Karamuucho
後輩
- 3 Nov 2006
- 164
- 9
Distancing yourself from things you don't like isn't always a bad idea.
Not that I want anyone to leave this forum or anything, or Japan for that matter.
Just imagine if I was to say to you; you think I am ranting, you don't like it, YOU SHOULD LEAVE THIS FORUM!!!!! Don't come back!
and promt it before they post anything.
Just simply answer when he/she leaves or how long they are going to study in your country.So basicaly this would mean, that in my own native language, I could do the samethings, and people would blame it on lack in experience ? Rather than I would be doing anything wrong.
After you have been in Japan a while and gain a firm grasp of the language and culture you will come to understand that the Japanese people you refer to asking, "When are you going home", is nothing more than their attempt at starting a conversation with you, nothing more, nothing less even if they are speaking Japanese to you. After all 99% of the foreigners do end up going home after their exchange program is up. They just want to get an idea how long you will be in Japan.Mrjones said:He also says that Japanese people also do these same judgements, becouse they lack in experience communicating with foreign people. In my opinoin this is not complitely justified to be true, becouse languge which was used was Japanese. They would know, what they are speaking about.
You cannot compare the two cultures as they are completely different, like night and day. It is unfair to compare them as, in your culture, you may never dream of asking them similar questions, whereas in Japanese culture it is perfectably acceptable.So basicaly this would mean, that in my own native language, I could do the samethings, and people would blame it on lack in experience ? Rather than I would be doing anything wrong.
Mrjones, your professor is right and you shouldn't judge a people without understanding their culture first!
To "read" anything else into it like, "They must want me to leave" is just downright silly and unwarranted.
Get to know some of them and befriend them and you will have friends for life. I'm sure they'd like to get to know you better, but do not have the social skills on going about it and feel intimidated by you as they do many a foreigner. They do not have the social skills those in the west have.
Lighten up a bit and I'm sure your stay will be that more enjoyable.
You cannot compare the two cultures as they are completely different, like night and day.
/QUOTE]
1 paragraph, no, all the people will expience their first experiences first... no they dont skip to their more advanced thinking before going trough basics. Making mistakes is alright, there is no shame in that.
2 paragraph, when people ask you when you are going back as the first thing and after they recieve that information, stop communicating, is not to be accepted as friendly.... and I can live that. I dont think this world is going to be a very friendly place in the first place, even in my own country there are lot of things I dont accept.
3. so if they dont have social skills, how should I have ? I come from homogenic country too...despite I am pretty friendly and nice outside this forum (which is only place I rant out what I want, and think)
4. My country people tend to be more negative... cant help it(melancoholy)
5. I can compare two cultures to each others... I can compere cocolate and beer consumption to each others with right review tools.
As an American I am going to speak in generalities here, even though I usually hate to do so, yet I have found that a majority of the American's that I have run across here in Japan act very similarly to the one making the judgements here.MRjones - I've said it before, and I'll state it again: stop judging everything.
Everyone here has tried quite a few times to explain this to you:
You have been in Japan less than a year. Culturally, you are a child.
No - scratch that - you are a newborn baby in a world that's completely foreign to you. You can barely sit your head up properly, and even when you do, people don't interpret it as anything more than "cute."
You have a long way to go before you even completely understand WHAT is going on. It will take much longer before you are able to make value judgements.
So.... STOP MAKING VALUE JUDGEMENTS. Let it go - just try to figure out what's going on around you, don't make judgments on whether it's good or bad or rude or a comeon. This kind of judgement will always be incorrect (or if it is correct, for the wrong reason).
If you do this, your problem goes away. You don't have to worry about people being rude to you - because you aren't entirely sure they are yet (which is supported by a lot of evidence we've already provided).
It also doesn't hurt your pride, of which you seem to have an abundance of.
MRjones - I've said it before, and I'll state it again: stop judging everything.
Everyone here has tried quite a few times to explain this to you:
You have been in Japan less than a year. Culturally, you are a child.
No - scratch that - you are a newborn baby in a world that's completely foreign to you. You can barely sit your head up properly, and even when you do, people don't interpret it as anything more than "cute."
You have a long way to go before you even completely understand WHAT is going on. It will take much longer before you are able to make value judgements.
So.... STOP MAKING VALUE JUDGEMENTS. Let it go - just try to figure out what's going on around you, don't make judgments on whether it's good or bad or rude or a comeon. This kind of judgement will always be incorrect (or if it is correct, for the wrong reason).
If you do this, your problem goes away. You don't have to worry about people being rude to you - because you aren't entirely sure they are yet (which is supported by a lot of evidence we've already provided).
It also doesn't hurt your pride, of which you seem to have an abundance of.
And would you please making judgements too then ?
Why is it, that some people have to be so hard headed, to understand the value of experience be it good or bad? Certainly I agree all is not bad, most things are great, but it certainly wont stop me to defined what I see as right and what I see as not so good.
I am speaking to you from my own experience - one that is greater than your own.
I read that "greater" as to mean "more of them" rather than more "important or meaningful".Great..and why is it excately greater than mine ?
I read that "greater" as to mean "more of them" rather than more "important or meaningful".
Much can be learned from observation and keeping one's mouth shut here. Also it helps to know that many of the comments here that people make are taken and blown way out of proportion to the context that they were spoken in the first place. In my experiences here I have found many American's to be overly sensitive to what Japanese people say. That is a cultural aspect of America that I really don't like very much. American's have a need to be precise and have everything they say analyzed to death, to the detriment of all parties involved. Oh it is also a language thing too. Learning the culture behind the language can assist in understanding as well.
Lastly I see that these comments I made here dont just apply to American's either, which in a way is rather surprising because on the otherhand the majority of Europeans that I have met here during my stay in Japan have been much more culturally adept at understanding the differences between their countries.
The extension of this argument, that Japanese are somehow less sensitive to perceptions of rudeness in their own language than Americans, is a load of crock in my opinion. They don't dissect the statement as analytically perhaps, but I could just as well begin addressing friends using very formal, cold, or blunt language and report back on how well that goes over.In my experiences here I have found many American's to be overly sensitive to what Japanese people say. That is a cultural aspect of America that I really don't like very much. American's have a need to be precise and have everything they say analyzed to death, to the detriment of all parties involved.
Oh it is also a language thing too. Learning the culture behind the language can assist in understanding as well.
Quite true in my opinion as I believe Japanese to be just as sensitive. To give you an example of your last sentence: While I was about 2 years into seriously learning the language and living there at the same time, I was talking to a female friend of a friend on the phone one night. We knew each other fairly well through my friend and it was first time we had talked on the phone.Elizabeth said:The extension of this argument, that Japanese are somehow less sensitive to perceptions of rudeness in their own language than Americans, is a load of crock in my opinion. They don't dissect the statement as analytically perhaps, but I could just as well begin addressing friends using very formal, cold, or blunt language and report back on how well that goes over.
Lets see how good this rule of fives works then, when i get back home..lets say I ask from all the japanese people I see in Finland when are they going back home..and then just leave the conversation.
Mr. Jones is from Finland, right? Maybe this is off the topic. I spent a year in Oulu, Finland. Finnish people asked me the same questions, Why did you come to Finland, and what are you doing here? It happened so much, I began to think, like, god do I smell or something? Things like this can happen in any country, so take it easy Mr. Jones.
Man, you should just leave Japan if you're getting insulted quite easily.
They are just curious about foreign people and cultures, the same as if I encounter a Japanese person in the all-Mexican city of Monterrey. I would be glad to start a conversation with people that are interested to know more about myself.
But that's just me.
Mauricio
No, people who ask as first thing when do you leave, are not intrested in your culture.
honestly don't think any japanese person who just met you would be intentionally rude. because the only reason for them to be rude would be if they didn't like you or had a bad feeling about you. and if they didn't like you, they wouldn't be talking to you in the first place. they would just ignore you all together. so maybe just interpret their meaning a little differently? I'm not saying you are 100% wrong, but just try and look at things in a positive light and you will be much happier over all.
Ah, he's not doing that bad.
Beer baron posted
Unfortunately, that is not always the case. I have had people critcize me when they thought I couldn't understand what they were saying. I won't say it's common, but it happens often enough that I think mrjones is not that paranoid.Quite interesting when they learn that the other Japanese speaker might not go along with it.