What type of Yosegaki Hinomaru is this?

[BPattyret]

I just acquired this flag and see that it is different than a typical flag of this type because of the writing inside of the sun. Is there a name for this particular type of flag? Can anyone tell where it might be from, or who it was for? Is this more of a company/regimental flag? Any information would be greatly appreciated! BP

 

[mdchachi]

This is called the "fake" type of yosegaki hinomaru. Most of the writing are scribbles attempting to look like calligraphy.

 

[Majestic]

Well, they are actual names, but: some are legible, others are written rather haphazardly. There is no clear presenter, and no clear recipient. I've never seen a flag that was just covered (including the red disc) in names. The character in the center means "strength". I wouldn't think it is a military flag (by that, I mean a flag that was issued by the military), because there is no recipient and nobody with any clear rank written on it. Not even sure if its a wartime item. Could be from the war era, but there is no good luck message, or any other thing that would tie it to a time or place.

 

[mdchachi]

I wouldn't think it is a military flag (by that, I mean a flag that was issued by the military)

Were any of the "good luck" flags issued by the military? I thought they were personal gifts from friends/family/peers.

 

[Majestic]

I don't think any were issued by the military. I should have sent "presented by someone in the military".

 

[BPattyret]

Thanks to all for the information. Was disappointed to read that there's not much significance to it. Not a true "Good Luck" flag, and not really a military unit flag I guess. So is the best guess just a made up flag of some sort? Can any of the names be read to determine any common names or any indication of a possible region where it may have come from? Am wondering if it's even a wartime flag now. Wondering if maybe flags like this were sold to the servicemen stationed there during the occupation and "aged", "damaged" intentionally for a sales pitch? I just don't know what I have now and am wondering if I was sold a fake flag knowingly? Very disappointed at this time.

 

[Majestic]

It could well be a WW2 "good luck" flag. There's just no specific information on the flag to determine its possible origin in time or place. There are also no typical phrases that you usually find on yosegaki. So without any handle to grab onto, its difficult to say definitively what it is. The names are all basic Japanese names. Just in this square below you can see SUZUKI Toshio, KITAURA Gorō, YAMAMOTO Hideo, etc... Just very typical names, and not indicative of any specific region.

If you were looking for something typical, something that more closely fits the archetype of a WW2 good luck flag, you would probably pick another flag rather than this one. But just because this one doesn't fit the archetype doesn't necessarily kick it out of the box.

 

[mdchachi]

Thanks to all for the information. Was disappointed to read that there's not much significance to it. Not a true "Good Luck" flag, and not really a military unit flag I guess. So is the best guess just a made up flag of some sort? Can any of the names be read to determine any common names or any indication of a possible region where it may have come from? Am wondering if it's even a wartime flag now. Wondering if maybe flags like this were sold to the servicemen stationed there during the occupation and "aged", "damaged" intentionally for a sales pitch? I just don't know what I have now and am wondering if I was sold a fake flag knowingly? Very disappointed at this time.

I think I spoke too soon. I asked a Japanese person and as Majestic says they do seem to be actual names even though some are not legible. So it's not gibberish. Definitely doesn't follow the usual pattern though.

 

[BPattyret]

I appreciate the additional information. Glad to hear that there are some "real" names. Being a retired teacher, I can understand about some names not being legible. Still disappointed that there doesn't seem to be an obvious purpose for the flag. Too bad that there isn't a "key" phrase anywhere. It does appear to have a "Shrine Stamp"(?) on the upper right hand corner. It's about the size of a dime, pretty small and faded, but is anything legible on the stamp that might give a location of a shrine? Again, Thanks for any and all information. BP

 

[Majestic]

The vertical writing says 明治神宮 (Meiji Jingū). Meiji Jingū is a shintō shrine located in the middle of Tokyo.
I can't make out the horizontal access.

Not much help.

 

[BPattyret]

Thanks so much Majestic!! It's a starting point towards solving the mystery anyway! Appreciate it.

 

[Majestic]

horizontal access → horizontal axis

So many sloppy errors lately. Hope I'm not getting old.

 

[NANGI]

Konnichiwa BPattyret-san! Majestic-san!

The horizontal axis is "願済 : Negai-zumi". It means "your request has already been granted".

This stamp is fake and looks nothing like the real thing. The actual stamp does not have the letter "願済".

This stamp resembles a personal stamp, not a shrine stamp. The font and style and size are the same as the stamps that Japanese people personally own.

The shrine stamps are made in large sizes using traditional fonts and styles. However, this stamp is simple in style, with a simple font, and is small in size, just like a personal stamp.

I think it was probably made by someone who didn't know about shrine stamps and copied Japanese personal stamps.

NANGI

 

[BPattyret]

Thank You Nangi!
Every little bit of information is a step towards figuring out what I have, or haven't got. So in your opinion, what kind of flag do you think I have? Is it some type of flag from WW 2, or an elaborate fake? There's no "dedication" phrase, no indication of who it was meant for, no military unit is named, so what is it? It's frustrating and disappointing. Appreciate everyone who has tried to help with their thoughts and ideas! BP

 

[NANGI]

Konnichiwa BPattyret-san!

Perhaps the person who made this flag didn't know the meaning of "Yosegaki". And he/she mistakenly thought that the more names there were on it, the more valuable it was. Furthermore, he/she thought it would be perfect if there was a stamp from the shrine.

In the end, this poor piece of garbage was completed.

At the very least, if he/she copy the real thing, he/she can make an elaborate fake. But even that effort has not been made. Even if it's a fake, it's too poor.

My opinion is that this flag is not real, that's all.

NANGI

 

[BPattyret]

Appreciate your honesty! Thanks BP