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Comfort Women What do you think?

Which side do you believe regarding the "Comfort Women" issue?


  • Total voters
    72
it is just a name, no Japanese think the sea belongs to Japan), etc...
Ok then in a gesture of goodwill and reconcilliation towards Korea for past wrongdoings how about Japan taking a huge step forward and letting the sea be named to what Korea wants.

The point is that it requires give and take on both sides, also straightforward recognition that this problem and others are major stumbling blocks to true peace and understanding in this region.

Unfortunately there is too much distrust about motives.


It might take some time to arrive at that goal - but: why not try?
I agree with this too.
 
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The sentiments being, as they mostly appear to be, in agreement with that of my most recent post, I would then suggest that we discuss ways in which not only Japan--as a nation of people, as oposed to simply a governmental administration--but the whole world can set up the means to at least attempt to instill a fair standard of respect for all sexual orientations--meaning firstly, ALL peoples.

That would have to be on another thread, but I would encourage it. Strictly adhering to the OP of this thread, I'd be moved to think that this should be more so simply for voting, and, if one wishes, explaining the vote. I do not think that any more postitive up-building or practical advantage can come from the line of argument that has swollen up over a matter of historical blame. Let's keep this one for voting.
 
I agree with you here Mars Man, thanks for putting your thoughts here as well.
 
so their testimoy's is needed in turn
you should bring a doccument of some forced comfort women's comments.
name, age and situation....
then i will give you a opinion.
i think all of their testimony are interesting that is exposed a lie.
thet changed their testimony so many times.
 
I appreciate your posting your thoughts and opinion there caster51 san. Now, if possible, I hope we can move on to the future. . . and not have to say old things again. MM
 
I believe that Japan owes an appology to China, and I also believe that China owes an appology to Japan. Japan knows why they need to appologize, China needs to appologize because they only brought up such bad things, not because they feel that now was the best time to clear up the issue, but because they wanted to slander Japans name, thus because of this, I will not be attending the olympics in Chana, unless they give a public appology, and ONLY if Japan also give China an appology first, (sorry Japan, i love you, but you do have to take responsability for these actions, I can't defend something I don't believe in, but I do believe you can do it!)
 
This is a problem that is occuring actually now.
at first, We should take attention to current problem rather than in the past.
Why do they disregard the problem of happening actually?
SEX TRAFFICKING / San Francisco Is A Major Center For International Crime Networks That Smuggle And Enslave / FIRST OF A FOUR PART SPECIAL REPORT
there are 40,000korean prostitutes in Japan.
so is in USA.
korean gervenment should get them back first.
 
there are 40,000korean prostitutes in Japan.
so is in USA.
korean gervenment should get them back first.
It is really important that you bring this point up (although it is slightly off-topic, I think it is still important to discuss).

Slavery is illegal in the United States, and has been since the Emancipation Proclamation during the Civil War. However, it still continued into the 1900s, mostly through prostitution. This is one of the reasons prostitution is illegal in most of the United States.

The FBI has a tough time cracking these prostitution slavery rings, but they do, sometimes. The slavery exists under the pretext of indentured servitude these days, but sometimes (especially in the case of prostitutes) it came about through abduction. In all cases, the "slaves" are considered illegal immigrants, although they are not necessarily at fault. Some (especially in orange groves and other plantation-style situations) were promised a life of freedom in America as soon as they "paid their debt". Much of this is referred to as "human trafficking", and it is estimated that just under 1 million people are transported across borders worldwide every year (an estimated 14,000 of those are into the U.S.)

Nevertheless, this sort of thing is considered absolutely and positively illegal and is generally busted up by the FBI and INS when they get the opportunity. Reams and reams of paper with anti-trafficking laws and codes have been produced, but it seems that this is not something that is very easy to enforce, especially because it is not very widespread, despite the incredibly serious nature of the crime.

An interesting TV miniseries, Broken Trail, dealt with the "Wild" West and five Chinese girls sold into prostitution to a cruel madame in a northwestern mining town. The two heroes (played by Robert Duvall and Thomas Hayden Church) intercept the girls and pretty much try to keep them away from the madame's henchmen.

Anyway, this sort of things appalls me, and I find it sickening that slavery and human trafficking persists in my country, especially in light of the Civil War and the Emancipation Proclamation. That any human could profit from the suffering of others is an abomination and a violation of basic human rights.
 
GEL and Caster can I ask what do you two most recent posts have to do with the historical issue of the "Comfort Women" during WWII?
 
can I ask what do you two most recent posts have to do with the historical issue of the "Comfort Women" during WWII?
you want to get the past back again?
what do I think about Comfort woman?
comfort women during WW2" were prostitutes like that
It was better than today's.
if history is repreated and We must learna from History as you said, Today's phenomenon is a past repetition.
there is no progress for them
who has a ploblem Actually today.
who is repreating the same thing?
that is my though from comfort women during ww2.

until when was USA subjected by siocentrism?.
 
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it is very interesting
Quick Summary of "Comfort women

Comfort women#2_Why has this become the international issue?

obeika ,we should study more about that?
I think that is all.

窶凖ーツ身窶佚?ツ(Teishintai) is this one.
Amazon product ASIN 0801438543
 
obeika ,we should study more about that?
I think that is all.

Caster I am not ignoring you here, I am just not up to any deep discussions tonight. Sorry about that, I'll get back to you at another time about this.
 
Hmm i think during war things become blurry as to what is right and wrong. Did japanese soldiers rape women? comforts or not if they did thats wrong and not a war crime but a crime no matter what situation the country is in. Should the current people of Japan suffer for what happened more then 50 years ago? IMO unless its a soldier who is still alife and linked to it no they shouldnt. Lets get one thing clear IF it had of been on the other foot would Chinese or korean soldiers do the same, probably. War no doubt brings out the worse in men, soldiers boobytrap dead or wounded soldiers, torture others for information and bomb hospitals and places of worship just to make the enemy lose moral, heck many of the posters come from america i bet, a country who used the A bomb in a race of who Japan would surrender to them or the old enemy Russia. I think its Ok to judge others from the past while most of us have ever only known peace from our armchairs and have no room to judge. I feel the arguement of these comfort women is just one step of dissatified governments, if its not this they are talking about visiting the dead soldiers graves or denial of certain parts of history. Of course its hard to move on but using these things as political tools is something to be shameful of also. getting 8million isnt justice its getting paid off and if thats where their pioritys lay i cant symphais too much.
 
frostyg02uk,

You are right, I guess that I am the only one of this Forum who really was a war victim during WWII, that was when Japan did occupy the former Dutch East Indies, now Indonesia. My Dad and my uncle were killed by the Kempeitai. My mother came out of that war with psychical problems, it was through my indestructible optimism that she came through those years in our concentration camp.

And me too, I had to stand there in a line while Japanese officers looked us girls over and then took some of us to a brothel in Semarang. I know one of them.

You will not hear me blaming the whole Japanese nation, last of all the young ones, they have nothing to do with WWII, I only hope that they will read about it with an open and honest mind.

But I do blame the Japanese war criminals from during World War Two, they have been extremely cruel.

Last but not least; Compensations are okay for material loses during WWII, that includes, golden jewelery, houses, banking accounts, furnitures, you name it.
No one on earth can compensate me the death of my father through the Kempeitai. That is prohibitive!

Compensation for the "comfort women" ? Very painful!
 
The Semarang case was a horrible one, of which many adovocates claim it is the evidence, but it was an isolated example.
You know the brothel was closed down soon after the Japanese higher ranked officials knew the situation, don't you? (Of course, it was before the end of the war)
And it was horrible that soldiers concerned were persecuted in the local war criminal court. Do you need more blood?
 
Oh pipokun,
You told me that before and yes I did already know all about this trial.
And yes, the Dutch girls and women stayed there around 2½ in that brothel.
Yet, I am more than grateful that I wasn't one of them!

Pipokun, when one commits an offence, one gets persecuted.
Those young women and girls have been punished for a lifetime.

Your last remark; "Do you need more blood?" is childlike.
No it is worse, it gives me a look into the young Japanese hearts.
It shows bitterness, a sort of stubborness of not wanting to say: "We did wrong during World War Two".
You can then continue saying; "But I am from another generation and I believe in peace!"

I guess that you can't even believe me when I tell you once again:"I came out of that horrible war without any feeling of hatred towards the Japanese people". I am standing very far above any form of hatred pipokun, so no thank you "I don't need more blood" but I would like some understanding for those poor girls and young women, today called "comfort women". And not only for the Dutch girls because they were Europeans, no for all the poor girls
who were abused during WWII.
 
It shows bitterness, a sort of stubborness of not wanting to say: "We did wrong during World War Two".
You can then continue saying; "But I am from another generation and I believe in peace!"

Just see the post-war Japan. According to tons of media, I am living in a far-right, ultra-militaristic or whatever country, but just count how many people Japanese soldiers killed after the war.
When you bring up your personal story (though I highly apprecieate your story) or you say the isolated example, the blame game will never end.
 
The thread is about çomfort women', but okay I shall try to answer.

While people and media never stop talking about the war crimes Germany commited, that same media in the world hardly ever talks about the Japanese war crimes.
But you mean that nowadays the 'comfort women' stories are hot item in the newspapers all over the world? That is about time, 62 years after WWII.

I can use my own war story, because I was there and could see everything with my own eyes. Don't need the media from 2007 to know what was cooking in those days.

I don't feel sorry for Japanese war criminals, nor for any other war criminals.
But I do feel sorry for the poor people in Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
I do feel sorry for the Japanese women and children who had hardly anything to eat during WWII, since most of the food went to the Japanese Army.

I guess that it is not done in Japan to blame grandfathers and great-grandfathers for what happened during the war. Better deny it all so that they can rest in peace.
 
thank you for your story elizabeth.


As for pipokun, you keep saying these horror stories are "isolated" examples. But they are not. The massacre of nanking is flat out denied by some ultra rightist, and those that admit that happened, merely point out that the generals involved did not have direct order from the government, and so it was only an "isolated" example. Unit 731, which is largely documented, were also an "isolated" example. Then, the "Death March" in the Philippines were probably another isolated example.

There are too many of these "isolated examples". Either way, japanese government needs to do what the germans have been doing. Build museums of the history, of the cruelty of japanese imperial army. They were quick in making two peace museums about the atomic bomb, but the government is still reluctant to admit their wrongdoings.
 
There are too many of these "isolated examples". Either way, japanese government needs to do what the germans have been doing.

Why your country does not play French or British roll?
It was your govenment who had kept silent to the public that she spent the money from Japan for your economic growth. Do you think it is fair? South Korea even demanded the North share because the South was the only legitimate govenment.

Elizabeth van Kampen, you probably know the Dutch government or any other European countries did not pay any compensation at all like what Japan did to Korea.
 
Elizabeth-san,
Japan paid 10,000,000 dollar to Dutch government in 1950s.
(It might be not easy for Japan to pay at that time.)
When Indonesia made independent, Dutch government demanded 6,000,000,000 dollars from Sukarno.
If you never received any money, you should make claim for payment in your government.

I've just read Rudy Kousbroek's "Het Oosindisch kampsyndroom".
(Japanese title is different from original's :ツ青シ窶ーツ「窶堙個植窶督ッ窶冢窶腕ナスツク窶堙??愿コ窶怒)
He was also a prisoner of Japanese army in Indonesia just like you.
He was a witness of Japanese brutal behavior and such...
However, his point of view is different from yours Elizabeth-san.
If you have a chance to read it, I want to hear from you how you think about this book.
 
Hallo Hanachan,

Rudy Kousbroek, yes I even have two books written by him.
He is a good writer, he is very intelligent and on many points I agree with him.
But not all camps were the same, I had the bad luck not to be in one of the better camps, like Kousbroek. Banyu Biru 10 was a prison, a very dirty prison.
Rudy Kousbroek is from a rich Dutch family who grew up in luxery on Sumatra.
His whole family came alive out of the war.
My family, the Van Kampen's were not rich at all, I was not brought up in luxery. I lost my father during the Japanese occupation.
Kousbroek could study after the war, but my mother did not have money enough to let me even finish highschool.

Now the Netherlands!
I am so happy you mentioned the big amount of money Holland received from president Sukarno. Holland had been occupied by Germany, there was a lack of everything, so president Sukarno's money has been used to build up Holland again. I don't mind that.
But don't forget that president Sukarno nationalised all the Dutch belongings,
also the bank accounts, that includes my Dad's savings.
The Japanese dollars had to be divided over 300 000 former Dutch East Indies people. Rudy Kousbroek didn't need the money, but my mother did.

But I am happy you mentioned all this. On the 8th of December 1941 the Netherlands declared war on Japan because of Pearl Harbor.
The people in the former D.E.I were certain that America would protect them especially the island Java. But no American troops came to us from the moment Singapore fell in Japanese hands. Mr. Churchill ordered that as from then on all the protection and army troops had to be send to Australia.

Holland was occupied by Germany, so the Dutch women and children had to stay in an unprotected Indonesia. The Dutch army was more like a police-army, keeping order on the islands.

This year, the 12th of January the
Dutch government has said that they will not pay us at all!!

The British, Australian, New Zealands, Canada's and Norway governments have paid their war victims each $ 20.000

The people coming from the D.E.I. paid the bill.

But that is just talking about money. I personally would be more than satisfied, even be happy with a letter from the Japanese government in the Dutch newspapers that there have been quite some war crimes committed in the former D.E.I by the Japanese Army, especially by the Kempeitai, towards innocent Dutch citizens.

Rudy Kousbroek was protected by his father on Sumatra, they were in the same camp.
I had to protect my mother and two younger sisters, all the responsibility was on my shoulders. I did not get the chance to learn Japanese, I had to carry heavy stones, work on the land with malaria, I was a slave.

But I am far more angry with Holland than with Japan!!!
 
Hm Elizabeth i think your a person to be admired. I never lost a single person from WW2 as my family are orginally from ireland or Australia one of which was neutral But i can say IF i was in your place i dont think i could be so forgiving (towards todays Japanese). I believe its good to forgive but im ashamed to say i dont think i could. Even more so if my family were a victim of hiroshima. When i went to Japan i was suprised to how well they took to americans and also american culture. At the time i asked my girlfriend how can the people of Japan act like this? i was almost angry. But she told me that the 2 cities being bombed was the price they paid for their war and for being the losers of that war. At the time i thought little of the answer but now i sit here and wonder. Did the women and children of Hiroshima burn in the streets because their generals were using comfort women? was that the price they paid? Even now babies are born deformed because of past DNA that was exposed to radiation. Governments pay millions and say sorrys to the expense of their pride but i think its only the people that suffer due to others ideals and ambitions. If i think of it in the sense of thousands disapearing into the heat in seconds because of their leaders it makes me want to cry. I feel if this is price they paid then its settled.
 
Elizabeth-san,
Thank you so much for your reply.
Sorry, I was impertinent to you sometimes.
I'm just starting to understand you.
I like hearing your stories.
Nice to see you here.
Thanks.

P.S.
I've been to Holland once. In 1995, I changed air plane for Muenchen at Amsterdam. 3 hours stay in your country, inside the airport.
 
I think most japanese think Netherlands in indonasia was more was crueller than japanese against Indonesian
 
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