Arabs in Japan!? OFFTOPIC about education and arrogance

[lexico]

The essense of mathematical learning is the freedom of the mind, according to Gauss (or was it Kantor ?)--anyway, early exposure to counting, drwaing, and sculpting leading to arithmetic and geometry leading to Cartesian math, calculus, and analysis is one way to achieve intellectual independence. Only after becoming comfortable with these ideas (not so difficult at all...good stuff, actually !) can one not be intimidated by the achievements of human civilization in the sciences. It's all achieveable within the 12 yrs of compulsory education given the right kind of curriculum and skilled, dedicated teachers. Going for a weaker math curriculum is NOT the solution, but to raise competent teachers is the solution imo.

 

[Tsuyoiko]

I think it is often difficult for highly intelligent people to make themselves understood, and this frustration can come across as arrogance.

I certainly wouldn't support a weaker Maths curriculum. At high school my parents had to fight for the school to run a Mathematics course that would get me into University to study Mathematics, as I was the only student who had sufficient grades. In the end six students took it and we all passed. A weaker curriculum might help those who find Maths difficult, but it would be disastrous for anyone with a gift for the subject. The same goes for any subject I suppose - a curriculum should be broad enough to give everyone a sound basis, and deep enough to allow everyone's gifts to shine.

 

[Maciamo]

Maybe maths should only be an option after primary school. This way, the number of teachers would also diminish, and only the best ones would stay to teach motivated students. If maths is so useful in life, the bunch of dismissed maths teachers will have no problem finding a new job. ;-)

 

[Tsuyoiko]

Ah, but why does something have to be useful for life to be worth learning? I have a degree in Mathematics and Philosophy, neither of which I use to any significant degree in life, both of which were fascinating for me to learn. Now I am learning Japanese just for something to do.

 

[PopCulturePooka]

Funnily enough I ntoiced Maciamo mentioned Greek.
I would say that in parts of Australia (Melbourne) Greek would be quite an important language to learn.

 

[lexico]

Are we talking about Classical Greek, biblical/koine Greek, or Modern Greek :?

 

[PopCulturePooka]

Are we talking about Classical Greek, biblical/koine Greek, or Modern Greek :?

Modern, so I'll assume Big Mac is talking about ancient greek.

Hmm I know a guy with a masters degree in philosophy and ancient greek.
He works in tax office and my mother bosses him around.

 

[Tsuyoiko]

I am a bit like your mother's minion. I too work in a dead end job, despite my good education.

 

[lexico]

Thanks for sharing that, Pooka, Tsuyoiko. I had an English T.A. who was a classicist, and he was so young yet knowledgeable, and creative, too. I had almost forgotten about Homeric Greek which might have some practical use in a pre-classical Greek theater for the Homeric pieces. A researcher from University of London would give a lecture on how the Homeric poems sounded like !

A good education is never lost; it's worth lies in itself. A good day at work serving a non-classicist boss is really no great insult to the classicist. For when the work is done, (s)he can retire into his smalll library and once again jump into the ancient world before all these annoying modern conveniences cluttered our heads. But to have experienced the time, space and people with deep understanding; it is definitely rewarding given the short life span of us mortals. If we can agree that we are here to enjoy life for all it's worth; not for some high paying job to the exclusion of other human pursuits.

 

[Tsuyoiko]

Thank you Lexico. I wish more people felt that way. If I had a quid for every time someone said "But couldn't you get a better job?" I wouldn't need to work at all!

 

[Apollo]

My high school maths was a waste of time basically, as I don't have use for it now, and didn't use it through uni either.....

Life experience teaches me more than school too, I would say that school has inspired me to learn more though, e.g. I studied history for 6 years at two different universities in order to get a research degree, however, at first I only chose the subject because our history teacher at high school inspired me to study this subject....

For me, history should be a compulsory subject always, as history is an interdisciplinary subject mixing many academic subjects: political science, economics, linguistics, anthropology, geography..and many more depending on case.

Funny enough, I don't work with history today, having done the history teaching and working at arsenal museum, PR for defence commando - I chose a different field: communications consulting in an international company!!!

Now I keep contact with "my subject" a few times a year by being an external advisor for undergraduate students at University.....so, I still keep "up-to-date" with history...

 

[Tsuyoiko]

For me, history should be a compulsory subject always, as history is an interdisciplinary subject mixing many academic subjects: political science, economics, linguistics, anthropology, geography..and many more depending on case

For a similar reason I think Philosophy should be studied in schools. Philosophy not only overlaps with practically every other subject - Maths, Science, Literature, History, Languages, Religious & Social Studies, Arts - it also helps to train the mind. I teaches us how to argue and discuss efficiently, which is an essential skill for higher studies.

 

[Maciamo]

For a similar reason I think Philosophy should be studied in schools.

We had philosophy in French (mother tongue) class in the last year of highschool. So it was also a compulsory subject, although not a separate subject. Likewise, economics was included in the last 2 years of geography.

 

[lexico]

I had philosophy in my Civics classes since junior high school. Although certain neo-Confucian propaganda had to be put up with, the joy of learning the history of pholosophy and all the mind-expanding ideas of the great thinkers was enough to consider that a small price to pay. Apart from all the goodies we got in the Civics class called ﾅ｡ﾂ?窶督ｯ輪窶板? we also had interesting debates that made clearer what kind of lies were forced upon us; knowing what to resist, and what to work for was also a good lesson in the usefulness of philosophical thinking. O, how abused was Socrates, but his great power of thought, to doubt, to question, and to make merry of choosing death for damned good reasons was never lost !

 

[Apollo]

For a similar reason I think Philosophy should be studied in schools. Philosophy not only overlaps with practically every other subject - Maths, Science, Literature, History, Languages, Religious & Social Studies, Arts - it also helps to train the mind. I teaches us how to argue and discuss efficiently, which is an essential skill for higher studies.

I agree. Philosphy is taught only as an elective subject in high school. However, philosophical literature is COMPULSARY in the subject of Danish literature in high school, in which we read the Danish philosopher Kierekegaard - and other readings from existentialism.

Philosphy is also an interdisciplinary subject which students would benefit from.

However, philosophy should be taught in high schoosl and not secondary schools I think, as I don't think many kids would appreciate the worth of Kierkegaard in Denmark.

 

[Tsuyoiko]

What is the difference between high school and secondary in Denmark? In the UK they are the same, 11-16, although high schools sometimes go on to 18.

 

[Duo]

I think philosphy should remain for college........ or in high school to have at least a class you can choose, but not forced. I'm afraid today's youth is too stuck in popular culture and to force philosophy on them that early they may develop a distaste for it for a long time. Better to let them discover it themselves, and for those that don't, oh well too bad.... I can't see someone in high school appreciating or even understanding nietzche's theories and remarks on the European spirit and what not.