would you fight for your country?

[karlyboo]

the people replying to me are replying on part of what i had to say....not the entire thought i have represented here...
if some one wants to reply to me than he shall do it when he knows exactly what is it i am saying..and what is the thought that i am trying to deliver...
now don't you think that is more fair bro.

This is why you are frankly a frustration to try and discuss anything sensible with- you say something which people respond to and then spend your next few posts denying you ever said anything of the kind.

I think it would be fair if you could take responsibility for what you've said, rather than assuming that everybody can see inside your head.

 

[scorpion da black]

This is why you are frankly a frustration to try and discuss anything sensible with- you say something which people respond to and then spend your next few posts denying you ever said anything of the kind.
I think it would be fair if you could take responsibility for what you've said, rather than assuming that everybody can see inside your head.

it is too frustrating to keep on going on with that argument of yours that suggest that i am denying what i said...
who said i am denying what i said??????

i am fully responsible of the things i said...
but wouldn't it be right that you know what i said first...then you can hold me accountable for what ever it is that i said.

that is why i am asking you to read my post # 3 first then reply to me..

i didn't deny anything...
as for you ..you spend the posts you make on trying to make me look bad or prove me wrong by choosing parts of my post and disregarding the rest of what i had to say

 

[Haruspex]

I understand your patriotic spirit... or rather I try to understand it. But seriously, there's difference between fighting and dying for something thats worth dying for. However a country is not among those things. A country, or rather every country is made of a government, loads of morons and probably 3% normal people. Now, im not going to risk my life if there are only 3% normal folks, nor am I gonna die for a government, and my beliefs don't include dying without a reason either.
So, in the end of the day, im sad, I mourn those who died, and continue my life, while those who fought valiantly to save the government and the dumb 97% are six feet under. Well how nice for them.

 

[scorpion da black]

I understand your patriotic spirit... or rather I try to understand it. But seriously, there's difference between fighting and dying for something thats worth dying for. However a country is not among those things. A country, or rather every country is made of a government, loads of morons and probably 3% normal people. Now, im not going to risk my life if there are only 3% normal folks, nor am I gonna die for a government, and my beliefs don't include dying without a reason either.
So, in the end of the day, im sad, I mourn those who died, and continue my life, while those who fought valiantly to save the government and the dumb 97% are six feet under. Well how nice for them.

believe me bro i have not lost any bits of respect for you...
on the contrary i understand you ...it is just normal for any one to cling to life..it is just the normal way living things go...
as for me..i might have a precious believe that diminishes the importance of this world in my eyes.

 

[Taiko666]

Tokis-Phoenix, Pachipro

... off topic, but when it comes to international matters, could we refer to the UK and not 'England' please?

England ceased to exist as an international entity in 1707. That's over 300 years and counting...

 

[Davey]

No I would not fight for my country, reason for that is that I don't feel that I belong to one country but too the world. Of course I love my country, but to die for my country goes too far for me. I'll rather run away (I'm already in Japan though).

Fighting for my family is a different thing.

 

[centrajapan]

id not fight for my country by invading an another country like the americans are doing all the time.

 

[karlyboo]

it is too frustrating to keep on going on with that argument of yours that suggest that i am denying what i said...
who said i am denying what i said??????

You said:

it is self centered and selfish just to think of one's self and disregard the entire population, brethren citizens, society as whole...

And then denied it with:

karly boo san again i didn't generalize every one in my post..

And so on to:

i am fully responsible of the things i said...
but wouldn't it be right that you know what i said first...then you can hold me accountable for what ever it is that i said.
that is why i am asking you to read my post # 3 first then reply to me..
i didn't deny anything...

I have read it. No problems there. Your opinion, your right blahblahblah all fine and dandy. You then posted something else. I took you up on what you wrote in that second post as your reasoning I felt was at fault regardless of what you previously had written.

as for you ..you spend the posts you make on trying to make me look bad or prove me wrong by choosing parts of my post and disregarding the rest of what i had to say

The way it looks to me is I give you every opportunity to discuss these things properly but instead you start retreating behind excuses, denials and then claiming you're the injured party because nobody understands what you've said. Honestly, that winds me up and I get short with you.

If you think something at least stand up for it rather than crying foul if you're called up on what is perceived to be faulty reasoning.

 

[MadamePapillon]

I understand your patriotic spirit... or rather I try to understand it. But seriously, there's difference between fighting and dying for something thats worth dying for. However a country is not among those things. A country, or rather every country is made of a government, loads of morons and probably 3% normal people. Now, im not going to risk my life if there are only 3% normal folks, nor am I gonna die for a government, and my beliefs don't include dying without a reason either.
So, in the end of the day, im sad, I mourn those who died, and continue my life, while those who fought valiantly to save the government and the dumb 97% are six feet under. Well how nice for them.

I'm afraid I have to completely disagree with everything you just said. A country IS worth fighting for. Keep in mind, I'm not saying this in a context of your country starting a war, but in the defense of your own country.

It is sheer ignorance on the part of anyone to say that your government (or at least my government) can simply fall under attack and be destroyed and you can still keep living your happy life in freedom and security. A government isn't just a pretty word and a concept, it is the very foundation of how a country is run, what freedoms you have, what laws are passed, it controls the distribution of money and keeps essential pieces of society running such as the police and the hospitals and fire departments, even such simple things as running water and electricity need to be regulated by a government in order to maintain.

Have you ever wondered why so many countries in Africa or the Middle East are in such a state of disarray? I'll give you a clue: The government. Either because of an upheaval in the government or utter and unchecked corruption or a complete lack of control. Either way, the government faltered and when that happens, you have chaos.
A government exists to provide stability...without it, do you honestly think you can just keep living the way you are now?

And about 97% of your countrymen being total morons who can off and die with no consequence to you? What do you think 97% of people in a country are doing? Certainly not running an entire country? Why, yes, they are. From laborers to politicians to intellectuals, you may no know them, you may not like them, but they keep you functioning. Without those 97% of morons do you think you could go down to a grocery store and purchase pre-packaged food? Nope. Or how about keep the sewer and drainage systems up and running? Don't think so. How about powering that nice little computer you're typing on, do you think you and those 3% of regular people could keep your country running efficiently? ....Hells no.

So for anyone on this thread living in a free country with all your fancy 'human rights' and 'freedom of speech' and 'running water'. If you think any of it is not worth defending or fighting for, I invite you to trade your life with someone living in a country like Sierra Leone. I know they would actually appreciate living in a country with basic human rights, laws and access to food, water, medical supplies because what you're not willing to fight for, I guarantee, if they were in your place, they would fight and more to keep the level of freedom and comfort most of you take for granted.

I believe our ancestors would be spinning in their graves to hear so many of us saying so casually that we wouldn't lift a finger to defend our own countries when so many before us fought and died to give us what we have right now.

 

[centrajapan]

the leaders of the countries should fight each other instead of making the people with no power fight each other. we live in a day and age where using violence is not tolerated so why should it be any different with countries? it would be better with a one world government in that sense but i am afarid that one world government will turn out to be a tyranny forcing the common people to have micro chip implants and be monitored every single move and not have any privacy and human rights.

in short. wars suck. if everyone thought like me there would be no wars.

 

[karlyboo]

So for anyone on this thread living in a free country with all your fancy 'human rights' and 'freedom of speech' and 'running water'. If you think any of it is not worth defending or fighting for, I invite you to trade your life with someone living in a country like Sierra Leone. I know they would actually appreciate living in a country with basic human rights, laws and access to food, water, medical supplies because what you're not willing to fight for, I guarantee, if they were in your place, they would fight and more to keep the level of freedom and comfort most of you take for granted.

Aren't most of the current problems in Kenya based on two opposing factions each fighting for their country, or at least their preferred image of it? The government recently rigged their election and the opposing parties, each fighting for what they think is best for their country, have now descended nigh into anarchy and mob-rule.

They're all fighting for their country, not perhaps in the way we might generally consider when considering this situation however. Food for thought.

 

[Haruspex]

I'm afraid I have to completely disagree with everything you just said. A country IS worth fighting for. Keep in mind, I'm not saying this in a context of your country starting a war, but in the defense of your own country.
It is sheer ignorance on the part of anyone to say that your government (or at least my government) can simply fall under attack and be destroyed and you can still keep living your happy life in freedom and security. A government isn't just a pretty word and a concept, it is the very foundation of how a country is run, what freedoms you have, what laws are passed, it controls the distribution of money and keeps essential pieces of society running such as the police and the hospitals and fire departments, even such simple things as running water and electricity need to be regulated by a government in order to maintain.
Have you ever wondered why so many countries in Africa or the Middle East are in such a state of disarray? I'll give you a clue: The government. Either because of an upheaval in the government or utter and unchecked corruption or a complete lack of control. Either way, the government faltered and when that happens, you have chaos.
A government exists to provide stability...without it, do you honestly think you can just keep living the way you are now?
And about 97% of your countrymen being total morons who can off and die with no consequence to you? What do you think 97% of people in a country are doing? Certainly not running an entire country? Why, yes, they are. From laborers to politicians to intellectuals, you may no know them, you may not like them, but they keep you functioning. Without those 97% of morons do you think you could go down to a grocery store and purchase pre-packaged food? Nope. Or how about keep the sewer and drainage systems up and running? Don't think so. How about powering that nice little computer you're typing on, do you think you and those 3% of regular people could keep your country running efficiently? ....Hells no.
So for anyone on this thread living in a free country with all your fancy 'human rights' and 'freedom of speech' and 'running water'. If you think any of it is not worth defending or fighting for, I invite you to trade your life with someone living in a country like Sierra Leone. I know they would actually appreciate living in a country with basic human rights, laws and access to food, water, medical supplies because what you're not willing to fight for, I guarantee, if they were in your place, they would fight and more to keep the level of freedom and comfort most of you take for granted.
I believe our ancestors would be spinning in their graves to hear so many of us saying so casually that we wouldn't lift a finger to defend our own countries when so many before us fought and died to give us what we have right now.

Would fight for my friends, my family, the rest do what they want. They government got involved in some war... well nice, those who follow them follow them and either die or prevail. I wouldn't... unless of course there was a possibility to gain something, say wealth. As for a defensive war... well yeah, if it threatened the region my family, friends or I live in I would fight.
But in all honesty, im glad there is pre-packaged food, drainage and whatnot, but I would rather live without them than die for the sake of those who make it, I mean come on, will there be pre-packaged food for me once im dead, huh? Not really. I don't mind sacrificing my life for a worthy cause, I don't want to bring a different subject over from a different topic, but there might be a chance that nothing awaits us after death... so forgive me, but no, im not wasting my life just for the sake of wasting it, there's nothing in it for me.
And umm... feel thankful for that 97%? Heh? They're working for their own sake, not mine, not for yours, but for theirs. They don't feel anything towards you, or me. Everyone, almost everyone is like that. We're simply rely on each other, because we have no other choice.

 

[centrajapan]

you cannot fight for your own country by invading someone elses. its like saying war is peace. i would not die for my government. infact, i hope we get a new one soon.

in norway, norway was occupied by the nazis during ww2. that sucked aparently. most people resisted in many different ways. such as simply not sitting next to a german nazi officer on trains, buses etc. if there was an officer and the seat next to it was empty they chose not to sit next to the officer. however most norwegians did not pick up any weapons and start fighting the occupation. but there was a underground resistance movement which just got stronger and stronger as the war went on. if i lived during that time would i have joined the resistance? thats a difficult question to answer. maybe i wouldnt and would have just got on with my everyday life as much as possible.

i would not want to be a traitor though. norway had a terrible traitor who sold on out on its own people. qvisling.

 

[scorpion da black]

again karlyboo san you carry on with your accusations about how i deny parts of my post and there is when you look like a hypocrite...
i never backed down..i am really surprised to see how you foul your mouth with a person you don't know well or even know what he is capable of..

now i choose not flare up a fight here over this matter and i prefer to be civil here and just respect the morals of this forum.

 

[karlyboo]

again karlyboo san you carry on with your accusations about how i deny parts of my post and there is when you look like a hypocrite...
i never backed down..i am really surprised to see how you foul your mouth with a person you don't know well or even know what he is capable of..

now i choose not flare up a fight here over this matter and i prefer to be civil here and just respect the morals of this forum.

And now the veiled threats start. Very civil indeed. Do you read what you write before you post it? It might help since you seem to have a predisposition to write things you apparently don't mean and then take umbrage at being called up on ("hermaphrodites aren't human", "it is selfish not to fight for your country" etc.).

 

[Mikawa Ossan]

I suggest, Karlyboo and Scorpion Da Black, that you cease your exchange here and remain focused on the original intent of this thread. I will not hesitate to lock this thread if your spat continues.

 

[karlyboo]

I will comply, Mikawa Ossan.

 

[Rioneru]

No. As many have stated in this thread, fighting for one's family sounds more suitable. If ever presented with the threat of having my immediate family at risk by a vicious assault on U.S. soil, there would literally have to be troops falling from the sky or the like. Even if I had family killed in an event similar to 9/11, I would probably be more upset with the government than the "perpetrators".

There are countless reasons why I wouldn't fight for this country as a whole, some of them having much to do with racism, elitism, economic reasons, placement of values (my own), etc.

 

[justin]

I would protect my family first, but if I had a chance to help my country I would.

 

[Carlson]

Not only would I but I joined the Military with the purpose of protecting and fight for my country. Also knowing I may have to take another life or give mine in order to do so. After leaving the Military I plan on pursuing a career as a Police Officer in Washington state.

Its not for everyone but I believe everyone can help "fight" in their own way.

 

[Kinsao]

I don't even really understand the concept of 'my' country. Where I happened to be born? The name on my passport? The piece of land I live on? The country where most of my ancestors/family came from even if it's none of the above? Which of those is my country? And I am damned if anyone will tell me my loyalty is decided by some name on a bit of paper e.g. passport...

So what would I be fighting for anyway? The continuation of the culture I feel most closely aligned with? The survival of my community (including friends and family, who I would most certainly fight for)? Ownership of a certain bit of land by a certain government or group? The policies and ideals of a government? The preservation of land from being taken over in a purely geographical sense? Out of fear of what 'invaders' might do to my fellow native people of the country?

It is all too confusing; I can't say I would fight for my country. I certainly have no wish to fight for England, or for the UK.