Society Japan's bad half : the puerile, the irresponsible, the perverted, and the handicapped

[kirei_na_me]

I still don't see the beauty in yaeba...

 

[deadhippo]

I am not sure whether you understand what "yaeba" means.

i get it...that was just an example from the google search you provided us with

im not saying they are all beautiful
im just saying that in some cases they are

and i think its not reasonable to judge people with their lips pulled back
i mean even if the teeth are perfect white specimens its pretty gross to look at

just want to say at this point that I dont have a vampire fetish or anything but if i liked someone i wouldnt ley his/her yaeba get in the way
on the other hand if he/she started to pull his/her lips right back to show them and her gums to me close up on a regular basis i would probably avoid that person (yaeba or no)

 

[bossel]

This is not specifically directed at you Nurizeko, but I think your post made a good hook for my argument.

i dont even want to ask how seriously screwed up japan must be to allow that behaviour i mean, i cant think, i dunno what to say, their own mums!!?? i mean what???.....japan is seriously screwed up

I wonder if you could call that neo-imperialism. You see a habit that is tabu in your culture & then judge another culture on your own values. Pretty screwed up, IMO. (Well, not so much screwed up but an actually very common behaviour. Nevertheless pretty condescending towards foreign culture.)

man...i knew japan was wierd but....jesus, thats just....wrong.

Right & wrong (as morals in general) are relative.

allround an interesting insight into japan, and each day it makes me question, what really is acceptable cultural difference, and what is just institutionally nationally endorsed deviant and negative behaviour.

Acceptable cultural difference? I think (prejudiced as I am) that every behaviour is acceptable that involves consenting individuals. As long as no harm is done without consent, it's OK with me.
I have only problems when an authority (as in: government) acts against human rights or international agreements & bases this behaviour on alleged national traditions.

japan has had to face modernization pretty quickly and, its going to need to pull its national head out the sand, and start tackling real issues...

Here I can fully agree, I think. But I don't see how this would involve reining in on people's privacy.

i dont think its a christian nut thing, i really do think that mums giving their sons daily blow-jobs so they study well is distasteful, and no, i dont feel it is just cultural difference,

Well, it is. Taste is indivdiually different, but it is highly influenced by the environment (IE culture).

just because a culture is different, doesnt mean it cant have negative parts of that culture,

Of course, but it's nobody's business as long as it involves individual consent.

some things are universal, like not killing

Not even this is universal. Depending on the culture you live in, certain forms of killing are accepted. But, yeah, there are some very basic issues which have a rather wide distribution among human societies.

i aint got issues with people free to do what they want with their sexuality with other consenting legal individuals but, sucking your 12 year old son off is just wrong.

This statement is a bit contradictory.

if "Yaeba" means more fang like canines then im guilty as charged
there's nothing deformed about it, its just that my canines are in their natural form

Natural, hmm? Diseases are also natural. Hairs on your legs are also natural, yet in many Western societies nowadays, girls are almost forced to shave their legs.

IMO, as long as health is not affected by yaeba, so what? Making yaeba some sort of fetish seems a bit strange to me, but people all over the world have varying fetishes, from yaeba to much more serious handicaps, from worn underwear to rubber. I can't see, why this should be seen as a specific Japanese issue.

 

[deadhippo]

i think you should take most of those waiwai stories with a grain of salt
they are mostly translations from crappy scandal rags that also include stories such as alien abductions, atlantis, fountains of youth and such like
mixed in with a few real stories to add credibilty

 

[Kinsao]

I am a little upset at the way your mind sees people who are old, sick, disabled or just somewhat ugly to look at.

I am not trying to be argumentative of your views. I agree that it's bad that people walk about and they have some illness that could maybe be easily sorted (for example the teeth, the bent back, perhaps mental problem which could be cured with medication, etc.) I think the 'bad'ness is in the way the society perhaps does not offer them the chance for help which could be easy, or, maybe some problem within themselves which caused them to refuse the chance for help. (sorry, I don't express myself well here :sorry: )

What I mean to say, I agree with you these things are 'social' problems and why could they not be alleviated? So perhaps the 'bad half' of Japan that does not do much to help these kinds of problems.

But, it's also easy to get into mindset of seeing old, sick, disabled people as some bad thing in themselves, like as though you're walking on the streets and see lots of trash on the streets that makes the place look horrible. And some people really feel about such, that they really don't like to see them because it makes them feel in some way bad. Just because of course it's not 'nice' to see people with illness or problem... But I think it's important to keep the vision of separating 'problem' from the people themselves. Because eventually, people think to rid the streets of trash...

I'm sure it is not your intention, but tone in original post seems to me to put devalue on old, sick, disabled, ugly people. Like to say they aren't as good as other people and somehow need to be 'sorted' so they conform with attractive.

I agree yes that this is a problem, it is just the way of expressing it.

I am sorry if I'm unclear.

 

[nurizeko]

I wonder if you could call that neo-imperialism. You see a habit that is tabu in your culture & then judge another culture on your own values. Pretty screwed up, IMO. (Well, not so much screwed up but an actually very common behaviour. Nevertheless pretty condescending towards foreign culture.)


Right & wrong (as morals in general) are relative.


ing on the culture you live in, certain forms of killing are accepted. But, yeah, there are some very basic issues which have a rather wide distribution among human societies.

In the case of killing bossel, maybe your country condones it but, in my country it is illegal full stop, but, thats another debate for another thread.


As for a mother sucking her son off, im sorry, i know you mean well, and your just trying to make sure people take a better look before judging but im sorry, a mother sucking off her son isnt normal, and it isnt because of neo-imperialism or christian brain-washing, its just one of those universal wrongs.

If i told my girlfriend about this, she, as a japanese person, would without a doubt, considor this just as distasteful as i do, so, im afraid the argument that it is a cultural phenomena is wrong, japanese culture may have allowed this to happen easier then in a stricter western society, but, west or east, a mother who does that is, i dunno, not being a responsible mother.

Im not sure what the age of consent is in japan, but i put good money it isnt 12, and, i dunno, the picture i get from japan is even japan in its differences doesnt ussually go that far.

That really does seem a case of unusual deviancy, even for japan.

As for japan being a very sexually open nation (ironic that for a nation that you can see sexual imagery everywhere, yet people cant hold hands in public...) thats another thing, and, really can be down to cultural difference and hey, if thats what the japanese are comfortable with, fine, i wouldnt want it in my face everywhere i go but, i dont believe in a cultural supression of sexual expression, just aslong as everyone's cool with it, and purely as a personal preference, that its not in my face all the time.

But yeah, mommy helping little Akira pass his exams with a maternal blow-job.....Smacks of wrong to me, japan or the west. :souka:

Natural, hmm? Diseases are also natural. Hairs on your legs are also natural, yet in many Western societies nowadays, girls are almost forced to shave their legs.

IMO, as long as health is not affected by yaeba, so what? Making yaeba some sort of fetish seems a bit strange to me, but people all over the world have varying fetishes, from yaeba to much more serious handicaps, from worn underwear to rubber. I can't see, why this should be seen as a specific Japanese issue.

interesting that maternal sexual activity with her illegal son is okay yet having less then perfect movie-star teeth is somehow wrong, shaving legs is a western thing, yet its not natural.

im not claiming a fetish /:| im merely saying girls dont need to have burning magnesium white perfect teeth to be attractive, if someones teeth is a health issue then they obviously need dental help, and teeth should always be kept spotless but, i stop the line at being a hollywood star dental nazi....i was just saying i have more prenounced canines then perfect teeth, and there's nothing wrong with it, if someone bases their attraction and future relationships with someone purely based on the fact their teeth aint perfect, then they dont deserve to experience the touch of a man/woman.

 

[bossel]

In the case of killing bossel, maybe your country condones it but, in my country it is illegal full stop, but, thats another debate for another thread.

I doubt that there is a full stop, even in your country. Since Scotland (like Germany, BTW) is in the sphere of European legal tradition, I suppose, that killing in self defence is alright. The UK is involved in the occupation of Iraq, I suppose its soldiers (Scots among them) have killed their fair share of Iraqis.

a mother sucking off her son isnt normal,

Just guessing, but it isn't normal in Japan either.

and it isnt because of neo-imperialism or christian brain-washing, its just one of those universal wrongs.

There are no universal wrongs.

a mother who does that is, i dunno, not being a responsible mother.

That depends. If the story is true (Which I doubt, BTW. Why would a blow job be less distracting than masturbation? Why should the occasional or daily dose of masturbation, which is quite healthy AFAIK, be so distracting in the 1st place?) then it worked out.

Im not sure what the age of consent is in japan, but i put good money it isnt 12

Correct, but I wasn't essentially arguing on a legal basis, but on self determination. IMO, 12-year olds can usually very well decide what they want. Many of them better than a lot of 30-year olds I met.

That really does seem a case of unusual deviancy, even for japan.

I agree, but why then did you say: "japan is seriously screwed up"?

interesting that maternal sexual activity with her illegal son is okay yet having less then perfect movie-star teeth is somehow wrong, shaving legs is a western thing, yet its not natural.

Either I'm misreading you just now, or you misread me. Where did I say that it's wrong? Strange, yeah (just like a mother doing her son a blow job is strange), but wrong?

if someones teeth is a health issue then they obviously need dental help,

Pretty much what I think.

 

[celtician]

It is true that Japan is a type of infantile society. I noticed this when I first arrived but it has been confirmed over and over again. Must be the difference between those leaders and the regular Japanese or copying things from other countries TOO MUCH. Grow up Japan it will help you in the end!

 

[lastmagi]

Right & wrong (as morals in general) are relative.

Quote:
allround an interesting insight into japan, and each day it makes me question, what really is acceptable cultural difference, and what is just institutionally nationally endorsed deviant and negative behaviour.


Acceptable cultural difference? I think (prejudiced as I am) that every behaviour is acceptable that involves consenting individuals. As long as no harm is done without consent, it's OK with me.

There are no universal wrongs.

I know we're referring to the mother-and-son thing, which, like Bossel, I consider strange, even "icky," but not wrong per se. But I can't say I really like that last statement, even given the context of the discussion here. I always am careful before just saying that nothing is really wrong. What about, for instance, shared basic human rights upon which one group denies another? What about nonconsensual forms of violence? I think the interactions between and among different cultures are too complex and intricate to cover with just one blanket of cultural relativism, no matter what strange topic we're discussing.

some things are universal, like not killing

In the case of killing bossel, maybe your country condones it but, in my country it is illegal full stop

I really disagree with this. First of all, legality may at times be influenced by culture, but just because something is illegal doesn't necessitate it being immoral. It's illegal to share MP3's not purchased through MP3 stores like iTunes. Is that wrong? Not to most people.

Also, I second Bossel that killing is not a universal wrong. I don't really see any viable reasons here for it being a universal wrong (not that it's something that's universally good, of course), and this point is more or less in passing, so I'll move on.

Finally, I highly doubt a whole country would condone killing Bossel (yes, yes, I am the grammar Nazi).

...

Back on topic, I wonder if any critics within Japan (native) have voiced any similar complaints....

 

[celtician]

Someone is more than slightly interested in dental work

I am not sure whether you understand what "yaeba" means. This girl does not have "yaeba", or very very slightly. I was talking about things like that :

The 2nd pic come from a Japanese dental clinic's website .

What is going on... in Japan I've seen the weirdest sets of teeth I have ever seen in my life. Is it the diet?

 

[Limonette]

yaeba

I looked up the yaeba on google images, and actually I find when the mouth isn't pulled back unaturally - they're quite cute. I remember when the dentist pulled out my fangs I thought it was unfair. I think some crooked teeth can be cute too, depending.

 

[Limonette]

I agree with Kinsao about the view of old, sick and disabled. I've worked with them, and mentally disabled and people with alzheimers - and liked many of these people. I don't think their value as humans any less than "normal" people.

I live in Washington, in the US and we have one guy who walks around twitching and jerking his arms about around town. Some people give him signs to advertise their businesses, and I think that is a nice accepting thing. Instead of looking at that as a bad thing it can be an asset. But I think good medical care should be available to all, it isn't here in the US where many people are without health insurance.

There are also alot of homeless people living a block away from my house, at a church. It's called 'tent city'. There were alot of objections in the neighborhood, but they allowed it here, where they wouldn't allow it in other cities. And we didn't even notice they had moved in, it was so quiet, until we turned into the parking lot of the church to turn around.

Also homeless people have their own newspaper - they sell it for $1.00 and get to keep some of the profits. People are starting to think up creative solutions, but, so many problems here as well.

I have to say that America has many ills as too. It's hard to get a perspective about Japan from what I read. Because I know so little about it I have nothing to judge the comments and articles with. I've read alot of weird things, and then hear that they're from tabloid stories. In america you can hear alot of really bizarre stories - but it's not the norm. Well, everyones a bit strange, lol. But it's interesting reading everyones perspectives and experiences, tho confusing.

I saw an interesting anime film about an old man they experimented on. Instead of people taking care of him, his family turned him over to a company which confined him in a bed that took care of all his needs. Then the bed had a mind of it's own - kind of like "bedzilla". I found it an interesting comment about the old and how they are treated, so I assume there may be a change in the way younger people take care of their parents these days in Japan?

 

[Limonette]

I have to say this is a very interesting thread Maciamo - thanks for posting. About the "cute" thing. For years I went around puzzled about the whole Sanrio Hello Kitty thing. I thought it much to cutesy for my taste. But then I got 3 kittens, and suddenly it was "oh Hello Kitty - isn't that cute!" In other words I've been brainwashed by my cats. Yeah I like cute, but only so far, lol.

 

[celtician]

I was on the train the other day, coming from a very traditional place (Asakusa) and a very attractive German girl changed seats and started to talk amongst other things she said quite correctly that Japanese are Nazis and paedophiles and I would have to agree!
The Japanese perhaps will never finish copying things from the outside world.