すぐ忘れて... / あれで / シャワーしか使わず

Hi. These are some more questions about a text in which a Japanese girl is describing the time when an American student came to stay with the family.


1. The writer has been talking about times when she and the American girl did not see eye to eye.

すぐ忘れてしまうような時には、何度となく注意したり した。

My best guess is something like:

"On occasions when it seemed like she (the American student) forgot (my previous advice/warning), I had to caution her over and over again."

Is this anywhere close? I am not sure if I have understood the purpose of the sentence correctly.


2. 「少し口喧しかったかな」と今になって時々思うことも あるが、陰でこそこそと悪口を言うよりは、あれで良か ったのだと思う。

My translation: "Now I sometimes wonder if I was a little critical, but I think it's better to ??? than to speak ill of someone behind their back."

Assuming the rest of this translation is OK, I don't understand what あれで means or how to parse it. Is it あれ + で? Could it somehow mean "(speak to) the other person directly"?


3. The Japanese girl is, I think, talking about some of the things she criticised the American girl for.

一つは、シャワーの使用を許したこと（冬になってもシャワーしか使わず、風邪をよくひいた）。

I assume the start of this means "For one thing, there was the matter of the permission to use the shower..." (i.e. this was one of the things she nagged about).

Then there is something about using the shower in the winter and catching colds, but I don't understand the overall sense or who is the subject of the verbs.


4. I believe this is describing another point about which the Japanese girl nagged the poor American girl:

最後に、洗濯などをしてあげたこと（だんだんと独立精 神が薄らいでいった）。

I can't make any sense of this. Something about laundry, and then one's spirit of independence fading? What's the connection? Any ideas?

eeky said:

1. The writer has been talking about times when she and the American girl did not see eye to eye.
すぐ忘れてしまうような時には、何度となく注意したりした。
My best guess is something like:
"On occasions when it seemed like she (the American student) forgot (my previous advice/warning), I had to caution her over and over again."
Is this anywhere close? I am not sure if I have understood the purpose of the sentence correctly.

Click to expand...

eeky said:

2. 「少し口喧しかったかな」と今になって時々思うこともあるが、陰でこそこそと悪口を言うよりは、あれで良かったのだと思う。
My translation: "Now I sometimes wonder if I was a little critical, but I think it's better to ??? than to speak ill of someone behind their back."
Assuming the rest of this translation is OK, I don't understand what あれで means or how to parse it. Is it あれ + で? Could it somehow mean "(speak to) the other person directly"?

Click to expand...

あれ refers to " すぐ忘れてしまうような時には、何度となく注意したりした" or like that. The speaker thinks that to speak to her(the American girl) directly is better than to speak ill of her behind her back.

eeky said:

3. The Japanese girl is, I think, talking about some of the things she criticised the American girl for.
一つは、シャワーの使用を許したこと（冬になってもシャワーしか使わず、風邪をよくひいた）。
I assume the start of this means "For one thing, there was the matter of the permission to use the shower..." (i.e. this was one of the things she nagged about).
Then there is something about using the shower in the winter and catching colds, but I don't understand the overall sense or who is the subject of the verbs.

Click to expand...

シャワーの使用を許したこと
The subject is the speaker.
"to allow her(the American girl) to use the shower"

冬になってもシャワーしか使わず、風邪をよくひいた
The subject is the American girl. She used only the shower(without soaking in the bathtub) even in winter, and because of that, she often caught a cold. Thus, the speaker believes that she(=the American girl) would be able to avoid catching a cold by soaking her body in the bathtub (and warming her body).

eeky said:

4. I believe this is describing another point about which the Japanese girl nagged the poor American girl:
最後に、洗濯などをしてあげたこと（だんだんと独立精神が薄らいでいった）。
I can't make any sense of this. Something about laundry, and then one's spirit of independence fading? What's the connection? Any ideas?

Click to expand...

（私が彼女に）洗濯などをしてあげたこと

The speaker thinks the American girl should do the laundry by herself.(Probably she became progressively less and less to do by herself, not only the laundry but also another things.)

Thanks Toritoribe. It is clear now. I'd not heard of that idea about warming one's body in the bathtub prior to showering before. Possibly it's a custom specific to Japan.

Toritoribe said:

あれ refers to " すぐ忘れてしまうような時には、何度となく注意したり した" or like that. The speaker thinks that to speak to her(the American girl) directly is better than to speak ill of her behind her back.

Click to expand...

Really? I thought it referred to 「少し口喧しかったかな」と今になって時々思うことも ある. Or rather, she felt that being outright vocal about things is better than talking bad about someone behind their backs.

Glenn said:

Or rather, she felt that being outright vocal about things is better than talking bad about someone behind their backs.

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Yes, I meant so. That's why I quoted "何度となく注意したりした". But あれ doesn't refer to 「少し口喧しかったかな」と今になって時々思うことも ある. "Now I somtimes think~" is better than "to speak ill of someone behind their back"???;-)

eeky said:

I'd not heard of that idea about warming one's body in the bathtub prior to showering before. Possibly it's a custom specific to Japan.

Click to expand...

Yeah, indeed, most Japanese love to take a bath. Actually, 風呂に入る is usually used as almost a synonym of "to soak in a bathtub".

Toritoribe said:

Yes, I meant so. That's why I quoted "何度となく注意したりした". But あれ doesn't refer to 「少し口喧しかったかな」と今になって時々思うことも ある. "Now I somtimes think~" is better than "to speak ill of someone behind their back"???

Click to expand...

Yeah, that does make sense. I don't know, it just felt a little off to me. But my attention has been a bit divided tonight.

Toritoribe said:

Yeah, indeed, most Japanese love to take a bath.

Click to expand...

Actually, I'm thinking now that I may have misunderstood. Here in the UK, too, lots of people like to take a bath, and the same in many of other parts of the world, for sure (albeit we don't go in much for the communal bathing thing, like in the Japanese hot springs).

One of the several things I was originally confused about in that sentence was the scope of 窶堋ｵ窶堋ｩ. For example, I wondered if it meant "only take a shower, as opposed to taking a shower and doing something else as well". Because I already had that in my mind, when you answered "She used only the shower(without soaking in the bathtub) even in winter", I thought you meant that the Japanese custom was to soak in the bathtub and take a shower. That is something I'm not familiar with. In my country it is normally one or the other. However, now I'm thinking you may have meant "take a shower instead of taking a bath", which is probably the more natural interpretation if I hadn't already had the confusion in my mind.

eeky said:

now I'm thinking you may have meant "take a shower instead of taking a bath"

Click to expand...

Yeah, that's exactly what I wanted to say. The speaker (and most of Japanese) thinks 風呂に入る means "to soak in a bathtub", as I wrote in my previous post, so it's not usual to take only the shower(as the American girl did).