- Thread starter
- #26
- Thread starter
- #27
- Thread starter
- #29
Well, the 止 is not so far off, but it will be quite a stroll till I reach 武. 止 is a pictograph of a footprint. 武 is a 会意文字 (止＋戈) , i.e. to grasp a spear and move forward, indicating an advance to attack. But that is a great simplification. On a side note, those two are in the minority of correct etymologies found in Henshall's book. Usually, he is miles off.
I have just completed the article on etymology of the character 休. It was really difficult. Took me few days to finish it.
I have just completed the article on etymology of the character 休. It was really difficult. Took me few days to finish it.
Glenn
一切皆苦
- 8 Jan 2004
- 7,842
- 200
Yeah, I've seen it said that 止 means "stop" and 戈 means "spear" or "fighting", so 武 means "to stop the fighting (by fighting/with force)", which is a load, as you know. It came up because I was thinking of 止 in terms of 歧, which means something like "split off", and is "footsteps" and "branch (off)" (as far as I know).
休 took you a few days? Wow, man. And you're going to go through all of the 常用漢字? 頑張って！
休 took you a few days? Wow, man. And you're going to go through all of the 常用漢字? 頑張って！
- Thread starter
- #31
The etymology is one of many things that i do. I still have to work full time, which is hopefully a terminal disease, study Japanese + Chinese, on top of that I write calligraphy every day. All in all I study anywhere from 5 to 10h a day. He (白川静) uses in his book many shortcuts, abbreviations, kanji that do not exist in the net, etc. To make sure that I cross-checked all data and pierce through his vocabulary, sometimes I need to spread one article on 2-4 days. This book is apparently difficult even for well read calligraphy masters, as no one knows it all. So it's a bit tough sometimes, but fun as hell.
This month was particularly busy, as I was preparing works for the December exhibition, and I was informed that there yet is another exhibition on Dec. to which I should prepare works for. I think I need to shop for time on amazon.co.jp
This month was particularly busy, as I was preparing works for the December exhibition, and I was informed that there yet is another exhibition on Dec. to which I should prepare works for. I think I need to shop for time on amazon.co.jp
Glenn
一切皆苦
- 8 Jan 2004
- 7,842
- 200
That's a lot of studying! So you're using Henshall's book and checking it with 字統? I'm confused as to which book you're reffering to.
P.S. I think terminal disease means something different from the way you intended it....
P.S. I think terminal disease means something different from the way you intended it....
- Thread starter
- #33
I meant "work" to be a person suffering from terminal disease. I use Henshall's book only to see how much English literature is off course. I know this book is popular, but you guys really should treat is with caution. It's terribly superficial and incorrect at times.
For my research, I use few books and dictionaries, but the core is 字統. See, his research was based on the data that was gathered via studies on oracle bone script, which thrown a completely new light on the subject. This is one of many reasons why English literature on kanji etymology is incorrect.
- Thread starter
- #35
This is good stuff. I will have to get myself the 漢字源 in electronic form. How many characters does it list and which publisher is this? I need a bit more rice to be able to digest 説文解字 in Chinese. I am still hunting for a few positions. They are out of print and hard to get, but thankfully a lot of people sell things without realising their true value. Ignorance is such a money saver lol ^_^
Glenn
一切皆苦
- 8 Jan 2004
- 7,842
- 200
漢字源 came with the 電子辞書 I bought 5 years ago when I was in Japan. It has over 13,000 characters. 新漢語林 has around 1000 more than that.
I don't actually have a copy of 説文解字, but sometimes it's quoted in definitions at 重編國語辭典修訂本, and there's also the 中國哲學書電子化計劃 version online, although I haven't used it all that much and it doesn't seem all that intuitive. I could have sworn I found 康煕字典 online somewhere too at some point...
I don't actually have a copy of 説文解字, but sometimes it's quoted in definitions at 重編國語辭典修訂本, and there's also the 中國哲學書電子化計劃 version online, although I haven't used it all that much and it doesn't seem all that intuitive. I could have sworn I found 康煕字典 online somewhere too at some point...
- Thread starter
- #37
Thanks for the links, Glenn. I will have a closer look at those.
Yup, it's the link I showed you earlier on http://www.mojikyo.com/info/kouki/index.html. I still didn't have the time to call them and ask if it works with WIN 7.
As to the 説文解字, all 14 tomes (上下) are online here: 説文解字注データ
This is pretty impressive website. My teacher said he has the JApanese translation of the 説文解字 with comentaries. Book out of print, naturally.I want to buy it or copy it from him and learn while comparing with the original. I may catch few ancient Chinese phrases throughout the process.
I am studying seal script at the moment, from works of 呉大澂 (1835 - 1902)、a famous Chinese scholar who specialized in seal script. On this occasion, my teacher mentioned that he will bring with him few books that are essencial for understanding the kanji origin. If you interested, I can post the titles of the books once I have them. Only recently I bought a unique book from 1978 entitled 呉大澂篆書説文部首, where all radicals are explainedand and written by 呉大澂. The book is in post so I am waiting for it.
Yup, it's the link I showed you earlier on http://www.mojikyo.com/info/kouki/index.html. I still didn't have the time to call them and ask if it works with WIN 7.
As to the 説文解字, all 14 tomes (上下) are online here: 説文解字注データ
This is pretty impressive website. My teacher said he has the JApanese translation of the 説文解字 with comentaries. Book out of print, naturally.I want to buy it or copy it from him and learn while comparing with the original. I may catch few ancient Chinese phrases throughout the process.
I am studying seal script at the moment, from works of 呉大澂 (1835 - 1902)、a famous Chinese scholar who specialized in seal script. On this occasion, my teacher mentioned that he will bring with him few books that are essencial for understanding the kanji origin. If you interested, I can post the titles of the books once I have them. Only recently I bought a unique book from 1978 entitled 呉大澂篆書説文部首, where all radicals are explainedand and written by 呉大澂. The book is in post so I am waiting for it.
Glenn
一切皆苦
- 8 Jan 2004
- 7,842
- 200
I just happened to be looking up a word in the 重編國語辭典修訂本 and came across an example of what I was talking about:
Actually, though, it doesn't give an etymology, just a definition. I had forgotten about/didn't realize that. Oh well.
Under 御 (crazy that it used to mean "to drive horses/carriages").
Actually, though, it doesn't give an etymology, just a definition. I had forgotten about/didn't realize that. Oh well.
- Thread starter
- #40
Yeah, the definitions do not explain the origins. Good sources of etymology are VERY limited. I reckon this project of mine will take me 5-7 years, depending on when I will be able to stop working in the office, and focus on something meaningful instead...
I would like to specilize in seal script, inluding kinbun and oracle bone. I want to continue its research in the future. But this will take some time.
Seal script is essencial for seal carving, which is also within my interest. Without knowledge of seal script one cannot read / carve seals. Lastly, with the knowldge of seal script, one better understands clerical and other scripts, as seal script is the father of them all. Many characters were deformed/simplified after unification of seal script in 221 BC.
I am gropping in the dark, but since 御 also means to resist and defend, it may be possible that "to use a horse, i.e. drive a chariot" was a meaning derived from its military connotation. Yeah, man, kanji is a jungle. Totally awesome invention.
And since 中華字海 lists nearly 83 000 characters, its a very thick jungle.
I would like to specilize in seal script, inluding kinbun and oracle bone. I want to continue its research in the future. But this will take some time.
Seal script is essencial for seal carving, which is also within my interest. Without knowledge of seal script one cannot read / carve seals. Lastly, with the knowldge of seal script, one better understands clerical and other scripts, as seal script is the father of them all. Many characters were deformed/simplified after unification of seal script in 221 BC.
I am gropping in the dark, but since 御 also means to resist and defend, it may be possible that "to use a horse, i.e. drive a chariot" was a meaning derived from its military connotation. Yeah, man, kanji is a jungle. Totally awesome invention.
And since 中華字海 lists nearly 83 000 characters, its a very thick jungle.
Glenn
一切皆苦
- 8 Jan 2004
- 7,842
- 200
More like a sea, no? haha 
Anyway, here are the definitions given in the 國語辭典 for 御 as a verb:
Anyway, here are the definitions given in the 國語辭典 for 御 as a verb:
The "defend/resist/prevent" meaning is #5, and it's the same as 禦 (Side note: I really wish this one would get used more), so I'm not so sure the "drive" meaning came from that. But anyway, that's another discussion.
- Thread starter
- #42
Interesting. Well, as I said I was only guessing. I can have a look into 字統 and see. Though such looking usually results in me reading the whole thing. So, the Japanese main meaning of this character could come from 進獻. Learning kanji is like playing a very addictive online role playing game; the moment you you are half way through to your goal, a new patch is released and you start it all from scratch, yet never get bored with it.
- Thread starter
- #43
Yesterday I attended my 書道研究会 and my teacher brought with him 説文解字注, published by 東海大学. Now, those are commentaries in Japanese on the commentaries to the 説文解字 by the Chinese philologist 段玉裁 (Duan Yucai). However, since his research was done before the discovery of the oracle bone script (Duan Yucai lived in 18th century and died nearly 80 years before the bones where unearthed in Anyang (安陽). The contents of 説文解字注 were not satisfactory to 白川静. So, 白川静 wrote yet another book, which adds further comments to 説文解字注. I saw that book yesterday and my jaw experienced a violent crash landing on the floor. Let me put it this way. His book is so difficult, that scholars give up while reading it lol. He wrote 10 pages alone on the character "一". And 説文解字注 is not anywhere near an easy read to begin with. This would mean that 字統 is merely a summary of his knowledge. This guy was a spaceman...
So, now i read 字統, then 字通, then I consume 3 trains of rice and begin my steep climb on the verses of 説文解字注. Once I am 156 I can start learning from the last book. Brilliant.
So, now i read 字統, then 字通, then I consume 3 trains of rice and begin my steep climb on the verses of 説文解字注. Once I am 156 I can start learning from the last book. Brilliant.
- Thread starter
- #44
- Thread starter
- #45
- Thread starter
- #46
- Thread starter
- #47
Below is a link to my new article on kanji etymology subject. This time I discuss the origins of the character 月 (moon). The article is linked not only to the information on the main page (Beyond Calligraphy, Traditional and modern Japanese and Chinese Calligraphy) as it was done before in all my previous articles, but also to our new project - a calligraphy terms online encyclopedia: Shodopedia.
So far I have written about 300 short articles on various terms related to Chinese and Japanese calligraphy, its history and traditions. The dictionary has no pictures as of yet (work in progress), and only 50% of the terms have been uploaded so far. Currently we are working on getting the rest of the text up. It is of a size of a small novel (35,000 words), so it may take few more days. We plan to link all the information together (we estimate approximately 1000 links to be created) which should assist with better understanding of calligraphic terms.
Kanji: 月 | Beyond Calligraphy
So far I have written about 300 short articles on various terms related to Chinese and Japanese calligraphy, its history and traditions. The dictionary has no pictures as of yet (work in progress), and only 50% of the terms have been uploaded so far. Currently we are working on getting the rest of the text up. It is of a size of a small novel (35,000 words), so it may take few more days. We plan to link all the information together (we estimate approximately 1000 links to be created) which should assist with better understanding of calligraphic terms.
Kanji: 月 | Beyond Calligraphy
- Thread starter
- #48
mosunshine
後輩
- 19 Nov 2011
- 15
- 4
Woah - this is really informative . Thanks guys
