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いられたら / もの心のつき / めがけて / 大そうき / でも

eeky

先輩
8 Jun 2010
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Hiya. Could anyone help with these?

1. ああ、いつまでも、このままのおまえでいられたらねえ !

This is said by a mother to her young daughter. I know it ought to roughly mean "Oh, if only you could stay like this forever!"

I'm not 100% sure about いられたら. Is it the conditional-potential form of いる, meaning "if (you) could be"?


2. 二つは、もの心のつきはじめですからね。

This should mean: "Two (i.e. the age of two) is the beginning of the end."

I don't understand もの心のつき. How do we parse this and what does it mean? Perhaps it is an idiom?


3. ...おかあさんの家めがけて、走っていました。

I believe this means " ... ran to (her) mother's house."

I'm guessing that めがけて is from めがける, meaning that she ran in the direction of her mother's house, but why is no particle needed? For example, why is it not 家へめがけて?


4. はじめのうちは、おかあさんも、大そうきちょうめんに 家計簿をつけていました。

My translation: "At first, (her) mother kept the household accounts" (lit. made household accounting entries in an account book).

I don't understand 大そうき. How do we parse this, and what does it mean?

I also often get confused about the exact meaning of も in a given context. What is it most likely to mean here?


5. まるでゲームでもしているように...

Like も, I often get confused about which sense でも has in a given context. Here, I'm guessing it means "(She) seemed to treat (it) just like a game or something..." Is that right?
 
1. Yes to everything.

2. もの心 means having some understanding and ability make determinations, although it's vague (the understanding, that is). That state つきはじめs at the age of two. I guess you could say "starts to stick".

3. It would be を if there were any particle. めがける generally means to target something, or look fixedly at something. Particles, especially を and が, can drop in informal speech.

4. It's 大(たい)そう and きちょうめん. たいそう means "great" or "large" and other things like that. きちょうめん means something like being a stickler (can't think of anything better right now). For example, if you are きちょうめん with regards to time, it means "punctual". The も is putting the speaker's mother on par with other mothers, but now she doesn't balance the checkbook so regularly.

5. Yeah, that's right. It's like "or something" here. I actually think this use of でも is the root cause of why Japanese people overuse "or something" in English. You can just translate this as "it's like [she] was playing a game."
 
Before dashing off to work...

1. ああ、いつまでも、このままのおまえでいられたらねえ!
You're right.
いられたら いる+られ+たら

2. 二つは、もの心のつきはじめですからね。
Punctuation is wrong.
もの心のつきはじめ もの心+つく+はじめ(る)
Look up the word もの心.

3. ...おかあさんの家めがけて、走っていました。
家(を)めがけて
を is sometimes omitted in colloquial speech.
e.g.
なに食べてるの?

4. はじめのうちは、おかあさんも、大そうきちょうめんに家計簿をつけていました。
Again, punctuation.
大そう・きちょうめん・に
たいそう=とても

5. まるでゲームでもしているように...
Like も, I often get confused about which sense でも has in a given context. Here, I'm guessing it means "(She) seemed to treat (it) just like a game or something..." Is that right?

Yes, your interpretation is correct. :)

---
edit: gee, beaten by Glenn san on top of incomplete post... (T_T)
 
Last edited:
Well, if nothing else, this makes me feel like I know what I'm talking about. hahaha
 
2. 二つは、もの心のつきはじめですからね。
Punctuation is wrong.


4. はじめのうちは、おかあさんも、大そうきちょうめんに家計簿をつけていました。
Again, punctuation.
I've checked again, and the punctuation is just as it is in the source text (i.e. no typos from me that I can see). Could you show me how the sentences should be correctly punctuated, please?

(Edited) Just after typing this it occurred to me that you may not mean "punctuated" in the way I understand it. To me, "punctuation" means commas, full stops and so on. However, I wonder if by "punctuation" you may actually be referring to my incorrect division of the text into words, which you and Glenn have now corrected. Is that right?
 
Hiya. Could anyone help with these?
1. ああ、いつまでも、このままのおまえでいられたらねえ !
This is said by a mother to her young daughter. I know it ought to roughly mean "Oh, if only you could stay like this forever!"
I'm not 100% sure about いられたら. Is it the conditional-potential form of いる, meaning "if (you) could be"
You can also think that's the omission of いられたらいいのにねえ or "I wish you could stay~."
 
I'm adding some kanji below, because the non-use and mixed use annoys me, plus I think it's helpful to be exposed to them as much as possible.

お母(かあ)さんの家目掛(めが)けて、走っていました。

初(はじ)めのうちは、お母(かあ)さんも、大層(たいそう)几帳面(きちょうめん)に 家計簿をつけていました。
 
You can also think that's the omission of いられたらいいのにねえ or "I wish you could stay~."
I guess to say something like ずっとこのままでいられないのかなぁ…… may be a bit strange, like there is a chance they could stay this way forever. Although as a conjugation and phrase いられない(のかなぁ) is way more common than いられたら in my experience.
 
I guess to say something like ずっとこのままでいられないのかなぁ…… may be a bit strange, like there is a chance they could stay this way forever. Although as a conjugation and phrase いられない(のかなぁ) is way more common than いられたら in my experience.

I think いられないかな and いられたらいいのに are different.
このままでいられないのかなあ the speaker is just wondering if it can stay (that way)
このままでいられたらいいのに the speaker is almost certain it cannot though he/she wish it could.
 
I think いられないかな and いられたらいいのに are different.
このままでいられないのかなあ the speaker is just wondering if it can stay (that way)
このままでいられたらいいのに the speaker is almost certain it cannot though he/she wish it could.
Oh, yes. I didn't know if かな could ever be stretched to "Oh, can't you just stay like this..." It wouldn't have to be かなあ, though. Maybe just どうしてこのままでいられないの?:p
 
Oh, yes. I didn't know if かな could ever be stretched to "Oh, can't you just stay like this..." It wouldn't have to be かなあ, though. Maybe just どうしてこのままでいられないの?:p

Connotation of どうしてこのままでいられないの can be quite different depending on the context and speaker's intonation in case of speech.
It could be vary from just wondering (like speaking to oneself) or accusation/complaint (when addressed to another person). ;-)
 
C
Connotation of どうしてこのままでいられないの can be quite different depending on the context and speaker's intonation in case of speech.
It could be vary from just wondering (like speaking to oneself) or accusation/complaint (when addressed to another person). ;)
Ok, so we are left with ite kuretara naa/ite kurereba naa. :D
 
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