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Japan more accommodating to English... Off-topic

Not enough people oohed and aahed in agreement with him in that thread, so we have to have a do-over here.
 
I wonder why some people might be interested in continuing with the grudge ?
May I suggest posts from no. 2 down (with the exception of no. 7 by Jack2 which genuninely engages the topic, or so it seems) be deleted so that others who take the topic seriously can engage in a serious discussion ? Can we be friendly once again fellow forumers ? ☝
 
Seriously, are you guys just going to carry this vendetta against maciamo into every thread on this board? The other thread on topic has already been screwed up and you've already set up a special-purpose thread to vent your grievances, so why try to hijack this one before its even started? I kind of agree with some of your criticism, but he is clearly making a good-faith effort to renew discussion on the original topic, which is of obviously of interest to many users, so why are you trying to screw this one up too?
 
It was discussed to death in the other topic. Maciamo refused to consider anyone else's opinion anyway, it gets pointless to debate something with someone who

(a) has no interest in having a conversation
(b) has no interest in other people's opinions
(c) a "get out of jail" free card that when he loses the argument simply claims he meant something else when he started the thread
(d) the ability to monitor private comments made from member to member and the audacity to make these public without consent
 
Gaijin 06, I am in fact very interseted in discussing that topic, but you were arguing post after post that Japan could not possibly be "English-friendly" because we did not apply "English-friendly" to the same things. I never disagreed with what you say about Japan not being an easy place to live for someone who doesn't speak Japanese. But post after post, you would just repeat the same things that Japan is not English-friendly because of your bas personal experiences since your arrived one month ago.

Then you call me condescending because I suggest that to solve your communication problems with the locals, you should not expect them to speak English and try to learn more Japanese (which was unrelated to what I started discussing anyway).

Then you come here and post "Didn't we have another thread discussing this, quite recently?" without reading further than the title, which IMO reflects what kind of person you are. You've just joined 2 weeks ago, have posted 14 of your 21 poss so far in the "English-friendly Japan" and this thread, mostly for the sake of disagreeing with me even when I agree with you. Sorry, but my first impression is that you are a troll.
 
You were condescending, and arrogant. And you draw inane conclusions from no evidence whatsoever. You've done it again just now

But post after post, you would just repeat the same things that Japan is not English-friendly because of your bas personal experiences since your arrived one month ago.

I have not had a single bad personal experience since I arrived. I really like Japan and have got on very well with pretty much everyone I met.

Then you call me condescending because I suggest that to solve your communication problems with the locals, you should not expect them to speak English and try to learn more Japanese

You don't think it is condescending to suggest to someone to learn Japanese to talk to Japanese people? You know, perhaps someone without even your self-proclaimed high IQ I most people can figure that out by themselves.
 
Gaijin 06 said:
You were condescending, and arrogant. And you draw inane conclusions from no evidence whatsoever. You've done it again just now
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I have not had a single bad personal experience since I arrived. I really like Japan and have got on very well with pretty much everyone I met.

Well, let me refresh your memory then (bad experience referred to having difficulties communicating with the locals) :

Gaijin 06 said:
As a non-Dutch speaking, non-German speaking, non-Japanese speaking person I found it much easier to live in the EU than Japan. Why - very simple reason, already stated:

European languages share the same alphabet and origins - many of the words in one language are recognisable in another. So for an English speaking person, it is much easier to live in the EU than it is Japan.

Also, it seems more common to me for EU inhabitants to speak English as a secondary (or tertiary) language than it is for Japanese people to speak English.
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If I want to order from a menu, visit the barber, understand the pricing options on furniture in Tokyu Hands, understand a place name, understand what the words on the adverts in real estate agents windows mean etc etc I can confidently say that looking at the shape of the characters did me no good whatsoever.

All examples from my first month here.
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Are you seriously asserting than 1 in 3 Japanese people can hold a conversation in English? If so then I'm living in a different country to you.
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I read that before I came to Japan, but it really not applicable to how English-friendly this is again.

If I want to buy a bed, some shabu shabu, a hair cut, a mobile phone or rent an apartment I don't want to have to get to know the sales person, barber, waitress or realtor before they're confident enough to talk!

If most people who can speak English choose to refuse or are reluctant to - then it isn't very "English-friendly".
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Of course, the number of people who can speak English has a direct bearing on how English-friendly a country is. Kinda obvious really. If most stores, restaurants, barbers, bars etc had one person who could speak English then that would go a long way towards being "English-friendly" for me.

However this is not my experience at all, even in areas with a heavy alien population like Akasaka.

That comes from 3 different posts of yours. That is what you based on your argument on. It's amazing how you should have no experience of how difficult it can be for a foreigner who doesn't speak (much) Japanese, yet claim the contrary in the said-thread.
 
Not being able to verbally communicate with most people hasn't soured my experience in the slightest Maciamo. Yet again you are arrogant and condescending enough to tell me what I should be thinking!

The topic under disucssion was how English-friendly Japan is, not how Gaijin 06 has found Tokyo since he arrived. There are two unrelated topics, my good friend.
 
Gaijin 06 said:
Not being able to verbally communicate with most people hasn't soured my experience in the slightest Maciamo. Yet again you are arrogant and condescending enough to tell me what I should be thinking!

Do you by any chance belong to the Mikecashian school of thoughts, which uses denial or oblivion of one's former statements, and call people who point out one's inconsistencies as "arrogant and condescending" ?

The topic under disucssion was how English-friendly Japan is, not how Gaijin 06 has found Tokyo since he arrived. There are two unrelated topics, my good friend.

So why have you almost only mentioned about your personal experiences ? My arguments had the merits to rely on external sources (websites, education system, photos of public signs...), while yours was based on your one-month experience and how communication in Europe had been so much easier for you than in Japan.

On these issues, that's just my experience against yours. You found it arrogant that I should state that I didn't personally have much problems learning kanas (in one week) and kanji. So basically, anybody that share their personal experience in a way that make it look like they had an easier time than you is just arrogant and condescending.

Anyhow, why did you start arguing about personal experience related to Japanese people's ability to communicate in English in the first place ? It was not part of the discussion I had started. Fine if you mention it, but why should you persist with that argument once I have told you it is not part of the topic I started, then criticise me for not being open to discussion when I refuse to go offtopic ? You could have started a thread called "It is not always easy to communicate with Japanese people using English only". That would have been on topic. Your stubbornness and desperate attempts to make me look arrogant because I didn't want to discuss that with you, do not agree with the forum rules :

Forum Rules said:
MUTUAL RESPECT
We built the Japan Forum on mutual respect. Feel at home and behave as if this forum is yours. Indeed, before you post pretend you run this forum: would you accept the message you intend to publish on your own forum? We encourage controversial discussion as long as you show respect to other members and their views/opinions. Avoid flaming and other offensive or profane behaviour. Don't launch personal attacks.
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STAY ON TOPIC
Avoid posting messages that are out of context or irrelevant to a topic. While we encourage your participation, such posts will either be moved to another forum or deleted in order to ensure a thread's consistency.
 
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