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Lost In Translation ; Japan/Bill Murray

LIT was good, I'm a Murray fan so I have little to complain.
THe end kiss was actually initiated by murray cause he could have just driven by... also I think the end of the film doesn't mean that they have to seperate, after all murray is quite a famous star in the film, so finding him wouldn't be too hard. I'd say this was the better of the two films.

The Last Samurai was great and I liked it a lot, appart from the fact that Cruise lives at the end. I mean he survived a frigin hail of bullets. OPh yeah, and the EMperor speaking in English... that was a bit far fetched (and his accent was a bit camp ).
 
Brooker said:
This was one of the first threads I ever posted on, and now it's back. Wow, look at me now.

it was just a must as i watched it again yesterday and it got better. some of my japanese friends said it was so embarrassing. especially matthew from the talk-show. but, hey, they don't only hav such nutty birds in japan. ☝
it's much funnier for people who know japan, tho.
 
Ok, I'm sorry, but I just have to bring this back.

I know I'm wayyyyyyyyy late, but I just watched it on DVD. That is what happens when one has no one to watch movies with...

Anyway, I absolutely loved it. I thought Bob and Charlotte had great chemistry and I kept thinking, "why don't they just do it?!", but I'm glad it didn't happen. I think it was just perfect the way it ended up. I love both Scarlett Johansson and Bill Murray too, so maybe I'm a bit biased.

Also, I didn't think it was too stereotypical. I actually thought it was right on the money in most situations.

A very good movie that I will be watching over and over again.

So, what do you think he said to her?
 
The ending kinda confused me, think i might have to watch it again.

The bit when the woman was asking him to "lip her stockings" made me laugh so much.
 
That was hilarious. I loved it when she started kicking and screaming down on the floor.
 
On the ending, Bob Harris felt that the goodbye in the hotel lobby was insufficient. Lucky for him, he spots Charlotte from the limo and dashes out to really express himself and do a much more meaningful goodbye.

Although you can't really hear much when he whispers in her ear, but I caught that he wants her to join him on some sort of tour.
 
Just picked the dvd up a fw weeks ago. Good flick. I liked it a lot. I'd like to know where Coppola came up with the idea. Great one. I was a little dissappointed with the lounge singer situation. Dunno why, just am. But overall, good choice in actors. Well, perfect choice for Murray.
 
kirei_na_me said:
That was hilarious. I loved it when she started kicking and screaming down on the floor.

One of my favororite scenes....hahah

Also, "Sinatora, do you know Sinatora"
 
kirei_na_me said:


So, what do you think he said to her?

I think he said something like: "I have an idea for you book now. Write about us.."
 
Miss_apollo7 said:
I think he said something like: "I have an idea for you book now. Write about us.."


Really? You really must have good ears because all I can get out of it is "mumble, mumble...tour...mumble."
 
ArmandV said:
Really? You really must have good ears because all I can get out of it is "mumble, mumble...tour...mumble."

HEHEHE... Yes, I have a very good imagination......
 
i whent to see this for my 16th *feels like so long ago*
i adored the film, and i'd really like to see it again.
being a huge ghostbusters fan, i love bill murry... he's such a great guy, and i loved his character... i think he really made it his own.

the thing i loved about this film... ws that id DIDN'T make a huge thing about japan. it >could< just have easily been set in russia... but... i think the fact it was did leave a lot of opportunity for some great jokes.
there were some really beautifull shots of tokyo... and i loved that they could just have it there in the background. they didn't play out with typical traditional japan, or make any serious steiotypes... it was just there hmming pleasently in the background... and i think it gave me a really good idea of what it would be like to be ther as a foriner(sp?).
lol, me being the ad act i am, i cryed at some of the shots of tokyo because it was so beautiful... but i loved the sublty of the story... and how it just worked....

ofcause, i was the ONLY one who liked the film ^^; i think my friends put up wth it because it was my birthday... but in general thay hated it and said it was 'boring'.
... but hen they're into the cruddyness of typical hollywood drivil in which you've got a hott guy, who meets a hott girl and they have a 'problem' about being together but in the end it's all hugs and kisses and they get together.... *ugh* THAT bores me
 
i really liked that movie. it was so beautiful and fun! My favorite part was the pole dancers lol
 
i watched this boring movie called "lost in translation"
what a terribe movie!
i got really annoyed it and hate it.
does this direator want to made japanese people mad?
most japanese feel annoying this movie because it make a fool of japan and japanese.
i know the story isn't about japan but yet!
there is no such a useless interpretation and there aren't such a japanese.
if they wanna make a film overseas,they need to know about japan.
there are guy who say this film draw about japan well,but do you really know about japan?
maybe i think you don't know real japan.
you may image wrong japan by mistake.
i like hollywood movie very much,but it is the most trashy movie i've ever seen.
 
I have to agree with kenken.
At first I was really excited about this movie. I had heard an excerpt from the movie (the whiskey commercial scene), and it sounded really funny. But then I saw this beast. Honestly the only reason I saw it to its end was the fact that I had paid money to rent it. I can't say say enough enough bad things about it.

Bill Murray, who I usually like, was about 2 shades from a coma, he was so deadpan.
Granted I don't live in Kabuki-cho, but that is not the Japan that I know. The Japan I know is nowhere near so decadent, although I don't deny that decedence exists aplenty.
The story romanticizes an extra-marital affair.
It wasn't funny, moving, provacative, or even interesting.
It was annoying. I am very happy that I will never have to see it again.
 
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the director is interested in japan and has many japanese friends, and lived there working and exploring in her 20's.

can you give examples where this movie makes a fool of japan and japanese? i think the one place the movie is silly in this way is the times when Bob cannot understand with the mixup of sounds of "L" and "R".
i don't think this reflects poorly on Japanese, but on the American who cannot understand - it makes a fool of Americans who have little understanding of a world or types of English language that are different from their own.

the film touches on the issue that they American characters DON'T know the real japan at all. Charlotte wants to learn things - the language barrier stops her learning further, but she sees a temple, flower arranging, etc.
Bob doesn't really want to be in Japan but he needs the money... so he isn't interested in the japanese 'culture' he is first presented with: a western hotel, strict business schedules and severe lack of freedom within that, etc.

Bob starts to change when he goes off with Charlotte to hang out with those friends of hers, and they talk and stuff in those bars and clubs and sing karaoke and all that - kenken, is that NOT what Japan is like? it was like that all the times i've been there - i have favourite bar in Tokyo where i went alone and made friends with Japanese people there and drank and sang and had a great time. this is not Japan?


I think the image of Japan the movie shows is not wrong - all those things are there, and exist and are real. You must think its wrong because that is not your Japan, that is not how you see or experience or know Japan.

unfortunately, if you say "this is wrong, it is not Japan" and you do not think 'maybe for some people - for confused gaijin - this IS Japan', then maybe that means you are ignoring other cultures and other ways Japan can be seen?
 

I liked the movie, but I can totally understand why Kenken doesn't. While, yes, all of those things exist in Japan, together they don't present anywhere near an accurate representation of Japan.

Now movies don't have to make accurate representations of reality, which is one of the reasons I still like the movie. But on the other hand, I know that if I saw a movie that presented a lopsided view of Canada by exaggerating some aspect of our society (ie everybody plays hockey and likes beer) then I'd probably find it annoying. I've never met an Australian (for example) who doesn't hate "Crocodile Dundee" with a passion for pretty much the same reason.

So I can see why Japanese people wouldn't like the movie. It makes Japan look like this crazy place which it really isn't. As a film I liked it a lot, great acting, great soundtrack, great cinematography. But I'm looking at it from the perspective of a foreigner.
 
hmm a good point i suppose...

i like crocodile dundee by the way ... i don't care much for steve irwin though so i do see what you're saying..

i've travelled around australia though and seen the kind of places the dundee movies are set in and i know that while they're telling tall tales in the story of the movie, the backdrops and the characters are real or are based on real kinds of people.

i didn't see any truly offensive and outright wrong portrayals of japan or japanese people in 'lost in translation'... but i do accept that i am a foreigner - not to say my view is wrong, but it's of course different.


p.s. yay canada <3
 
My husband was offended by it...

I thought it was GREAT.

I'd go more into detail on my thoughts about it, but I think I can spare the controversy...
 
I went out and bought the DVD based on the recommendations and reviews. Honestly, my wife and I just didn't get the movie. I wish now I had rented it instead.

Perhaps I will have to watch it again as I too thought it was a boring movie. Maybe I should pay more attention to the story line instead of concentrating on it being filmed in Japan with all it's exagerations and all. If I were to rate it on just one viewing I would give it a "thumbs down."
 
I thought this was a GREAT movie. I loved the whole -love story, not a love story, love story, maybe could be a love story, yeah it was a love story- journey that it takes us on.

It pokes fun at a little of Japan's current culture, but a quick glance through the J-Pop section shows me that maybe someone needed to. I didn't think it went over the top in any way though. It showed what I would imagine an American like me would feel like in Japan.

Whether or not Japan is really as crazy as the movie shows, I think an outsider like me or Bill Murray's character would probably see it that way on an initial visit. I could be wrong though.

I thought it was hilarious and is definitely a Top Ten movie on my personal list. I also really wonder what he whispered to her.
 
I just rewatched this movie about an hour ago. First time I watched it was about two years ago. Since that time, I have:
- studied Japanese for a year and a half
- been to Japan twice
- seen about 30 episodes of Matthew's Best Hit TV
- eaten sukiyaki for the first time

It's a different show now, but I still loved it, possibly even more.
 
Revisiting this thread & topic a good 15 months after its last post...

I was saddened by the negative comments about LIT, particularly from Japanese posters. I wish I could change their minds though, because I love this movie and I love Japan. I wish everybody could watch this movie and see how amazing Japan is.

The big issues of it seeming offensive to Japanese viewers depends on how it is viewed in the context of what other western films the viewers have seen & their understanding of how westerners understand Japan. I think if only the stereotypes are taken into consideration, then only the stereotypes will be seen when watching the movie.


As an example: The scene where Bob and Charlotte are in the elevator with many Japanese businessmen. Bob towers over the Japanese, height-wise.

Perhaps a Japanese person sees that and thinks "Americans are so rude and ignorant, making us look small in comparison to them".
I saw it and thought "Wow, Bob feels so out of place, and being so tall isn't helping the feeling."
To be stuck thinking about stereotypes is to miss the point of the scene, and also be ignorant to the fact that Bill Murray is very tall - stereotypes aside, he is going to tower over just about anybody & the camera simply captures this. I feel like asking critics "Wouldn't it be false to cover up this height difference with movie-tricks, just so you're not offended by reality?".


The "Lip my stocking" scene where Bob is somewhat fighting with the lady to understand and be understood.
I know just about everybody complains that the "L/R sound" joke is old. Yes it is. I agree and think the scene is a bit too silly. I don't even like watching it on repeat viewings of the DVD.

I guess the 'offensive' bit to Japanese is where she can't pronounce "Rip". But really, when I watched it I thought to myself "ok, Bob just can't understand what she's saying - it's Bob's problem and Bob's mistake". Again, HOW a particular person interprets this scene is affected by their opinions and experiences (or lack thereof).

As an Australian who has travelled in the United States and Canada, and who lives in Canada, I have been on both sides of the misunderstanding-accented-English fence. It really comes from a lack of context, or a failure to recognise the context of the meaning of the words. Bob in the movie is slow on the uptake, and can't place the context for the action of ripping with what he hears her saying ("lip my stocking").

I work at a copy shop and just this Saturday a lady came in and asked for a colour copy of a photo she had with her. I said "What kind of paper would you like it on?" because we have glossy and matte and thin and heavy and so on.
She looked at me and said (in my accent) "Paper?" (in her accent) "What's that?"
I'll explain now that the way I say paper could be spelt "paypa" in 2 very short syllables. She says "paiprrr" with one short and one long syllable (the 2nd emphasising the "R" on the end of paper, in contrast to my completely dropping the "R").

If she had made the connection from photocopiers, printing materials and the word I said, she should have been able to work out that I meant paper. I doubt she was expecting that I would have an accent though, so the strange pronunciation of paper caught her off-guard and she was unable to quickly interpret what I meant.

Similarly, Bob is in his western hotel room on his 2nd night (? I forget) in Japan where he definitely is not fitting in yet. All of a sudden he is faced with a somewhat persistent and roleplayingly-dramatic female company, and he's not even close to thinking about sex or stocking ripping - he just wants her to leave - so he's not making the connection between the words he hears and what they mean based on the context.

Later on when he's in the crowded bar with Charlotte and is talking with Charlie Brown and his friends, he's not mixing up L's and R's. He's been in Japan a bit longer, he's more familiar with how Japanese English accents sound, and he's in a more relaxed environment. This kind of contrast I find is a very realistic representation of human interactions when faced with language and accent barriers - under pressure it's very difficult and when relaxed it's easy.


I don't believe LIT portrays a 'lopsided' or false view of Tokyo or Japanese people. Based on my travels and experiences in Japan and other places, I find it to be very very realistic. I think if people are offended or feel it's unrealistic, there is something they are ignoring or not understanding which is clouding their judgment.
 

Nothing is being ignored or clouding their judgment, its just that naturally Japanese people have a different view of their society and culture than you as a tourist would have.

Yes, as a representation of Tokyo from the point of view of American tourists staying there for a few days the film is probably accurate. From the point of view of a Japanese person who has lived in Tokyo their whole life however the film paints a picture that is wildly at odds with their own experience.

The "Rip my stockings" scene wasn't offensive because of the pronounciation issue. Some people find it offensive because it portrays Japanese women as ridiculous, submissive, sexual objects willing to humiliate themselves at the feet of foreign men. If I was a Japanese woman, I would HATE that scene.
 

Exactly! It has nothing to do with the wrong pronunciation.
I would not be offended if it is all about the pronunciation, as it does reflect the fact and truth.

And yes, I do hate that scene. Most embarrassing, annoying, and offensive.
 
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