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Did you move to Japan because you don't like your home country?

JerseyBoy

Back in town
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I hope I am not duplicating the other threads. Even though there are a few threads on why you moved to Japan (which typically focus on the positives), I have not seen the thread from the opposite perspective. In the former threads, people say I moved to Japan because I like this or that. But, I think there are people came to Japan because of the multiple choice elimination method.

By this, I mean there would be some people who picked Japan as their next destination because they could not stand where they are living now or because they got bored with the country in which they live.

I moved to USA from Japan more than 10 years ago because of that thinking (i.e., which one am I interest in, Japan, USA, UK, France, Germany, China, and others) and I came to the conclusion "home" feels better after all those years in USA. I want to add there is nothing wrong with the other choices as I have picked any one of them as long as I felt I could find my way in that country.
 
I definitely came to Japan to get out of the US, and I know others who did as well. I won't name names because some spook from the Ministry of National Security or IRS is probably reading this forum right now. I just got sick of all the war hysteria, heavy police presence in my life and general rottenness of people. Life's better here. It's more of a free country.
 

I beg, but why wolold some 'spook' from the Government be spying on a public, clean and harmless forum?

And another thing, I lived in the U.S. and I didn't encounter people with any degree of 'rottenness'. I loved it. I think it just might be you, but i cannot just judge like that since I don't know your particular case.

Mauricio
 
maybe Greg JetRock has something to hide. I lived in the US my whole life and have never seen a big police presence anywhere. Well except the local coffee shop. Anyway, I was just informed that we will be living here for 6 months and then we will live in the US for 6...I am not sure how that will work, and for how long...as it only a concession for me. But, I am not escaping from the US or escaping to Japan, it's where my husbands work is and that is what comes first. There are things that I really love about Japan, yet it is still not home, nor will it ever be...but I can enjoy myself while here, and I can be happy here. That's what matters.
 
You sound like a fugitive. There's no such thing as the Ministry of National Security in the US or Japan, and what would the IRS have to do with this?

There has never been a "heavy police presence" in my life. If there was one in your life, it was probably because you were breaking the law.
 
Greg JetRock said:
I definitely came to Japan to get out of the US, and I know others who did as well.
Click to expand...
Yes, and thre are a large number of people who move out of Japan, to get away from Japan... including the Japanese.

Greg JetRock said:
I won't name names because some spook from the Ministry of National Security or IRS is probably reading this forum right now.
Click to expand...
You haven't been reading too much George Orwell recently have you? I'm sure the Minitru isn't watching this forum. Do you know what the IRS actuall does?

Greg JetRock said:
I just got sick of all the war hysteria, heavy police presence in my life and general rottenness of people. Life's better here. It's more of a free country.
Click to expand...
Not to be duplicitous of what has already been said--- but you describe the United States as if you were describing war-torn Bosnia... Where did you live where there was such a heavy police presence? If anything, there isn't even propper funding for heavy police presence... and furthermore, the "War Hysteria" as you call it of late is on how best to end the war...

I hate it when people outside of the United States make ill-informed statements about the state of US society, and yet it always irks me even more when actual US Citizens do it.

~

I came to Japan because of a girl (this surprises no one)... I had some interest in Japan, and the language, before that--- So I wasn't completely green... but it was a great if not at times difficult experience to actually live there for some time. I know what to do differently the next time.

There are pros & cons to living in Japan... I'll say that right now I miss Japan quite a bit, but I would hardly say that I ever would go there to 'escape' where I am living now... To an extent, if you chose to live there, you chose to live with the good and the bad, for whatever reason, and I don't always think that it's necissarily because you had to make an exodus from your origins.
 
Greg JetRock said:
general rottenness of people.
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I am not here to offend American people. But, even though his comment is too strong and rather a blanket statement, I tend to feel that "civility" of people in America is not as civil as people in Japan. There are always people who are rude, arrogant, biased, nasty, and whatever negative adjective you can come up with in every country and society including Japan.
But, after living in the States, I noticed I come across with "uncivil" people more often than I used to do in Japan. There is nothing wrong with that; I just feel that is a national character. I think that would be one of the reasons I don't want to stay in the country any longer.
The extreme example is riots or thefts during or after the time of natural disasters or civil unrest in USA (LA riot, New Orleans food, and etc). As far as I can recall about the disasters which occurred recently such as the Kobe earthquake in Japan, people tend to be civil and line up for daily necessity (such as water and food) instead of going for a take-all-you-can-get bonanza.
 
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I would have to point out that this would be relevent to where you are at the time that you notice these people...meaning, peoples attitudes and character change depending upon location. I don't think that Japanese people are more civil, but I do think that they tend to mind their own business more and show a general lack of emotion at times. They may not like you, but they won't exactly show it.

In the US, in larger cities I have found people to be less civil, while in smaller communities I found people to be quite friendly and nice. People waving at people that they didn't even know. Saying "hi" when you pass someone, and generally being nicer. So, I would say that attitude is relative to location. I don't think that you could count out the entire US as being un-civil...just as you can't say that all of Japan is nice.
 
Personaly, I think it is quite difficult to stay civil in a state of emergency especially when you can't even get clean water or any help from your government when you most need it. However, there are always those people who are willing to sacrifice their own to save others' lives in the US. Note the firefighters, policemen and other brave people who supported each other after 9/11 attack, and there are still volunteers who go to New Orleans just to help people gutt their houses so it can be rebuilt.

Sorry, it is kind of off-topic, but I just wanted to point that out.
 
Um.. I haven't moved, but I would for that reason, I don't like mexico, it's too... um.. depressing. On the other side, I don't quite like the US to live. Maybe to work, since I live in the border and my national coin is quite devaluated before USD, but not really... I have know a lot of different people from the US, some very nice, some not as nice, and some completely indiferent--- I don't know how would japan be like, but I really don't think it would be so different socially speaking.
 
If you look at my post, I used the words carefully so that it does not sound like a blanket statement. One important sentence I put there says there are always people who are rude, arrogant, and etc in every country including Japan. My comments are strictly based on what I've seen and experience in NY Metro, upstate NY rural areas, NJ suburbs, MD, CT, VA, PA, and NC. I am not here to start I-hate-this-country type of thread as that does not make me feel any better and also that does not achieve any purpose because each person's perspective and experience would be different anyway.
 
That explains a lot. Rude and arrogant may be how things are done in the Northeast, in fact it's one thing the region is most notorious for. I've certainly encountered way more of those unfriendly and unhelpful types in Japan who feel contempt for foreigners and especially foreigners learning Japanese than where I live in the upper Midwest or my family resides in rural NC. It could be because I'm a native to the area. I'd never call it a national characteristic.
 

This reason why behind this is easy to identify: Self interest vs group interest. (us v japan). Both schools of thought have their good and bad reprecussions, and this is one of the bad for the us
 
Elizabeth posted

That explains a lot. Rude and arrogant may be how things are done in the Northeast, in fact it's one thing the region is most notorious for.
Click to expand...

Virgina and Pennsylvania are not in the Northeast, nor is North Carolina, another place the OP mentioned. As to people being rude and arrogant there, I haven't noticed that anymore than other places in the US. Certainly most of the Northeast would be more fast paced than rural NC or the Midwest, though than again, if you lived or visited in northern NH, VT, or ME, you would feel very much at home. A lot slower paced, and generally people are friendiler than in the cities, but that is generally true for any country or portion of the US (city vs rural folk).
 
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Gentleman10 said:
This reason why behind this is easy to identify: Self interest vs group interest. (us v japan). Both schools of thought have their good and bad reprecussions, and this is one of the bad for the us
Click to expand...

This really is a pro of Japanese culture. I didn't think about it. Whenever I think of the group-thing in Japan, I think of the bullying at schools, but now you just bought this to light and I like it a lot: in Japan people generally don't steal, they do things in orderly fashion, etc. and all this is because 'us' comes before 'I'.

Mauricio
 
Seems to be changing. It used to be you could calmly leave things of value to hold your seat in a coffee shop while you went to the rest room, I wouldn't try it now.

I had someone steal my toilet paper off a train at the terminal in Takadanobaba. If it's not nailed down and it doesn't seem to belong to anyone (I had left the train for approx 1.5 minutes), then it often disappears.
 

sorry man, but I think you completely misinterpreted what I was saying. I was feeling lazy when writing 'us' so I left it uncapitalized while referring to the united states.
But now that I look at your response, you're hitting my point but from the wrong perspective. Think of it this way, when I say both schools of thought have their good and bad points, that implies that both countries are *Essentially just as good*. I'm not trying to say one country's system is better than the other, b/c that frankly isn't true. I think group unity is just as good and bad as the idea of Western independece, because they *both* have their good and bad reprecussions. When you say ppl do things in an orderly fashion, you have to ask yourself why this happens. Is it because the people feel naturally inclined with all the sunshine in their lives just to say "I'm going to follow the rules"? Of course not lol. I believe this is because there is a social *pressure* (and pressure is generally considred a bad thing) on the individual to conform in Japanese society and to follow the rules and "keep things orderly" so to speak. Thus, Japan has an exceedingly low crime rate (a good thing) at the cost of the individual being socially pressured by the group to maintain order on a much larger level that most western countries (good or bad depending on the way you look at it). As a result though, Japan has the highest suicide rate in the world.... (a bad bad bad thing).
From the Western perspective, I think the results of independent conflict are self evident. Everyone kills rapes and maimes each other much more than in Japan. But once you think about it, are we socially pressured to hide our feelings and conform to the norm? Hell no we aren't. And as a result, is our suicide rate anywhere near as astronomical as Japan's...? No, because instead, as you said, I think Westerners (at least Americans) freely *express* emotions than hide them, and thus, we are a more violent people.

In summary, what I really think you meant is that Japan is a much more aesthecially pleasing country than say America. But I don't think this necessarily means that the way they operate their society is better by any means (nor do I think its worse, I'm simply indifferent to both b/c they both have their good and bad, only they're expressed in different ways).
 
I dont know what to say except that is why I hate generalizations. I have been to numerous small towns that are completely closed to outsiders and large cities that are diverse, extremely friendly and more open than the smallish community of my current residence. The airport at Chicago is one of the two busiest in the country for instance, why are the workers there so much more congenial, jovial, customer-oriented than any place in New York (although it has been a few years since my last visit...). Sorry theres not time to finish this off, but you get the general point. ^^ Its also so obvious, having been made so many times here in the past...
 
I agree that there is more group think going on in Japan compared to USA. There are pros and cons on this as anything in the world does (nothing is perfect as far as anything human is involved). The example you have raised portray negative aspects of both countries. In a nutshell, there is a higher suicide rate among Japanese while there is a higher murder and violent crime rate in USA. To put it simply (extremely simply, if I may add), the difference seems either killing yourself (Japan) or kill someone else (USA). Either choice does not seem good.
 
Jersey boy, I'd go with that, but many people do prefer making the choice themselves rather than someone else deciding .

Elizabeth posted
I know what you mean. There are some places where similar to Japan, you may never be fully accepted as a local resident. But I hardly think you will find people unfriendly, and they would never hang a sign saying you're not welcome because of them being afraid of what you might do, as they do in some places in Japan.

My experiences have been different at the Chicago airport, I must be scarier looking !
 
I think you're much more likely to find people don't necessarily hate their home country, state, or town, but definitely needed a change. That was my case. I lived in Austin -- a great little town. You can enjoy both big city and small town life to an extent. The people are open-minded and tolerant as well. The problem is that it gets small. After 3 years, I felt I knew everyone and had done everything.

Tokyo offered a lot more. After 7+ years, there is always more to do...different worlds of people. If you speak Japanese, there's an unlimited supply of people you can meet.

In my absence, I am afraid that the states has become less & less attractive. Current regime set aside, I feel I cannot simply mind my own business in even small American cities. Brittany Spears is always there with me at the grocery store when I pay for my goods, people are always panhandling for change to ride the bus (some legitimiately, some not)... always seems someone is there in my face. In Japan, despite the noise polution and screaming, I can always duck my head and go on about my business it seems. To me, that is worth a lot.
 
I want to live in tokyo but my girlfreind wouldnt have it britain is a depressing sesspit the sooner it sinks the better sorry to fellow brits who are patriotic but damn i hate it here.
 
Moving soon? Probably.

Thanks for starting this thread.
This is a particularly timely question for myself and my family. Considering just myself, I am not particularly in love with my home country -the United States- and have plenty of both good and bad things to say about it. Issues involving Politics and the involvement of Religion in Politics, the lack of willingness for individuals to consider the whole above their own immediate desires, and a general burn-out on the whole fight to survive nature of US culture which dominates everything from playgrounds to corporation hallways all contribute to my melancholy about today's America.
Personally Religion is a big item as in the United States to admit you are an Atheist publicly can have sometimes severe consequences. Frustration over this issue and many associated with the mentality that creates it makes me look abroad for a place to relocate. Someplace which has moved beyond the 17th century.
We both abhor the political situation in the US which only seems to get worse by the day, despite the Congressional party shift of November 2006. We are both frustrated as the increasing penetration of Religion and its ﾂ"valuesﾂ" into our daily lives and we want our daughter to be raised free of it. Our disgust in the American corporate system (we both rose fairly high and fairly fast in a large corporation- this is no sob story) and how it owns us all is repulsive. Of course Politics has its own issues in Japan, but they pale in comparison. Japan also has socio-economic issues but many of them arise from mimicking the perceived success of the American system.
Now this being said, a simple search on my username will reveal that I have a Japanese wife, a half- Japanese daughter, and a very loving family in Japan. We also have great potential there whereas in the USA we are on a repetitive day to day, if somewhat high-upper middle class existence. We have many things of material value which would make some think we are doing quite well, but both of us miss Japan; my wife more so, understandably. We cannot complain about what we have achieved, at least financially, but there is more to life than that.
In less than 20 days we will visit Japan for the first time in 3 years, and for the first time with our daughter, my in-laws only grandchild. Within 24 hours we will be on national television, and the remainder of the trip spent in similar fashion, full of excitement and adventure. Of course this exciting lifestyle has little to do with myself and everything to do with my wife's family. Nevertheless, I am running out of excuses to tell my wife why after nearly ten years her life in the US still pales in comparison to what awaits us should we return to Japan.
In all, I probably would not -perhaps realistically could not- move to Japan on my own. I am not my family however, and I can no longer paint things with a happy brush for my wife. We have another life calling us. One where we will be free of many of the things we find so difficult here. There will be issues of another type in Japan, issues we are ready for, but for us the trade off is more than worth it. Before long my postings will likely be coming from the other side of the planet, far from Boston, and deep in Kamakura.
I wish you all happiness no matter where you decide to live.
 
tokyo seems like a big degenerate city which suits me well
 
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