Who has been on the Japanese side of the web?

RockLee · 29 Jul 2006

kohlrak said:
As i said, i was simply stating my preferance, and you chew it up and spit it out. I hope you know there's a difference between opinion and preferance. Fine line, but there is a difference.

I hope you know it's spelled preference, not preferance. I agree with Nice Gaijing that you presume a lot.

Have you ever tried reading english that way? It'd be intresting to see if your preferance of written japanese would reflect your preferance of all written language... Personally though, i like japanese written up and down because it looks cooler that way, but that's just me. lol

Reading English vertically would be weird ☝

nice gaijin · 29 Jul 2006

Interesting story: I was reading an article in a magazine about the dwindling Chinese women's script known as nüshu, and there was a subhead (in English) printed in a vertical format. Although the sentence was printed top to bottom, left to right, I began to read it from the right side out of habit. It was interesting to realize that my experience with vertically oriented languages affected the way I read English when it is written vertically.

kohlrak · 29 Jul 2006

RockLee said:
I hope you know it's spelled preference, not preferance. I agree with Nice Gaijing that you presume a lot.

Who cares how it's spelled? =p and i was simply stating my preferEnce and he started a debate on it, and when i confronted him for it he said he couldn't resist an uneducated opinion, which... he started this based on a preferance, not an opinion. Like i said, there is a fine line between the 2. I prefer people respect that fine line.

Reading English vertically would be weird ☝

Just as weird as horizontal japanese. Only it's not considered so weird since it's become common thanks to computers. It would be an intresting "what if" page in a "what if" book. lol

nice gaijin · 29 Jul 2006

This is what I was talking about:

The only point i see in a non monospace font is that it looks pretty to some people.

Sorry for confusing this with an opinion. If anyone else interpreted this as a preference, I'd love to know.

kohlrak · 29 Jul 2006

nice gaijin said:
I just like to point out ignorance when I see it. You can't pass off your opinions for facts, no matter what the subject matter is.

That was your responce of "do you like to argue" when pointing out the irrelevance and usualness of debating about monotype fonts on a forum for learning japanese. Therefor, if that quote you last quoted is what you were referancing, you still havn't answered my question. I'm curious why you started this debate in the first place, and just because your opinion says monotype basically sucks, dosn't mean it's right so if that is what you are referancing to, you are basically saying your opinion is better than mine, which in itself is provocable.

RockLee · 29 Jul 2006

I hate people who make spellingmistakes OVER AND OVER AGAIN, even when someone points out their mistakes.

kohlrak · 29 Jul 2006

Correct and incorrect spelling habitual. The only real thing you can do is pray i start using kanji, because it's kind of hard to mispell a kanji. lol

The7thSamurai · 29 Jul 2006

Geez kohlrak, you've been on this forum for a little under a week and you've made 131 posts already! I've been here 18 months and have made only 300 or so!

kohlrak · 29 Jul 2006

i've been rather popular on other boards because of that. Actually it would be much higher than it is now if i did what i typically do. Basically i get instant notification on my screen when some one replies to a post i was active in. If i'm awake, i'll go to that post and reply. Funny thing is, i don't even care about post count, and those who do usually have low post counts. lol

nice gaijin · 29 Jul 2006

I didn't start a debate. I listed facts that you tried to dispute with your opinion. I am well-read on the subject, and you are obviously not. I did not state an opinion, and I never said that anything sucks.

You've said many things on this board that BEG to be corrected, and now I see that bothering with you is a fruitless exercise. I guess you're still in the teenie know-it-all phase.

kohlrak · 29 Jul 2006

post 10 was the start of the debate. You made a comment on my preferance in post 9. Post 9 was no promotion or demotion of a type of font, mearly an opinion. YOU made it into a debate. Now i don't plan on making who started the debate into a debate, when it is clearly obvious who made the first insitement post. You started in on my preferance, where you have no right to set foot on.

You've said many things on this board that BEG to be corrected, and now I see that bothering with you is a fruitless exercise. I guess you're still in the teenie know-it-all phase.

I find it cute, actually. Not that i'm going gay or anything.

RockLee · 29 Jul 2006

I find it annoying, I hate wiseguys

kohlrak · 29 Jul 2006

RockLee said:
I find it annoying, I hate wiseguys

Everyone's a wiseguy at some point. You just need to treat them to a nice game of high and low. The trick of the game is knowing when to quit. Ever play it? it's amazing how fun it actually is, despite it's simplicity. Remidns me of a game by a japanese programmer, really simple but addictive.

Mike Cash · 29 Jul 2006

RockLee said:
I find it annoying, I hate wiseguys

People who think they know everything annoy the hell out of those of us who actually do.

Mike Cash · 29 Jul 2006

kohlrak said:
Correct and incorrect spelling habitual. The only real thing you can do is pray i start using kanji, because it's kind of hard to mispell a kanji. lol

Actually, mistakes in kanji are easy to make and are rather frequent, even among native speakers.

kohlrak · 29 Jul 2006

What kind of mistakes? i'm refering to 1 kanji words. lol (which are usually hard to foul up on if you're using the computer.)

Mike Cash · 29 Jul 2006

Even on the computer you can select the wrong kanji. In handwriting, you can easily write either the wrong kanji or miswrite some portion of it. With words consisting of two or more kanji, the possibilities for mistakes are even greater.

kohlrak · 29 Jul 2006

True... as for the computer part, though, you should remember to use the space bar after it converts to kanji, then you can select the right one and supposedly "the custom dictionary tool" will try to remember what you picked and correct itself for next time. I just tested it, and it works, but i had to reset the custom dictionary thing because i set it to convert certain things to capitalized romaji. lol

Mike Cash · 29 Jul 2006

I have a passing familiarity with the procedure, thanks. Mistakes are still possible, and not uncommon.

kohlrak · 29 Jul 2006

Mistakes are always possible, but more and more harder to make on the computer. And when i get to the point i use kanji, i will not like to be wrong.

Mike Cash · 29 Jul 2006

They're easy to make on the computer as well thanks to the countless kanji with the same readings, and to countless words which all sound alike but are written with different kanji (sometimes with entirely different meanings, sometimes with only subtle differences). In these cases, it is the human operators' deficiencies in knowledge or attention to detail that cause the error, not the computer. The computer is just a tool that makes the error making process more speedy and efficient.

kohlrak · 29 Jul 2006

Well, i can't argue with that... much... Chances are if you input a noun, you'll get a noun... i noticed that the IME distinguishes between parts of speech. So gramatically it would likely be correct, but easily, i'm sure, you could get the wrong noun or verb. lol

yukio_michael · 30 Jul 2006

What I'm saying is that digital Japanese writing (as opposed to print writing) never seems to use all available white space to fill with characters, whatever its orientation. The effect is reading a very long scroll. I don't know what causes this--- emails I get are formated the same way.

I think, if I am studying I prefer to read Japanese horizontally because its a better format for reading translation notes, and furigana... though I think, and I may be wrong, vertical writing more propperly breaks Japanese at the particle boundary... has anyone noticed this?

Mike Cash · 30 Jul 2006

yukio_michael said:
though I think, and I may be wrong, vertical writing more propperly breaks Japanese at the particle boundary... has anyone noticed this?

If you are referring to printed matter, my experience has been that it breaks at the bottom of the line with not the slightest regard for anything whatsoever. Middle of a sentence, middle of a mile-long kanji string, before/after particles....

Maybe so a comma wouldn't be the first character of the next line....but it's too late and I'm too bleary-eyed to flip through books looking for a specimen of it now.

kohlrak · 30 Jul 2006

emails I get are formated the same way.

All email providers taht i know of convert everything to either ANSI or only allow chars 0-255.

I think, if I am studying I prefer to read Japanese horizontally because its a better format for reading translation notes, and furigana... though I think, and I may be wrong, vertical writing more propperly breaks Japanese at the particle boundary... has anyone noticed this?

Sometimes i'm tempted to type は as わ which sometimes converts it to a kanji. i might work on a DLL in assembly after learning japanese and getting back to assembly. The DLL i plan to make will allow vertical text formatting. It's not impossible, just more code. I havn't seen enough horizontal japanese sentances to notice, but i would imagin so.

If you are referring to printed matter, my experience has been that it breaks at the bottom of the line with not the slightest regard for anything whatsoever. Middle of a sentence, middle of a mile-long kanji string, before/after particles....

You mean getting cut off the page? That's because most OSes are set to have infinite vertical scroll...

Maybe so a comma wouldn't be the first character of the next line....but it's too late and I'm too bleary-eyed to flip through books looking for a specimen of it now.

And that reminds me of the comma in horizontal writing... I hate it. It's like everyhing bunched together and then there's this big ugly split like some one hitting tab in the middle of an english word. When i was first introduced to mojibake, that's what i thought they were referring to.

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