Question for you sir, how then can I or others for that matter ask if their, the comfort women's, stories are believable or not to other members.
Obeika said:However for myself anyway, just asking whether someone believes them or not really has nothing to do with verification does it?
In turn, a good question; yes. I'd tend to think that asking in a manner that would allow for shades of possibilities would be the way to go.
Yes, I agree with that, and for that very reason, would follow by adding that for that very reason, a person's statement of belief or non-belief is a matter of information. To that degree, then, hearing ones belief would be information gathering alone. For that reason, I in all due respect, feel it'd be best to let what has been said, be there on the record much more so than being seen as a point in an ongoing argument; something that must be drawn up again (and again).
Mars Man is quite perceptive!This one from Mikawa-Ossan, with regards to this reply I am interested in hearing why he wrote that it can not be answered with a simple yes or no.
I hope he stops by and reads this as well, and maybe we can get an idea into why he feels the way he does.
Another related article:
Abe apologizes to U.S. Congressional leaders over 'comfort women'
http://mdn.mainichi-msn.co.jp/national/news/20070427p2a00m0na009000c.html
You should say that the issue was just politicised until much later....
This is a better point you bring up, but you must remember, the real size of the problem was not known until much later
...
You should say that the issue was just politicised until much later.
But then, the Korean government had still hid the info which Japan even suggested she should pay the indivisual compensation during the normalisation talk and I think Japan did not say "everything was settled" back then, for the democracy in South Korea had been unstabled in 80'.
Why?...
Which as you know has absolutely nothing to do with whether Japan owes these women compensation or an apology.
Actually, I thought it was evident that I thought that yes, I do think that some of them told the truth. I just don't know how many of them are doing so.Yet Dicek and pipokun and others didn't answer this at all, just talked about what had been paid or signed or making some primarily irrelevant comparisons. Only Mikawa attempted, but didn't seem to answer, to my mind. Again, Mikawa, it's not a yes or no we're seeking, we're just asking if you believe if any of them told the truth?
Morally, the practice of coerced comfort women was bad.
Legally, Japan has settled with both China (the second article alludes to this, even though it's only in Japanese) and S. Korea when they normalized relations, and they are not longer liable for further damages.
You can argue the morality of the situation until you're blue in the face, but the (legal status) horse will still continue to live.
Well, remember when I said:However the issue of the comfort women was not covered by the compensation that Japan paid to Korea.
The issue of the Comfort Women came up long after compensation had ben paid, please correct me if I am wrong here.
?Me said:Forced laborers are separate issue from the comfort women, however, unless comfort women are included among "forced laborers".
I am not unsympathetic to your point. However, if comfort women are included in the interpretation of "forced laborers", then they legally become the same issue. Since the issue of compensation for forced laborers has been legally settled, it means that if comfort women are included in that category, their compensation has also been legally settled.
However, if comfort women are included in the interpretation of "forced laborers", then they legally become the same issue
Obviously, it becomes a country by country basis.Ok, for arguments sake here, let's put aside the issue of the Korean Comfort Women, how then how should the rest of the "comfort women" and their claims against Japan be decided?
The current argument or discussion seems to center upon the Korean women alone. While they consitute the majority of the women making claims against Japan there are numerous others that have claims as well.
Are they also covered by the compensation that Japan paid to Korea for it's "misdeeds" per say from WWII?
It was covered. And just think why Koreans are upset now for their govenment policy which invested the moeny for their growth, though I think they were right things for Korea.However the issue of the comfort women was not covered by the compensation that Japan paid to Korea.
The issue of the Comfort Women came up long after compensation had ben paid, please correct me if I am wrong here.
It was covered. And just think why Koreans are upset now for their govenment policy which invested the moeny for their growth, though I think they were right things for Korea.
I always see someone like gaijinalways or obeika saying German did right things and Japan did nothing.
Yes, Germany did right things you may call, i.e. indivisual compensation, however, but look at frustraion esp. in the former East European nations about the right indivisual compensation.
I don't know which is better, indivisual compensation or comprehensive one like the Treaty of Peace with Japan.
I can say Japan should have forced Korea or China to offer indivisual compensation, considering their current hypocracy loudly saying, "we can forgive, but never forget". But I don't think the government should say loudly, "we compensated the countries".
As to whether Japan compensates the victims even though there is no legal necessity for them to do so, that is up to the Japanese government to decide. Whatever they decide, Japan will have to live with the consequences of their actions. (And here I am referring to their present actions of whether they further compensate past comfort women or not.)
I guess we just disagree here. I don't think that 'all' of them are accurately depicting the past. But that'S not to say that I think 'all' of them are lying, either. The question itself wasn't very nuanced, and I was just taking it at face value.Mikawa, perhaps I wasn't clear enough; remember when you said thank you to Marsman? You stated you earlier were having a hard time answering the question because of the word 'all'. But as I stated, I don't see where the addition of 'all' makes any differance in answering the question.
Here we don't actually disagree to the extent that any accusations are in fact, true. That's why I said this earlier:Please reread my previous comments. Obviously Germany and Switzerland also didn't have any legal necessity to do so either, but they did it. Hence, you don't see people complaining about what they did and the appearance of their apologies has more force. Contrast this with Japan where they keep trying to remove references to what the Japanese consider behavour that downgrades the image of what Japanese like to think of as their pure and honorable image. In addition, in Austria people dismissing the Holocaust (another deplorable part of WWII history) can be fined and jailed as was David Irving, but in Japan these people can become Prime Minister!
Remember; 'Those that can not remember the past are condemned to repeat it.' (Santayana)
Myself said:Whatever they decide, Japan will have to live with the consequences of their actions.
I thought that when those were posted, this thread died.
It was covered. And just think why Koreans are upset now for their govenment policy which invested the moeny for their growth, though I think they were right things for Korea.
I always see someone like gaijinalways or obeika saying German did right things and Japan did nothing.