Simon and Schuster.)

Actually, it was done to intimidate the Soviet Union - perhaps, which of course sucked.

And most of the stuff you mentioned above is done by the ruling class oligarchy that rules, not only the US, but also pretty much the world, via the legal privilege constructs called corporations and also through the World Bank and International Monetary Fund.
It's why even in the US family farmers cannot find their vegetables in the super market, but only corporate agribusiness.


NOT TO HIJACK THE THREAD.
I WON'T RESPOND TO ANY RESPONSES FOR THIS REASON

 

[Calypso Freemo]

Exactly

I agree with you.
I think The problem is the future.
however. it is also the oldest business.
There are million of prostitutes Voluntary in the world .
What should we distinguish?

If you all want to ***** about it, why not ***** about capitalism which inadvertantly channels millions of woman and children into sex work. Or current forms of social grouping which inadvertantly makes woman and children vunerable to be exploited sexually, or the moralistic civilised society bulshit of modern thinking which gives the whole sex industry the legs it needs to stand on...hell there's plenty to ***** about, why ***** about this?

 

[Sukotto]

It's a stupid subject, you weren't there, you can't comment. If you want to treat people with of the past with dignity, at least give them the dignity of owning and surviving through their own stories with out a bunch soft cocks moralising about their lives on the basis of something they read in a book or a on a web page. People seeking reparation today for so called horrors of the past is all the fashion- it says nothing about the past, it only tells us about the present. Hell, I want to sue the queen of england and all for English atrocities to the Kingdom of Scotland, don't get me started right. People are just too bleedin bored these days, and might i say, too bleedin boring...

But the saying goes,
if we do not learn from the past.....
we are doomed to repeat it.


And, since history is NOT over,
not by a long shot,
we still have much to learn.

If we ignore the past, we may wind up with lots of really bad entertainment brought forth by the powers that be.

 

[Davey]

This is about comfort women, not about the bomings of Nagasaki and hiroshima and neither about America in Iraq... keep it on topic, and keep it nice.

 

[junjunforever]

junjunforever, tell me when you government disclasified the diplomatic documents which clearly states South Korea obtained the money from Japan.
The Kono statement was really stupid. Both parties should have just confirmed what Japan paid. But it showed great consideration to the new democratic county then.
Do you think your govenment is fair without having said it to the public for such a long time?
You don't have to be too emotional. You think the military brothel is unethical, right? Why don't you sue the UN or the US who (has) stationed your country and built up tons of brothels?

this really infuriates me.

u did not even read my post. Like i said THE MONEY IS NOT THE PROBLEM.

Its your (and perhaps the attitude of japanese politicians) attitude that if they pay money, its all solved.

Once you change your history books and correctly apoligizes to all the war criminals, ban the nazist/racist thoughts and fire your nazist politicians, i will, and all those who were raped, guaranty you that no one will care about money.







To Masamune
1)Shame on the parents/family members who "sold them"

There are cases where families sold their daughters, and there are cases japanese soldiiers just raped them and took them away by force. Besides, the reason why they sold them is because japanese stole the land away by force, and caused them into go into a war which china, philippines or korea had no interest in. Why should chinese suffer for japanese bombing of pearl harbor?


2)As previously stated this has happened anytime one country invaded another.
Yes. But in most cases, they actually apologize for it, and teach the history instead of hiding it.


3)Why was North Korea left out of the money (or were they, I am not sure)?
This isnt the issue. U.S. senate doesnt care whether north korea gets money or not. They jsut care about all the casualties of the war.

4)On January 17, 1993 Prime minister Kiichi Miyazawa presented formal apologies for the suffering of the victims during a trip to South Korea. Was this a formal apology or not?
It was a formal apology, but then they are retracting the apology, and like i said, japanese students are not being taught about the war atrocities.


5)Has anyone here heard this happening with any other countries ie. Russia, Germany, England???
The debate here is not what japan has done in the past, but what they are doing in the present to correct the problem. I cant speak for russia, but germany has repented its wrong doings throughly. Japan has refused to ackowledge any wrongdoings.

 

[junjunforever]

I am angry at the arrogance of the US House of Representatives

well, amnesty international doesnt think so. and surely, their opinion is more valued than your or mine. The only difference is that i agree with AI.

Earth Times: show/news_press_release,149080.shtml

 

[Mars Man]

. . . ban the nazist/racist thoughts and fire your nazist politicians,

Please do be careful here with this, junjunforever san. I would suggest that this is far too close to going over the line of argumentation that we'd hope to have here. Thank you for your consideration.

Again, I think just about everything that we all can say about this matter here and now, has been said here on this particular thread. It would be good for those who are coming to it new, to take the time, and go back and read through it all. This thread is primarily for presenting our opinions, and then backing them up to a degree.

 

[KirinMan]

With absolutely no animosity, anger, or ulterior motive in mind I would like to ask our Japanese friends posting on this thread one rather important, in my opinion, question.

What will you accept as evidence?

Simple question, hard answer possibly, probably, I don't know. However I hope that the responses do not have any finger pointing, nor references to other issues, including but not limited to Hiroshima or Nagasaki, the US military using military brothel's or anything not related to this subject.

Only about the Japanese and it's part in the Comfort Women issue please.

 

[junjunforever]

Please do be careful here with this, junjunforever san. I would suggest that this is far too close to going over the line of argumentation that we'd hope to have here. Thank you for your consideration.
Again, I think just about everything that we all can say about this matter here and now, has been said here on this particular thread. It would be good for those who are coming to it new, to take the time, and go back and read through it all. This thread is primarily for presenting our opinions, and then backing them up to a degree.

ok. since you want me to stop draggin this issue, i will try to restrain myself. But here is why i called certain japanese politicians a "nazi"

Ishihara, the governor of Tokyo.

Shintaro Ishihara - Wikipedia

Ishihara stated in a 2001 interview with women's magazine Shukan Josei that he subscribed to a theory that "old women who live after they have lost their reproductive function are useless and are committing a sin," adding that he "couldn't say this as a politician." He was criticized in the Tokyo Metropolitan Assembly for these comments, but responded that the criticism was driven by "tyrant" "old women."[15]

During an inauguration of a university building in 2004, Ishihara stated that French is unqualified as an international language because it is "a language in which nobody can count," referring to the counting system in French, which he believed to be based on units of twenty rather than ten (as is the case in Japanese and English). The statement led to a lawsuit from several language schools in 2005. Ishihara subsequently responded to comments that he did not disrespect French culture by professing his love of French literature on Japanese TV news. [16]

In a highly publicized statement at the Tokyo International Anime Fair on March 25, 2006, he said: "I hate Mickey Mouse. He has nothing like the unique sensibility that Japanese animation has. The Japanese are inherently skilled at visual expression and detailed work."[17][18][19]

On April 9, 2000, in a speech before a Self-Defense Forces group, Ishihara publicly stated that atrocious crimes have been committed again and again by illegally entered sangokujin (Japanese: ﾅｽOﾂ坂?伉人 (third country national); a term commonly viewed as derogatory) and foreigners, and speculated that in the event a natural disaster struck the Tokyo area, they would be likely to cause civil disorder.[13]

On February 20, 2006, Ishihara also said: "Roppongi is now virtually a foreign neighborhood. Africans ﾂ― I don't mean African-Americans ﾂ― who don't speak English are there doing who knows what. This is leading to new forms of crime such as car theft. We should be letting in people who are intelligent."[14]

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I believe he has made enough comments to be qualified as a xenophibic politician at the least, and a "nazi" at the worst.

 

[Mars Man]

Thank you for your reply there junjunforever. I am aware of some of the stuff that Ishihara has said. There are other comments by political figures which fall close or within the same range as his. Nevertheless, it may not be good to use blanket statements that tend to, or are too easily seen as generalizing and thus throwing the whole lot into the same basket.

That, is the point of my concern. Very precise, and specific wording and identification is a different matter.

Thanks again. Talk to you later. MM

 

[Han Chan]

ok. since you want me to stop draggin this issue, i will try to restrain myself. But here is why i called certain japanese politicians a "nazi"
Ishihara, the governor of Tokyo.
Shintaro Ishihara - Wikipedia
Ishihara stated in a 2001 interview with women's magazine Shukan Josei that he subscribed to a theory that "old women who live after they have lost their reproductive function are useless and are committing a sin," adding that he "couldn't say this as a politician." He was criticized in the Tokyo Metropolitan Assembly for these comments, but responded that the criticism was driven by "tyrant" "old women."[15].........On February 20, 2006, Ishihara also said: "Roppongi is now virtually a foreign neighborhood. Africans ― I don't mean African-Americans ― who don't speak English are there doing who knows what. This is leading to new forms of crime such as car theft. We should be letting in people who are intelligent."[14]
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I believe he has made enough comments to be qualified as a xenophibic politician at the least, and a "nazi" at the worst.

I agree that Ishihara is seriously xenophibic and insensitive. However, my biggest surprise is that such a man keep on beeing reelected. The fact that the old useless "dinosaur" politicians keep on beeing reelected have for long for me been an indication that the japanese public were not ready to change their leadership.

However, the recent upper house election result are very encouraging, because so many yonger and female candidates were successfull. May this new generation will also take a different stance towards the WWII past - including Yasukuni and "confort women"?

 

[hanbei]

With absolutely no animosity, anger, or ulterior motive in mind I would like to ask our Japanese friends posting on this thread one rather important, in my opinion, question.
What will you accept as evidence?
Simple question, hard answer possibly, probably, I don't know. However I hope that the responses do not have any finger pointing, nor references to other issues, including but not limited to Hiroshima or Nagasaki, the US military using military brothel's or anything not related to this subject.
Only about the Japanese and it's part in the Comfort Women issue please.

I believe there might be some brothels catered mainly for soldiers, which were common in the world at that time.
Also, I believe that the all testimonies with ex-****** were fabricated stories urged by Japanese left, Chinese and Korean.
There are rumors the ex-****** had stocked up a big savings owing to their testimonies.
Mr. Honda reportedly received a large sum of money from a Chinese group established for anti-Japanese movements in US.

Comfort Women issue has a wide range of background, including political, ethnic and historical hatreds between Japan versus China and Korea.
If you discuss the matter on narrow points of view, you will reach a wrong conclusion.
Hiroshima or Nagasaki, the US military using military brothel's or other US wrong doings should be included in the comfort women matter, because we Japanese think you should not blame others shelving your own wrong doing.

By the way, why are you pursuing the comfort women matter relentlessly?
Are you a Chinese or Korean origin?
If so, I can understand your behavior.

 

[KirinMan]

I guess I should have known better but didnt. Just ask a simple question and get a bunch of red herrings in reply. Not totally unexpected but still disappointing that people can not answer one simple question particularly after this much discussion on this thread.

If you discuss the matter on narrow points of view, you will reach a wrong conclusion.

Really now, since you seem to be so smart here, what conclusion do you think is wrong?

Are you a Chinese or Korean origin?
If so, I can understand your behavior.

Behavior? Writing on a message board isnt behavior....however it shouldnt matter one bit what my roots are. People are people no matter the origins, and that is all that matters to me.

 

[hanbei]

To Obeika:
>what conclusion do you think is wrong?

In your first post, you wrote, "I was amazed at the amount of information, evidence and fact supporting these women's claims against the Japanese Government. "
Your conclusion have based on false stories fabricated by Chinese and Korean. We Japanese know Chinese and Korean do not feel the *****s of conscience to forge "evidence", which may be obvious from recent Chinese poison foods mess.
I believe there was no coercion by Japanese government or Japanese army into becoming a "Comfort Woman."

>People are people no matter the origins, and that is all that matters to me.

Your origin is very important for understanding the dispute.
Generally speaking, Chinese and Korean American inherit the hatred to Japan from their ancestors as if they have a "hatred DNA".

 

[KirinMan]

Your origin is very important for understanding the dispute.
Generally speaking, Chinese and Korean American inherit the hatred to Japan from their ancestors as if they have a ﾂ"hatred DNAﾂ".

You gotta be kidding me me here.

People dont inherit hatred they are taught it, just the same as you were never educated about your country's wartime atrocities, hence your unwillingness to admit any guilt.

Yet fortunately there are many Japanese that do believe and understand.

 

[hanbei]

Yet fortunately there are many Japanese that do believe and understand.

I know Japanese communists and the similar lefts, and some liberal politicians such as Yohei Kouno, who is believed to be a victim of Chinese honey trap, criticize Japanese government on the so-called comfort women and other war crimes of Japanese army.
But, the majority of Japanese people including myself call them ﾂ"the Chinese and Korean puppets.ﾂ"
We know their aim is to sell Japan to the Chinese communist party for their own profits.