知られたくない

[eeky]

Hi,

「魔法省は、みんなに知られたくないだろうよ」

Somehow I feel puzzled about this. The (passive) subject of the 知られ part seems to be the information that people mustn't know, and yet the subject of the たくない part seems to be the Ministry. Is that analysis correct, or am I misunderstanding something?

 

[mdchachi]

I think the object is the information. The Ministry doesn't want [it] to be known by everybody.

It might be easier to understand if you convert the pattern to a verb that sounds more natural in English.
Like, 息子は弟にキャンデイをたべられたくないだろう。
My son doesn't want his candy eaten by his little brother.

 

[eeky]

I think the object is the information

The information is the logical object, if you want to put it like that, but grammatically it is the passive subject, at least in the English-like interpretation (e.g. "the information is known by the people"). In English, the verb "want" is a separate verb, so it doesn't matter. In Japanese, however, it seems part of the same verb, so, in a sense, it seemed to me that one verb had two subjects ...

 

[Toritoribe]

It's indirect passive/passive of adversity.

active
みんなが情報を知る。
泥棒が財布を盗んだ。

indirect passive/passive of adversity
（魔法省が）みんなに情報を知られる。
（私は）泥棒に財布を盗まれた。

(cf. direct passive)
情報がみんなに知られる。
財布が泥棒に盗まれた。

 

[eeky]

It's indirect passive/passive of adversity.

Aha, I see.

May I ask who or what you consider to be the subject of the verb 盗まれた in 私は泥棒に財布を盗まれた?

 

[Toritoribe]

私 is the subject. は is appropriate here since it's 私. が is used, for instance, in 学生が泥棒に財布を盗まれた.
は, が and を what's the difference between the following sentences? | Japan Forum

 

[eeky]

Thanks, I think it is clear to me now.