The United States of America

[Nuala]

The USA is a federal constitutional republic, it comprises fifty states, and a federal district. Within it are over 309 million people. It has 3,790,000 square miles of land, and is the third largest country by land area and population. It is one of the world's most ethnically diverse, and multicultural nations. We won the revolutionary war on September 3, 1783 with the help of France, Spain, and the Netherlands.

We fought in the American Revolution, War of 1812, Mexican-American War, the Civil War, Spanish-American War, World War I, World War II, Korean War, Vietnam War, Desert Storm, and the Iraq/Afghanistan war we are currently fighting.

As a country, our true identity is that of the world's, considering almost every American alive today can trace their ancestry back to a foreign country.

I'm wondering what's everyone's view on the United States of America. Have we assumed the mantle of evil empire? Are we religious nuts? Run by corporations? I'm curious, so indulge yourselves and explain how you feel about it.

 

[Hezam]

What i know is that the united states has one of the best domestic policy and has one of the worst criminal foreign policy..
And it's shame to be proud of Vietnam War, Desert Storm, and the Iraq/Afghanistan war,These wars are the most evil wars happend in the 21th century and in the history (including the two nuclear bombs on Japan).
So the united states (as i know) has good and bad sides,It's very bad from outside as much as it's beautiful from inside.
honestly, the American people most of them are victims of the foreign policy,I don't hate them,I like them,They are very interesting/kind/lovely/smart people.
But the politicians are devils,murderers,liers....Everywhere in this planet.

 

[Nuala]

I wouldn't say we're proud of the wars, Hezam. We're proud of the people who fought in them. Which is understandable enough, even if you hate the war, you have to respect the people going to a foreign country to fight it. It's loyalty, and is highly respectable.

Furthermore, The Japanese military was not innocent in World War II, Hezam. Between 1937 and 1945, the Japanese military murdered between 3,00,000 to over 10,000,000 million Chinese, Indonesian, Korean, Filipino, Indochinese, and Western prisoners of war.

I guess I shouldn't forget to mention the human experimentation by the Japanese military. Could you imagine vivisection without anesthesia, or amputation? Would you enjoy being placed into a high-pressure chamber until you die, or buried alive? How about the tests performed on prisoners/civilians with plague, cholera, smallpox, botulism, and so on? Millions of civilians in Southeast Asia died during a preventable famine in 1944-45. Those are some of the crimes committed by the Japanese military during World War 2.

Japan did not agree to the terms of the Potsdam Declaration. Thus the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were carried out. It brings tears to my eyes when I consider the ramifications of those horrible bombings, but I believe that the Allied forces during WW2 had no other choice.

In regards to the Cold War? It was insane and had more players in it than just the United States and the Soviet Union, which the Vietnam War would fall under. God, I don't even know where to start with the goddamn Cold War.

 

[Revenant]

I see the United States as somewhat corrupt world police. They'll at times go after countries that have nuclear ambitions, they'll at times create false charges to invade a country, and they'll occasionally attempt to prevent true injustices.

I also see the United States as a powerhouse innovator, providing great rewards to innovators, but providing little support to those less fortunate.

A mixed bag of religious nuts, proud gun owners, retributive justice, and the liberal progressives in opposition of all that.

The atomic bombs on Hiroshima were dropped to provide Japan with incentives to sign an unconditional surrender, to prevent Japan from signing a conditional surrender with the Soviets poised to come into Japan from the north. With most of Japan's army positioned against the U.S., perhaps the Soviets would've easily swept through Japan, and America seeing Japan as strategic in the Cold War felt they needed to prevent that. Japan might be just shaking off communism were it not for the bombs. Does that make the bombs justifiable? I'd lean slightly towards it doesn't. Although Japan has done very well in part due to U.S. advice and support after the war.

 

[Nuala]

I see the United States as somewhat corrupt world police. They'll at times go after countries that have nuclear ambitions

I don't blame my government for going after countries with ambitions for nuclear weapons. We learned the lesson of their usage the hard way. I don't want any other country with their stigma on it's soul. I wish nuclear weapons were never thought of. I wish humanity was better than it is.

they'll at times create false charges to invade a country, and they'll occasionally attempt to prevent true injustices.

I hope you're not referring to the Iraq War!

providing little support to those less fortunate.

That's true for most if not every modern country, Revenant. However, if you take a look here you'll see that American organizations contributing heavily to the relief efforts in Haiti. Furthermore, I have first hand experience of being helped when less fortunate by charities in my area when my family was suffering extreme financial problems. To say that we provide little support to those less fortunate would be untrue.

A mixed bag of religious nuts, proud gun owners, retributive justice, and the liberal progressives in opposition of all that.

Americans feel very strongly about gun ownership. In actuality, should the need arise, I think it's safe to assume that we would rise up against our government should it completely and utterly take the wrong path. That's the conundrum of government sanctioned gun control. Criminals will still get guns no matter what the policy on gun control is.

I'm Irish, and the Irish were originally pagan, and then they had Catholicism shoved on them, and we adopted it, and then England tried to shove another religion, Protestantism, down our throats, and we for the most part rejected it. America was founded by businessmen and religious nuts. I understand the insanity of organized religion, and I reject it as a whole. I think America is slowly coming to that point in it's growth, and it'll only be a matter of time before we all do.

The atomic bombs on Hiroshima were dropped to provide Japan with incentives to sign an unconditional surrender, to prevent Japan from signing a conditional surrender with the Soviets poised to come into Japan from the north. With most of Japan's army positioned against the U.S., perhaps the Soviets would've easily swept through Japan, and America seeing Japan as strategic in the Cold War. Japan might be just shaking off communism were it not for the bombs. Does that make the bombs justifiable? I'd lean slightly towards it doesn't. Although Japan has done very well in part due to U.S. advice and support after the war.

No, I don't think the bombs were justifiable either. I think they were necessary, but war is not justifiable, it's just easier than listening to reason.

 

[Hezam]

I wouldn't say we're proud of the wars, Hezam. We're proud of the people who fought in them. Which is understandable enough, even if you hate the war, you have to respect the people going to a foreign country to fight it. It's loyalty, and is highly respectable.

Are you serious ? You are proud of who kills people ? it doesn't change anything,you are not proud of the war but of those who start the war !! I don't see any difference !!

Furthermore, The Japanese military was not innocent in World War II, Hezam. Between 1937 and 1945, the Japanese military murdered between 3,00,000 to over 10,000,000 million Chinese, Indonesian, Korean, Filipino, Indochinese, and Western prisoners of war.

America did worse than that.

I guess I shouldn't forget to mention the human experimentation by the Japanese military. Could you imagine vivisection without anesthesia, or amputation? Would you enjoy being placed into a high-pressure chamber until you die, or buried alive? How about the tests performed on prisoners/civilians with plague, cholera, smallpox, botulism, and so on? Millions of civilians in Southeast Asia died during a preventable famine in 1944-45. Those are some of the crimes committed by the Japanese military during World War 2.

Japan did not agree to the terms of the Potsdam Declaration. Thus the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were carried out. It brings tears to my eyes when I consider the ramifications of those horrible bombings, but I believe that the Allied forces during WW2 had no other choice.

The US Army bomb over the city not the Japanese army.

In regards to the Cold War? It was insane and had more players in it than just the United States and the Soviet Union, which the Vietnam War would fall under. God, I don't even know where to start with the goddamn Cold War.

The Soviet is not different than the US,both committed a lot of crimes.

But you didn't say anything about Iraq/Afghanistan/Red Indians ?

 

[Hezam]

they'll at times create false charges to invade a country

If you are referring to Iraq then i will tell you it wasn't false,It was in desire,A Crusade as Bush said.

 

[Nuala]

Are you serious ? You are proud of who kills people ? it doesn't change anything,you are not proud of the war but of those who start the war !! I don't see any difference !!

Yes, I'm proud of soldiers who do their duty with honor. I do not support the soldiers who cross the line and commit to the immoral.

If you are referring to Iraq then i will tell you it wasn't false,It was in desire,A Crusade as Bush said.

Sorry, Saddam Hussein was a monster. Weapons of mass destruction or not, he committed genocide.

America did worse than that.

Please back up your statements with factual proof.

The US Army bomb over the city not the Japanese army.

Yes, I know they did, however, it was a show of force. We fire bombed Japanese cities for months and even after that they did not surrender, so we bombed Hiroshima on August 6th, 1945. The Japanese did not surrender. We bombed Nagasaki on August 9th, 1945. They surrendered soon after the second bombing. I cannot stress enough how much pain it brings me when I think of the bombings.

At any rate, I think the nuclear bombing of Nagasaki & Hiroshima have been discussed too much on this forum, so considering all the facts are laid bare, let's talk about the citizens of the United States of America. How you feel about them. How you feel about the nation, how you feel about our impact in science, arts, and humanitarian efforts. It'll be fun and easy.

 

[Revenant]

No evidence of WMDs were found in Iraq, which was the premise for invading Iraq in the first place.

When I say they provide little to the less fortunate, in part I'm referring to things like the medical care system. A lot of Americans don't get the necessary medical treatment just cause they don't have insurance or the money for it.

 

[Half-n-Half]

And it's shame to be proud of Vietnam War, Desert Storm, and the Iraq/Afghanistan war,These wars are the most evil wars happend in the 21th century and in the history (including the two nuclear bombs on Japan).

Just FYI, the Vietnam War and Desert Storm were in the 20th century, not the 21st

You really think those are the most evil wars to have happened in the 20th/21st century? In what way were they the most evil? What about the genocides in Rwanda and Darfur? To me those are much more "evil."

 

[Nuala]

A lot of Americans don't get the necessary medical treatment

I got the medical treatment I needed last year. As a matter of fact, I rang up a $7,000 USD hospital bill by the time I got out of the hospital. They ended up not charging me for it, and all I had to say was I couldn't pay for it.

There are millions of people without health care who simply don't want it. The problem with medical treatment isn't the lack of ability to pay for it, it's the high cost of it. Plenty of doctors get extravagant amounts of money from various sources, so is it corruption in the health care sector, or is it the lack of ability to pay for it?

Giving the government control over it is absolutely frightening. The thing about Americans is that we like the government as far from our lives as possible. Since senators, doctors, and so forth are so delightfully immoral at times, you have to consider what the real problem is. The American people would be exchanging one collar for a collar provided by the government. Does that seem better to you? :?

What about the genocides in Rwanda and Darfur?

The USA is obviously the evil empire, so anything involving the USA is evil to Hezam. The genocide in Darfur & Rwanda is okay because the USA didn't intervene. Now, if the USA had intervened, it would have been evil because of the losses suffered on the opposing genocidal side.

USA = evil empire; global police

 

[RolandtheHeadless]

"I got the medical treatment I needed last year. As a matter of fact, I rang up a $7,000 USD hospital bill by the time I got out of the hospital. They ended up not charging me for it, and all I had to say was I couldn't pay for it."

So who do you think paid for it? Those of us with private or employer-sponsored health insurance, that's who. Personally, I favor a national health system, like the Japanese have.

Hezam, do you first think of yourself as a Muslim or as a Yemeni? Many, many Americans think of themselves as Americans first. Perhaps it's because most of us have few ties to the countries our ancestors came from.

The A-bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were horrible things, but perhaps for the best from a historical viewpoint. Otherwise, the Japanese would have fought for every piece of their homeland. Millions more people would have died, the war would have dragged on for another couple of years.

 

[Nuala]

So who do you think paid for it? Those of us with private or employer-sponsored health insurance, that's who.

Explain this without insulting me, and you can have a cookie.

 

[Revenant]

I got the medical treatment I needed last year. As a matter of fact, I rang up a $7,000 USD hospital bill by the time I got out of the hospital. They ended up not charging me for it, and all I had to say was I couldn't pay for it.

There are millions of people without health care who simply don't want it. The problem with medical treatment isn't the lack of ability to pay for it, it's the high cost of it. Plenty of doctors get extravagant amounts of money from various sources, so is it corruption in the health care sector, or is it the lack of ability to pay for it?

I can't see this being a viable system. Someone has to pay for that, and docs can't just keep providing their services free of charge to those that can't afford it. Perhaps they had no choice in your case, as you had already received the medical treatment, but for those that need an operation to, for example, decrease back pain, and ask for an operation, can they just say upfront that they don't have the money to pay for it? Or can they wait till after the op to say they're broke? I think as docs run businesses, they'll do a bit of Good Samaritan work, but they can't extend that to everyone who can't afford their work, or they wouldn't be in business long.

Part of the high cost in medical care is due to docs charging more to cover law suits or prepare money for lawsuits. The dentist gets sued an average of three times a year.

Giving the government control over it is absolutely frightening. The thing about Americans is that we like the government as far from our lives as possible. Since senators, doctors, and so forth are so delightfully immoral at times, you have to consider what the real problem is. The American people would be exchanging one collar for a collar provided by the government. Does that seem better to you?

The Japanese and Canadians seem to do well with universal healthcare. No one has complained much about gov't control.

 

[Tsuyoiko]

So the united states (as i know) has good and bad sides,It's very bad from outside as much as it's beautiful from inside.

I'm not so sure it is "beautiful from the inside". The US has no universal health care, it has the death penalty, it allows its citizens to carry guns, it has very little in the way of workers' rights or welfare. The distribution of wealth is very unequal. Life expectancy, infant mortality, crime rates and environmental policy compare very unfavourably with other industrialised nations.

Giving the government control over it is absolutely frightening. The thing about Americans is that we like the government as far from our lives as possible.

Why is this? The government control the military, police and fire services, postal service, law courts, utilities, education. What's so different about health care?

Since senators, doctors, and so forth are so delightfully immoral at times, you have to consider what the real problem is. The American people would be exchanging one collar for a collar provided by the government. Does that seem better to you? :?

It seems a lot better! Government agents might be possibly corrupt, but at least they are elected officials whose purpose is to serve the people they represent. With insurance companies controlling access to health care, you are at the mercy of organisations whose purpose is to accumulate profit.

 

[Mycernius]

The US and how I see it? Hmmm
Firstly I will say I have been to the US. Travelled around it by train and met quite a few average Americans, and I can honestly say that the majority were polite, kind and considerate. They also are fascinated by my accent. We did meet the occassional wacko, including a guy on the train from Chicago to Seattle who was living in Gods love, after God had told the cops to comes around his house and take away his guns, drugs, car, house

Overall I found the people nice, but in some respects a little closeted from the rest of the world, especailly the further south I got. Also some were incredible guillible, which many in Europe see Americans as being.

On the other hand the US government and the society it has created has certain things that are sadly lacking. Like a national health system, workers welfare (I was recently shocked to find that you can be fired from a job if the bosscomes in and decides to fire everyone called Raymond/Bill on that day) a decent education system (a friend of mine married an American and she had a 12 year old daughter who spent some time at a english school. When she went back to the states she was skipped a grade. Two years later she was being held back. He was not impressed with the system). The gap between rich and poor seems more pronounced and yet the US spends more of its military than any other country in the world, more than China and Russia combined.

There also seems to be a greater influence of religion within society. For a country founded on a secular principle this is not good. Now Louisiana wants creationism taught in the classroom along with evolution. Did they learn nothing from the Dover trial? And Faustiandeals mention a lack of government control, Hello, Patriot act = police state? I hope that they have done away with that piece of BS.

Sorry, Saddam Hussein was a monster. Weapons of mass destruction or not, he committed genocide.

So has Robert Mugabe, but I do not see US troops in Zimbabwe. How about Rwanda? No US troops there either. Could it be that Saddam had oil?

America did worse than that.

I would like to see your figures on that. I have some:
United States military casualties of war - Wikipedia
And looking over that It seems you are wrong by a long shot. Been listening to Saudi Propaganda again? I have told you once, you live in one of the most oppressed countries for media and the internet. What the government don't want you to know is screened, censored and blocked. You might knock the US government, but they are not into heavy censorship like Saudi Arabia. They have a decent freedom of the press, even if they don't like it.
Couple of stats:
File:Reporters Without Borders 2008 Press Freedom Rankings Map.svg - Wikipedia
Freedom of the Press 2008 - Country Rankings
(You'll find Saudi at #67. Lower than Algeria, Afghanistan!, Haiti)

 

[Hezam]

Sorry, Saddam Hussein was a monster. Weapons of mass destruction or not, he committed genocide.

Saddam was a man,He was protecting the eastern gate of the Arab world but the Zionists didn't like him,they want the oil and a weak Iraq.
He made a mistake by occupying Kuwait but still he is better than Bush and those extremist zionists in the black house.

And I wonder how many genocides the US committed ?

The genocide in Darfur & Rwanda

There is no genocide in Darfur,it's a big lie as before.
And could you please tell me who committed Rwanda genocide ? you sound ignorant !!

The USA is obviously the evil empire, so anything involving the USA is evil to Hezam.

USA = evil empire; global police

Most people in the earth think the same,Didn't you see the protestings during Iraq/Afghanistan/Gaza war ?

I would like to see your figures on that. I have some:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_...ualties_of_war
And looking over that It seems you are wrong by a long shot. Been listening to Saudi Propaganda again? I have told you once, you live in one of the most oppressed countries for media and the internet. What the government don't want you to know is screened, censored and blocked. You might knock the US government, but they are not into heavy censorship like Saudi Arabia. They have a decent freedom of the press, even if they don't like it.
Couple of stats:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Re...nkings_Map.svg
Menu of ITA Websites
(You'll find Saudi at #67. Lower than Algeria, Afghanistan!, Haiti)

I don't watch Saudi channels they are the worst,I hate the Saudi TV,news,economic...it's all bull$hit.
And i agree with you it's very very bad BECAUSE of the American support they are lying to us.
The US care too much about the Royal family...<< please no more about the Saudi Gov i am gonna get arrested. +_+

 

[Half-n-Half]

And I wonder how many genocides the US committed ?

The only thing that comes to mind is how the US treated native American Indians. Certainly a dark spot in American history.

There is no genocide in Darfur,it's a big lie as before.
And could you please tell me who committed Rwanda genocide ? you sound ignorant !!

Hezam, I'm seriously curious if the extent of your reasoning skills is calling things a lie and then being done with it. What evidence or reasoning do you have that a genocide didn't occur in Darfur? And the war in Rwanda that led to the genocide was a civil war.

I don't watch Saudi channels they are the worst,I hate the Saudi TV,news,economic...it's all bull$hit.
And i agree with you it's very very bad BECAUSE of the American support they are lying to us.
The US care too much about the Royal family...<< please no more about the Saudi Gov i am gonna get arrested. +_+

Where do you get your information from?

 

[Hezam]

The only thing that comes to mind is how the US treated native American Indians. Certainly a dark spot in American history.

Maybe to your mind,but if you live outside the US you will understand.

Hezam, I'm seriously curious if the extent of your reasoning skills is calling things a lie and then being done with it.

It's not skills,It's what i watch and hear everyday..

What evidence or reasoning do you have that a genocide didn't occur in Darfur?

Sorry but the question should be :
What evidence or reasoning do you have that a genocide did occur in Darfur?
The United States want to part Sudan into 4 parts,South (Oil ),North (Arab),west (Darfur),and East (for Ethupia).Please make some researchs,I live hear and i met alot of Sudani people and Arab,Pakistani,Afghani...etc.
Have you ever spoken to Arab or Middle Eastern people about policy ?

And the war in Rwanda that led to the genocide was a civil war.

OK,who is to balme ? I don't think Muslims neither America are to blame for this war !!
so why you involved Rwanda ?

Where do you get your information from? [/QUOTE]
Many sources...Reading in Al-Jazeeera,CNN,the christian science monitor,French news...etc but these are my favorite.
Also i try to ask people about the past wars/Crisises and i have a real intention to hear the truth whatever i heard/told before.

 

[Pachipro]

I have told you once, you live in one of the most oppressed countries for media and the internet. What the government don't want you to know is screened, censored and blocked. You might knock the US government, but they are not into heavy censorship like Saudi Arabia.

Quite true. And this bit of recent news only serves to back up that claim:

UAE to ban BlackBerry for e-mail communication effective Oct 11th.

Emirati authorities say the move is based on security concerns because BlackBerry data are automatically shipped to company computers abroad, where it is difficult for local authorities to monitor for illegal activity or abuse.

Critics of the crackdown say it is also a way for the country's conservative government to further control content it deems politically or morally objectionable.

The UAE contends some BlackBerry features operate outside the country's laws, "causing judicial, social and national security concerns." At the heart of their concerns is the way the devices handle data, which get encrypted and routed through RIM's servers overseas. The automatic encryption makes BlackBerry data far more difficult, if not impossible, for authorities to monitor.

Here in the US, they don't need censorship as the government probably has a backdoor into all e-mail communications/web surfing via computer and smartphones regardless of encryption codes. Project Carnivore, which gave rise to Narusinsight comes to mind.

Narus is a US private company which produces mass surveillance systems. It was founded in 1997 by Ori Cohen, who had been in charge of technology development for VDONet, an early media streaming pioneer.

It is notable for being the creator of NarusInsight, a supercomputer system which is allegedly used by the NSA and other bodies to perform mass surveillance and monitoring of citizens' and corporations' Internet communications in real-time. Narus is a US private company which produces mass surveillance systems...

With surveillance like this there is no need for mass censorship as in other countries who probably cannot purchase systems like this due to "national security concerns."

 

[Half-n-Half]

Maybe to your mind,but if you live outside the US you will understand.

If yo could, please give me some examples of these genocides.

Sorry but the question should be :
What evidence or reasoning do you have that a genocide did occur in Darfur?
The United States want to part Sudan into 4 parts,South (Oil ),North (Arab),west (Darfur),and East (for Ethupia).Please make some researchs,I live hear and i met alot of Sudani people and Arab,Pakistani,Afghani...etc.
Have you ever spoken to Arab or Middle Eastern people about policy ?

Perhaps not genocide, but massive killings due to tribal and ethnic differences.

CNN

BBC

Reuters

etc etc.

OK,who is to balme ? I don't think Muslims neither America are to blame for this war !!
so why you involved Rwanda ?

I'm blaming neither Muslims nor Americans. The reason I brought it up is because in my mind what happened in Rwanda is much more evil than the wars America has fought. Why when someone brings up a point against you your knee-jerk reaction is that they are attacking Muslims?

 

[RolandtheHeadless]

"I'm blaming neither Muslims nor Americans. The reason I brought it up is because in my mind what happened in Rwanda is much more evil than the wars America has fought. Why when someone brings up a point against you your knee-jerk reaction is that they are attacking Muslims?"

I understood your meaning; but perhaps he didn't because we're writing in English, which isn't his native language.

Rwanda doesn't have oil -- you said it. The atrocities there seem far worse than anything going on in Iraq at the time we invaded. I find it embarrassing that a majority of my countrymen supported that invasion, given Bush's obviously-trumped up case for doing it.

My country's treatment of Native Americans (Indians and Eskimos) is shameful. It makes us no less guilty, but I'll note that misery loves company, and point out that Canada's and Mexico's treatment of Natives was hardly better. Mexico used to pay a bounty on Indian scalps, and its armies slaughtered whole villages.

In fact, the Native American story is the story of humans all over the world. When a more technologically-advanced civilization encounters a lesser one, the latter loses and is conquered, if it's to the former's profit to do so. It isn't right, but I can't think of any exceptions in history.

Now, someone will probably prove me wrong, and that'll be okay. It will give me more hope for mankind.

 

[Hezam]

Pachipro,i just read that news one hour ago,I want to tell you that All Arab goverments are corrupted and dictators.

If yo could, please give me some examples of these genocides.

funny question !!
This link is gonna tell you the killers and the peaceful people:
Genocides in history - Wikipedia

I noticed Ottoman Empire is on the list while those who committed the Armenian-Kurd-Assyrian-Greek-Turkish Denial Genocides are Not Muslims,They are Young Turkey movement witch is Jewish :
Dönmeh - Wikipedia
So the Ottoman Empire is innocent.

And about Rwanda,they are Rwandians so it's not like the US witch killing the other people around the world.

]I'm blaming neither Muslims nor Americans. The reason I brought it up is because in my mind what happened in Rwanda is much more evil than the wars America has fought. Why when someone brings up a point against you your knee-jerk reaction is that they are attacking Muslims?

No not more evil than the US.
And you confused me with Rwanda,I thought you meant Muslims/Arab committed the genocide..sorry.

 

[Pachipro]

It is my belief, with all due respects to Hezam, that any news he receives in Saudi Arabia via western sources like CNN, BBC, Reuters, French news, Christian Science Monitor (really?), etc., has been heavily edited or has stories that favors Saudi Arabia and their political views or they would never be shown or allowed to be viewed over their internet which is heavily policed much the same as China's is. The Chinese cannot find any links relating to the Tianamen massacre of 1989 through any search engines like Gooooogle and Yahoo, etc. The same probably holds true for Saudi Arabia. We can tell him and show him the links, but he is probably (and I may be mistaken here) forbidden to see any info via the internet which shows Muslims and Saudi Arabia in a bad light.

After all, even Christians visiting Saudi are forbidden to have a bible in their possession when the same does not hold true for Muslims visiting the US with their Qu'ran their possession. Why? What are they afraid of?

 

[Hezam]

It is my belief, with all due respects to Hezam, that any news he receives in Saudi Arabia via western sources like CNN, BBC, Reuters, French news, Christian Science Monitor (really?), etc., has been heavily edited or has stories that favors Saudi Arabia and their political views or they would never be shown or allowed to be viewed over their internet which is heavily policed much the same as China's is. We can tell him and show him the links, but he is probably (and I may be mistaken here) forbidden to see any info via the internet which shows Muslims and Saudi Arabia in a bad light. After all, even Christians visiting Saudi are forbidden to have a bible in their possession when the same does not hold true for Muslims visiting the US with their Qu'ran their possession. Why? What are afraid of?

Oh,I am not watching the Saudi damn TV channels/news...I'm not interesting in TV.
I use internet !! All these News websites are not blocked here ...Maybe Mycernius confused you.
They Block the pr0n websites and some political websites that are against the government,That's it.
All websites are opened.
I have an Arabic Bible in my computer,I don't agree with this Gov (gosh i'm gonna get arrested:?).Please don't think Saudi Arabia is like the Anglo-American Media show.