Can you really be your self?
- Thread starter thatsme
- Start date
Revenant
後輩
- 7 Mar 2005
- 634
- 38
The self can in very bare terms be defined as the sum and heirarchy of your desires. That is where your attention is often centered after all, on those desires that you feel will somehow make you happier. Desires often change throughout life, and usually those desires you take on as life goes on become more compatible with reality.
Or do you mean can you be yourself around other people? I believe most people can be themselves around certain people with similar desires, but it can certainly take time and effort to find those people.
Or do you mean can you be yourself around other people? I believe most people can be themselves around certain people with similar desires, but it can certainly take time and effort to find those people.
I personally believe that it is possible for people to be themselves. But would they offend anyone by being themselves or are they in a situation where they need to "censor" who they are? Those are everyday situations for everyone, I'm sure. But it's really hard to tell. Someone may appear to be acting as themselves, and they may be telling us that they are. But they could be lying/acting to cover up their "non-existent" insecurities. So I believe it's possible, but there is no way of knowing. I would have to say that people who are *unaware of their surroundings are themselves. A good example would be a mentally challenged individual.
*unaware- meaning that they perceive things differently than others, which I would qualify as being unaware in comparison to others. I am only applying this to the mentally challenged. I believe that they are free of insecurities. I honestly don't know if they are or not, I am not an expert. So if I'm wrong, then I am willing to accept it....I'll move on.
*unaware- meaning that they perceive things differently than others, which I would qualify as being unaware in comparison to others. I am only applying this to the mentally challenged. I believe that they are free of insecurities. I honestly don't know if they are or not, I am not an expert. So if I'm wrong, then I am willing to accept it....I'll move on.
- 23 Sep 2005
- 1,295
- 76
I have no problems being myself whatsoever- i love being myself! When i was a kid at school, i used to get bullied a heck of a lot, and because of the bullying most of my childhood was an absolute misery and i had no self-confidence or self-esteem, many a time i become deeply depressed (even suicidal) etc.
But it just came to a point when i was so fed of feeling miserable and depressed oppressed all the time that one day i just thought "**** it"- i was about to start college and so i decided to wipe the slate clean and leave everyone i knew from my old life far behind. I grabbed the opportunity of a new start and a new environment by the hojo's, and you know what? Things really did turn out well, and i've never looked back since.
IMHO, sometimes you really do just need a new clean slate and new environment and people around you for you to really be able to express yourself and start being happy. Only up until my mid to late teens did i really start being myself.
Back then in the past i had no confidence or self-esteem and i didn't ever really give myself any credit for anything and stuff etc, and it was really difficult to break out of this cycle since i had been stuck living with people who had permanently judged me and bullied me, there was nothing i could ever do to change their opinions on me, so i really did need to leave such people behind and move away for me to really start living happily for myself.
But yeah, anyways, no one can ever suppress who i really am again. If getting bullied at school taught me anything, its taught me to never take sh*t from anyone, and to live for yourself first and foremost. Don't get me wrong- i do like being kind and considerate towards other people, i'm no self-centered individual, in fact if anything i have always tried to never become like the people that used to bully me all those years ago. I despise bullies and i will help anyone out who is getting bullied, 'cos i know what it is like to suffer as so- i value good friends, loyalty, honesty, kindness and awareness more than anything else and i try to grow these values as much as i can within myself as i admire them so.
But what is my self? My self is my mind and my heart. It is the way i see and interperate the world, it is my feeling of happiness or sadness, the heart of my emotion and my thoughts. My self is shaped by my life but also has the more unchanging crystals of self i was created with. My self is who i am happy being as. My self is the driving force in my life and my existence, without a sense of self one would be an empty shell, a hollow human- perhaps this is why we find it so important to define and find who we are and to seek fulfillment and happyness in our lives and more.
But it just came to a point when i was so fed of feeling miserable and depressed oppressed all the time that one day i just thought "**** it"- i was about to start college and so i decided to wipe the slate clean and leave everyone i knew from my old life far behind. I grabbed the opportunity of a new start and a new environment by the hojo's, and you know what? Things really did turn out well, and i've never looked back since.
IMHO, sometimes you really do just need a new clean slate and new environment and people around you for you to really be able to express yourself and start being happy. Only up until my mid to late teens did i really start being myself.
Back then in the past i had no confidence or self-esteem and i didn't ever really give myself any credit for anything and stuff etc, and it was really difficult to break out of this cycle since i had been stuck living with people who had permanently judged me and bullied me, there was nothing i could ever do to change their opinions on me, so i really did need to leave such people behind and move away for me to really start living happily for myself.
But yeah, anyways, no one can ever suppress who i really am again. If getting bullied at school taught me anything, its taught me to never take sh*t from anyone, and to live for yourself first and foremost. Don't get me wrong- i do like being kind and considerate towards other people, i'm no self-centered individual, in fact if anything i have always tried to never become like the people that used to bully me all those years ago. I despise bullies and i will help anyone out who is getting bullied, 'cos i know what it is like to suffer as so- i value good friends, loyalty, honesty, kindness and awareness more than anything else and i try to grow these values as much as i can within myself as i admire them so.
But what is my self? My self is my mind and my heart. It is the way i see and interperate the world, it is my feeling of happiness or sadness, the heart of my emotion and my thoughts. My self is shaped by my life but also has the more unchanging crystals of self i was created with. My self is who i am happy being as. My self is the driving force in my life and my existence, without a sense of self one would be an empty shell, a hollow human- perhaps this is why we find it so important to define and find who we are and to seek fulfillment and happyness in our lives and more.
- 23 Sep 2005
- 1,295
- 76
At the end of the day, IMHO Your "self" is who you are. Your self is defined both by the life you lead and what you experience in life, but i also believe that we are born as individuals, we are not born the same, so there is a certain aspect of self that is unique to every individual that we start off with in life. Whether this part of our self has the ability to change or be altered is another lengthy and philosophical question altogether.
Experiences more than anything i think shapes who we are.
For me, the major experiences in my life that i can think of at the top of my head that shaped me greatly as the person i am today (and will probably continue to shape the person i will be in the future) is the family i was born into, the death of my father, the isolation i experienced being brought up on a farm in the middle of nowhere, my brother, the trials i faced with my mother, the rest of the family, school, the friends i got to know at school and the bullying i experienced for so much of my school life, full time boarding school, college, sexual relationships with other people, events in the world, money/state of wealth and poverty, being loved and loving others, loss, happiness, artistic talent, work, concept and idea's religion and related issues etc etc etc.
Everything in my life has affected my self, i.e. who i am. And i believe the self is always changing- i am a lot more different a person now than what i was say 6years ago, or 10years ago, or 15years ago etc.
I think comfort, happiness, love, material possessions, friendship and unity are all major things though that drive us to do many things in our lives, and the consequences of what we do in life, whether good or bad or neutral consequences, inevitably alter/change our perception of the world, our self, and what we want etc.
Experiences more than anything i think shapes who we are.
For me, the major experiences in my life that i can think of at the top of my head that shaped me greatly as the person i am today (and will probably continue to shape the person i will be in the future) is the family i was born into, the death of my father, the isolation i experienced being brought up on a farm in the middle of nowhere, my brother, the trials i faced with my mother, the rest of the family, school, the friends i got to know at school and the bullying i experienced for so much of my school life, full time boarding school, college, sexual relationships with other people, events in the world, money/state of wealth and poverty, being loved and loving others, loss, happiness, artistic talent, work, concept and idea's religion and related issues etc etc etc.
Everything in my life has affected my self, i.e. who i am. And i believe the self is always changing- i am a lot more different a person now than what i was say 6years ago, or 10years ago, or 15years ago etc.
I think comfort, happiness, love, material possessions, friendship and unity are all major things though that drive us to do many things in our lives, and the consequences of what we do in life, whether good or bad or neutral consequences, inevitably alter/change our perception of the world, our self, and what we want etc.
- 28 Jul 2005
- 5,238
- 172
I am not sure if this is really Serious Discussion material. An OP which doesn't want to discuss the matter raised? Is there any reason to question the self, in the first place? I'll wait for an answer to that firstly, before deciding to move this thread or not.
Can self, describe self?
Can self, describe self?
Lotorie
先輩
- 3 Dec 2007
- 158
- 1
I don't think you can really be your true self in society.
Because, most of the time (if it isn't all the time), you have to act and talk considering the persons who are around you.
You can't do what you want if it hurts people around you.
We all live together so we have to adapt our attitude to others.
Because, most of the time (if it isn't all the time), you have to act and talk considering the persons who are around you.
You can't do what you want if it hurts people around you.
We all live together so we have to adapt our attitude to others.
thatsme
先輩
- 11 Feb 2007
- 104
- 5
- Thread starter
- #9
As one of the moderator it is a tought job to actually moderate.
I am not sure my self if the subject I started is a serious one.
I simply asked others to ponder about it.
I did reply to my question though.
Thanks for reminding me that I should refrain to ask too many questions.
- 28 Jul 2005
- 5,238
- 172
Thanks for your reply, thatsme san ! I'm glad you got back here. Yes, it can, at times, be tough trying to judge things and be balanced and all that. Here in the Serious Discussions area, there are finer nuances that must be looked at at well--making it just that much harder. (there is a standard I'd wish to maintain for this sub-forum)
Now please do not get me wrong, however. Opening threads alone, is not the problem, nor of asking questions with the OP...as is a very, very common style. However, I would stipulate that opening a discussion with the declaration of intent to not discuss what has been opened, is not quite what I'd like to think actually fits that standard I'd like to maintain.
If it were just for members to post an easily stated 'yes, I think we can' or 'no, I don't think we can' on any level of possible levels (depths) within the bounds of the OP question (as can be seen here on this thread) it would better fit in Chit Chat & Misc. than here.
If the OP had been set up so as to draw responses at the level that sabro has raised immediately above, then of course it would go here. Usually the OP is considered the 'theme director' of a thread, so the OP should be as precise and concrete as possible regarding the theme or intent (direction/flow) of the thread.
Well, now...this is as a means to publish this information, indirectly having been afforded the chance to do so here, and not as an attack or such towards you, thatsme san. Please do not take it personally at all. I decided to do this here rather than my first reaction to PM....exactly for this reason. (and to get back on topic....excuse me, please everyone)
Now, in line with another thread that is (believe it or not, honestly !!) still in process, the determination of self, surely has an extremely whole lot to do with an individual brain, if not 100% due to that. So, rather than take this as a matter of being openingly the way you are when in public situations, I'll poke around with the matter of what selfhood is.
Now please do not get me wrong, however. Opening threads alone, is not the problem, nor of asking questions with the OP...as is a very, very common style. However, I would stipulate that opening a discussion with the declaration of intent to not discuss what has been opened, is not quite what I'd like to think actually fits that standard I'd like to maintain.
If it were just for members to post an easily stated 'yes, I think we can' or 'no, I don't think we can' on any level of possible levels (depths) within the bounds of the OP question (as can be seen here on this thread) it would better fit in Chit Chat & Misc. than here.
If the OP had been set up so as to draw responses at the level that sabro has raised immediately above, then of course it would go here. Usually the OP is considered the 'theme director' of a thread, so the OP should be as precise and concrete as possible regarding the theme or intent (direction/flow) of the thread.
Well, now...this is as a means to publish this information, indirectly having been afforded the chance to do so here, and not as an attack or such towards you, thatsme san. Please do not take it personally at all. I decided to do this here rather than my first reaction to PM....exactly for this reason. (and to get back on topic....excuse me, please everyone)
Now, in line with another thread that is (believe it or not, honestly !!) still in process, the determination of self, surely has an extremely whole lot to do with an individual brain, if not 100% due to that. So, rather than take this as a matter of being openingly the way you are when in public situations, I'll poke around with the matter of what selfhood is.
thatsme
先輩
- 11 Feb 2007
- 104
- 5
- Thread starter
- #12
Thanks Marsman.
Yeah you are right there, no point to start a thread and no getting involved.
I have realized that it is incredibly difficult to express toughts on the web.
Unfortunately words are not enough, I wish we were telepathic.
Words and the way are conveyed can create confusion, either face to face or on the web.
Anyway I will have to think about to how to continue this topic, too profound, and anyway it wont go anywhere regardless the outcome.
My cynisism has prevailed today!!!
Last edited:
Haha, this negates my theory on self. I said that one must be unaware of his or her surroundings (mainly superficial things). I guess I still make sense, but maybe only in my own logic...
My logic says that if one were to have a gigantic zit on their face, they would be self-conscious about it. So they would not act themselves. They might take on a less self-confident personality.
If one were to be fake, or purposely try to act different, would that still be considered acting themselves? Because, perhaps their usual self is deceitful or adjustable to certain situations. So know matter what, you are being yourself.
I don't care what people think about me, and I don't change who I am for anyone. However, I will censor my language or "adjust" to make sure people don't feel uncomfortable around me, only if I know that a certain behavior of mine might be offensive to them. So then, could self also be defined as how we are externally, since our outward appearance and mannerisms reflect who we are?
sabro
後輩
- 23 Apr 2004
- 1,006
- 35
She never stays the same for long,
Assuming that she'll get it wrong.
Perfect only in her imperfection...
She would change everything for happy ever after.
Caught in the in between of beautiful disaster,
But she just needs someone to take her home.
Cuz she's just the way she is, but no ones told her that's ok.-- Jon McLaughlin "Beautiful Disaster"
There are at least two kinds of cowards. One kind always lives with himself, afraid to face the world. The other kind lives with the world, afraid to face himself. --Roscoe
Snowden
All men should strive
to learn before they die
what they are running from, and to, and why.
-- James Thurber
Assuming that she'll get it wrong.
Perfect only in her imperfection...
She would change everything for happy ever after.
Caught in the in between of beautiful disaster,
But she just needs someone to take her home.
Cuz she's just the way she is, but no ones told her that's ok.-- Jon McLaughlin "Beautiful Disaster"
There are at least two kinds of cowards. One kind always lives with himself, afraid to face the world. The other kind lives with the world, afraid to face himself. --Roscoe
Snowden
All men should strive
to learn before they die
what they are running from, and to, and why.
-- James Thurber
Its hard for me to be in my self all the time in the world .I am a member of a society . Some time I have to do some stuff unwillingly just to please others and some time I can not do according to my liking this time again to please others unwillingly . If I want to be in the good books of the other persons I have to do it . I will like to say more here that not even a single person can live like his/her own all the time .
Void
born in the USSR
- 20 Mar 2005
- 409
- 41
Can you really be your self ?
ﾂ"What is my self?ﾂ" probably, belongs to the list of eternal questions like ﾂ"what do we live for?ﾂ".
There can be dozen of definitions of word ﾂ"selfﾂ", but I tend to think that they all would relate to the psychological comfort, inner harmony.
It is said that newborn child is ﾂ"tabula rasaﾂ". Everyone of us is born within some society, like it or not but we are shaped by this society through our parents and our interaction with outer world. At the early age we hear what we should or should not do (with different degree of must), learn what words we ought or should never say. We discover that people starting with our parents and ending with some distant strangers have certain expectations about us, that our life is already schemed in accordance of some ﾂ"outer designﾂ", that we should comply with it for our benefit.
There is a concept of ﾂ"degree of freedomﾂ" in science, their number depends on system's structure. But our system rarely informs growing child about these degrees, and more often it condemns or discourages for an attempt to take ﾂ"another routeﾂ". Days pass and we grow accustomed to think that what we do and think is really our self. Increasing numbers of psychoanalysts and sects of all kinds is clear prove that we might be damn wrong about ourselves.
I don`t think that many people really bothered that in certain situation they can`t tell people all what they feel and think. It is rather secondary. What gives more discomfort is a feeling ﾂ"why on earth I have to be here and do / say such and such?!ﾂ" The sad truth is that even home when we think that ﾂ"finally, we can be what we are!ﾂ", we hardly are, it`s just temporary asylum and place to catch one`s breath. One moment in ﾂ"Whispers of the heartﾂ" struck me the most – at the age of these kids I didn`t know what I really wanted to be and how I would pursue my goal. Looks like many people neither did or gave up the idea to the gods of pragmatism and respectability.
To be your self is second task, first one is to discover what you really are, but they equally difficult. It takes lots of efforts and courage. But it is possible.
There is small parable, maybe Chinese, but it really doesn`t matter. ﾂ"Once apprentices of different temples decided to find out whose Master was the greatest.
- Our Master can move rocks with power of his mind! – said some.
- But our Master can cross the river without soaking his sandals! – said others.
- We didn`t see our Master moving rocks or walking over the water. But our Master can laugh when he is happy, sleep when he is tired, eat when he is hungry and cry when feels sadﾂ…ﾂ"
ﾂ"What is my self?ﾂ" probably, belongs to the list of eternal questions like ﾂ"what do we live for?ﾂ".
There can be dozen of definitions of word ﾂ"selfﾂ", but I tend to think that they all would relate to the psychological comfort, inner harmony.
It is said that newborn child is ﾂ"tabula rasaﾂ". Everyone of us is born within some society, like it or not but we are shaped by this society through our parents and our interaction with outer world. At the early age we hear what we should or should not do (with different degree of must), learn what words we ought or should never say. We discover that people starting with our parents and ending with some distant strangers have certain expectations about us, that our life is already schemed in accordance of some ﾂ"outer designﾂ", that we should comply with it for our benefit.
There is a concept of ﾂ"degree of freedomﾂ" in science, their number depends on system's structure. But our system rarely informs growing child about these degrees, and more often it condemns or discourages for an attempt to take ﾂ"another routeﾂ". Days pass and we grow accustomed to think that what we do and think is really our self. Increasing numbers of psychoanalysts and sects of all kinds is clear prove that we might be damn wrong about ourselves.
I don`t think that many people really bothered that in certain situation they can`t tell people all what they feel and think. It is rather secondary. What gives more discomfort is a feeling ﾂ"why on earth I have to be here and do / say such and such?!ﾂ" The sad truth is that even home when we think that ﾂ"finally, we can be what we are!ﾂ", we hardly are, it`s just temporary asylum and place to catch one`s breath. One moment in ﾂ"Whispers of the heartﾂ" struck me the most – at the age of these kids I didn`t know what I really wanted to be and how I would pursue my goal. Looks like many people neither did or gave up the idea to the gods of pragmatism and respectability.
To be your self is second task, first one is to discover what you really are, but they equally difficult. It takes lots of efforts and courage. But it is possible.
There is small parable, maybe Chinese, but it really doesn`t matter. ﾂ"Once apprentices of different temples decided to find out whose Master was the greatest.
- Our Master can move rocks with power of his mind! – said some.
- But our Master can cross the river without soaking his sandals! – said others.
- We didn`t see our Master moving rocks or walking over the water. But our Master can laugh when he is happy, sleep when he is tired, eat when he is hungry and cry when feels sadﾂ…ﾂ"
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Kyoto Returnee
Sempai
- 18 Dec 2007
- 598
- 4
Certainly can..
Always will be...
Always will be...
