what is the reason for racism in Japan ?

Mrjones · 7 Dec 2006

I was just taking a walk with my girlfriend. I passed by my university with her. Some girl students where leaving university, and talking something, I dont know hear them. I have never seen those students before. After we had passed university area my girlfriend started to ask me why those students where talking about me like, I am like a male ***** or something. I answered I dont know I have never seen these students before. I just said they are so childish and noisy I dont really care. My girl friend agreed to that and said, yeah like those students at combini making fun of your name. I said her again, I dont care they can do what they want, becouse everything what they say is not true.

After that my girlfriend told that she used to be like that towards foreigners when she was younger and that it is very common for people who are at their 20ish to be childish like that even in tokyo. I asked why did she do that, she has gaijin boyfriend now ? She never answered and changed topic of conversation to japanese gardens.

What do you think ? what is the reason that so many teachers in university accpets this kind of behaviour ? Why are those students being so racistic and before turning to 25 they grow up ?

They are jelous becouse I dont do parttime jobs here ? what parttime job i would do ? I am not native English anyways. ☝ Thinking working in environment like this, would not be good idea anyways.

In Finland the reason is probably the social system, it is very easy to use as advantage as being refuge. another one is that many foreigners keep telling that finland is shity country(probably becouse they didnt want to come finland at first place), and other one is of course the militaristic idiots. I could go on, but there definatedly is reason for this.

Mikawa Ossan · 7 Dec 2006

Here's the short answer: You're different.

Welcome to the wonderful world of being a gaijin in Japan. If I were you, I wouldn't sweat it and just try to live peacefully among your surroundings. Any attempts to change the people around that are not subtle will backfire, as Japanese culture doesn't respond well to direct confrontation or sarcasm.

Don't worry; be happy!

Mrjones · 7 Dec 2006

"Here's the short answer: You're different."

what do you mean we are all gaijins its all the same right ?

Mikawa Ossan · 7 Dec 2006

Mrjones said:
what do you mean we are all gaijins its all the same right ?

I'm a little confused at to what you mean. Do you mean that everyone is a potential gaijin if they go to another country? Or are you referring to something else.

My point is that you're not the first one to ponder such questions as you brought up in your OP. The people who seem to adjust to Japan the best are those who just accept their being different and live with it.

Mrjones · 7 Dec 2006

So the best people are those who just accepts blindly everything ?

gaijinalways · 7 Dec 2006

And develop thick skins!

Mikawa Ossan · 7 Dec 2006

How long do you plan on staying in Japan?

If you plan to stay short term (in other words you have plans to leave Japan in the future), then you're on your own.

If you plan to stay long term, however, I guarrentee you that you WILL be miserable unless you just accept things as they are. Are things perfect? No. But then again, I assume you're here in Japan by choice. Whenever you make a choice there are certain tradeoffs. The culture of "gaijin" is simply a tradeoff for living in Japan. That's the way of things.

If you want to change Japan or at the very least try to be accepted on your own terms, you will wind up like Maciamo. You may find his posts very interesting. I suggest you go pretty far back in time (at least a couple of years) and then slowly read his posts into the present. Notice the change. The same fate could be waiting for you.

Keep in mind that as far as I'm concerned, it's just a matter of cause and effect. Little 'racist' things will bother you every day, and no matter what you do, they simply will not go away. Eventually the stress builds up to a point you can not stand it anymore. Then you will most likely leave Japan with a very bitter taste in your mouth.

On the other hand, you can just accept the things are and eliminate a good part of that stress. Yes, there will still be bad days, but you will be able to keep in localized and therefore have a much easier time dealing with this stress.

The choice is yours, and you may disagree with me. That's fine. Live and learn. Experience is the best teacher!

Mrjones · 7 Dec 2006

nothing to do with topic really.

Mikawa Ossan · 7 Dec 2006

Might I refer you to my first post in this thread.

bexchurnside · 7 Dec 2006

Mikawa Ossan said:
How long do you plan on staying in Japan?
If you plan to stay short term (in other words you have plans to leave Japan in the future), then you're on your own.
If you plan to stay long term, however, I guarrentee you that you WILL be miserable unless you just accept things as they are. Are things perfect? No. But then again, I assume you're here in Japan by choice. Whenever you make a choice there are certain tradeoffs. The culture of "gaijin" is simply a tradeoff for living in Japan. That's the way of things.
If you want to change Japan or at the very least try to be accepted on your own terms, you will wind up like Maciamo. You may find his posts very interesting. I suggest you go pretty far back in time (at least a couple of years) and then slowly read his posts into the present. Notice the change. The same fate could be waiting for you.
Keep in mind that as far as I'm concerned, it's just a matter of cause and effect. Little 'racist' things will bother you every day, and no matter what you do, they simply will not go away. Eventually the stress builds up to a point you can not stand it anymore. Then you will most likely leave Japan with a very bitter taste in your mouth.
On the other hand, you can just accept the things are and eliminate a good part of that stress. Yes, there will still be bad days, but you will be able to keep in localized and therefore have a much easier time dealing with this stress.
The choice is yours, and you may disagree with me. That's fine. Live and learn. Experience is the best teacher!

ﾅｽ窶樞?堙債、窶堋ｱ窶堋､窶堙｢窶堙≫?堙?債ｷ窶｢ﾃ岩?堋ｷ窶堙ｩ窶堙娯?堙坂?氾??堋ｭ窶堙遺?堋｢窶堙?ｽv窶堋｢窶堙懌?堋ｷ窶堋ｪﾂ、窶ｰﾃ､ﾂ々窶堋ｪ窶愿ｺ窶怒窶堙可鞘?ｰ窶堙溪?堙可行窶堋ｭ窶堙娯?堋ｪﾂ焦ｸﾅｽﾃｨ窶堙遺?堙娯?堋ｾ窶堙??ｪ窶敕岩?廬窶堙娯?愿ｺ窶怒ﾂ人窶堙最ｽv窶堙≫?堙??堋｢窶堙ｩ窶堙娯?堋ｾ窶堙?ｽ窶樞?堙最ｽv窶堋｢窶堙懌?堋ｷﾂ。窶愿ｺ窶怒ﾂ人窶傳窶堋ｪﾂ青ｼ窶芭窶堙個坂?倪?堙架?壺?督ｯ窶堋ｷ窶堙ｩﾂ湘ｪﾂ坂?｡窶堙坂?ｰﾃ､ﾂ々窶堙個考窶堋ｦ窶｢ﾃｻ窶堙｢窶｢ﾂｶ窶ｰﾂｻ窶堙個習ﾅ?ﾂｵ窶堙ｰﾅ?w窶堙披?堙冷?堋ｫ窶堋ｽ窶堙??敕｡窶敖ｻﾂ出窶藩??堙ｩ窶堋ｪﾂ、窶ｰﾃ､ﾂ々窶堋ｪ窶愿ｺ窶怒窶堙盈inding their own business in their own country窶堋ｵ窶堙??堋｢窶堙ｩ窶愿ｺ窶怒ﾂ人窶傳窶堙可、racial discrimination 窶堙ｰﾅｽ~窶堙溪?堙??ｰﾂｺ窶堋ｳ窶堋｢窶堙??堋ｩﾂ、ﾅｽ窶樞?傳窶堙個考窶堋ｦ窶｢ﾃｻ窶堙ｰ窶｢ﾂｪ窶堋ｩ窶堙≫?堙??堋ｭ窶堙ｪ窶堙ｩ窶堙冷?堋ｫ窶堋ｾ窶堙?ｽv窶堋､窶昶?卍人窶傳窶堋ｪ窶堋ｬ窶堙｡ﾂー窶堋ｬ窶堙｡ﾂー窶ｹﾂｩ窶堙披?堙娯?堙?ﾂ、ﾅｽﾂｸ窶氾ｧ窶堋ｩ窶堙?窶堋ｵ窶堙ｪ窶堙懌?堋ｹ窶堙ｱﾂ。

Perhaps, it may be true that while we westerners may face discrimination by the Japanese, in Japan, it might be important to also keep in mind that as westerners, it is our fault for going to Japan in the first place. They can simply say, "Sir, I don't care for westerners, and I am happy in my own country minding my own ways and business. I am not coming onto your soil and imposing my views onto you. You came to us when we are merely minding our own business. Therefore, you folks are merely guests here. If you don't like it, why not go back home where you came from?" Am I right? Is this how some Japanese think?

I guess however, even if this is the fate that may be brought upon me, how about an Issei Japanese who repatriates? What would be the logic to that? To they break him back into his former ways, as they feel that it is their responsibility to take back their own, being a collectivist society?

My fiance was ridiculed for his "poor" Japanese skills when he went to Japan, he said. Some people told him to hurry up and learn or it will be "embarassing" 窶冪窶堋ｸ窶堋ｩ窶堋ｵ窶堋｢. They were like Nani, anta no Nihongo? I hope they don't do this number with me. Because I am much worse than my fiance. (or do you fellas have a double standard where we white people can have lousy Japanese, but on re-patriates, while they ultimately get re-accepted, pay the price of learning to re-integrate on the fast lane? Or is it the same for all who act different, either you're in or out. That's it?

Please describe in detail. I want to know.

Mrjones · 7 Dec 2006

"Don't worry; be happy!" talking about ..superfacial.

its your fault for going to Japan in the first place ? Like taking lolipop from the kid type of thing you mean ?

Mikawa Ossan · 7 Dec 2006

Good luck in your future endeavors. Obviously you don't need my help.

Mrjones · 7 Dec 2006

Here's the short answer: You're different. This is related to all racisim all over the world.. my question was about certain location and even more about certain age group.

Sparky · 7 Dec 2006

let me gie you my view. I am a Canadian living in Japan. I have lived here for 6 years now. I was born in Toronto. When I was 17 I left for Vancouver I lived there for 5 years. Then moved to Tokyo.

After 5 years in Vancouver, when people asked where I was from I would say Vancouver. Why? well because it felt more like a home to me then anywhere else.

After 6 years here in Japan Married to a Japanese, a half Japanese son, a dog, and my own business dealing with only Japanese, can I say I'm from Japan or even my little city here...No way!

Why because I am a foreigner. The long and the short of it is this. I dont look Japanese, my name is not Japanese, Heck I am not Japanese.

Even my wife gets asked if she is Japanese, because of here new last name.

Japan dosn't like change and it never will change... well at least not for a very, very long time. Racisim is a part of life while living in Japan and you'll just have to deal with it. Looking for an apartment, looking for a Job, dealing with the athourities, or just plain living will give you enough stress for a lifetime. So I suggest to all, go into your closet scream as loudly as you can, smack your head against the wall a few times, go out on the balcony and scream profanities until your throat hurts. Then shake your head smile andl drop it from a topic in your daily life in Japan. It won't go away!

Well hope this helps a few souls. It's a sad but true part of life in Japan.

Mrjones · 7 Dec 2006

yes.. still I have met many Japanese people who are not racisist, I dont think they all racist. I have common sense for this subject, though they almost always, are not under 25.

Mikawa Ossan · 7 Dec 2006

bexchurnside said:
I guess however, even if this is the fate that may be brought upon me, how about an Issei Japanese who repatriates? What would be the logic to that? To they break him back into his former ways, as they feel that it is their responsibility to take back their own, being a collectivist society?
My fiance was ridiculed for his "poor" Japanese skills when he went to Japan, he said. Some people told him to hurry up and learn or it will be "embarassing" 窶冪窶堋ｸ窶堋ｩ窶堋ｵ窶堋｢. They were like Nani, anta no Nihongo? I hope they don't do this number with me. Because I am much worse than my fiance. (or do you fellas have a double standard where we white people can have lousy Japanese, but on re-patriates, while they ultimately get re-accepted, pay the price of learning to re-integrate on the fast lane? Or is it the same for all who act different, either you're in or out. That's it?
Please describe in detail. I want to know.

Again, it's all a matter of choice. We all make choices with all of the positive and negative consequences that accompany it.

Is it a perfect world? No, of course it isn't. Is Japan a perfect country? No, of course not. No such place exists.

In my opinion, 'where racism in Japan originates from' is purely academic. By the way, I am a white guy living in Japan, so I am actually speaking from experience, limited as it is. I have very little problems with racism here. I do from time to time get treated differently, but guess what? I am different. I don't see the big deal.

In terms of the Issei, there's a phenomenon here called "kikokushijo" which is exactly what you're describing. It's a real problem, to be sure. I feel for your husband, but if wishes to repatriate, he has to do so knowing the results of his choice. This problem with language is one such problem. It's not just language, either. It's cultural.

Repatriating must be the most difficult thing to do. I personally feel changed enough by Japan that if I were to repatriate to America, I can see how I would have a difficult time.

Good luck!

(And seriously, in a society like Japan, the best thing to do is change yourself before you can start to try to change others. I personally don't respect foreign people who expect Japanese people to bend to their will somehow without first trying to make a real effort to get into the Japanese mind to understand where they're coming from.)

Mrjones · 7 Dec 2006

Frankly...Mikawa Ossan, I have hard time to really believe anything of that.

"where they're coming from ?" so where are they coming from then ?

bexchurnside · 7 Dec 2006

Sparky said:
let me gie you my view. I am a Canadian living in Japan. I have lived here for 6 years now. I was born in Toronto. When I was 17 I left for Vancouver I lived there for 5 years. Then moved to Tokyo.
After 5 years in Vancouver, when people asked where I was from I would say Vancouver. Why? well because it felt more like a home to me then anywhere else.
After 6 years here in Japan Married to a Japanese, a half Japanese son, a dog, and my own business dealing with only Japanese, can I say I'm from Japan or even my little city here...No way!
Why because I am a foreigner. The long and the short of it is this. I dont look Japanese, my name is not Japanese, Heck I am not Japanese.
Even my wife gets asked if she is Japanese, because of here new last name.
Japan dosn't like change and it never will change... well at least not for a very, very long time. Racisim is a part of life while living in Japan and you'll just have to deal with it. Looking for an apartment, looking for a Job, dealing with the athourities, or just plain living will give you enough stress for a lifetime. So I suggest to all, go into your closet scream as loudly as you can, smack your head against the wall a few times, go out on the balcony and scream profanities until your throat hurts. Then shake your head smile andl drop it from a topic in your daily life in Japan. It won't go away!
Well hope this helps a few souls. It's a sad but true part of life in Japan.

Thank you. I am right now living near Commercial Drive + West 2nd Avenue in Vancouver. Was there a Starbucks there when you last saw it? Doesn't Japan make Kerrisdale seem so open minded or what?

But guess what? As westerners that you and I are, can we really ask them to stop being racist, if they are in their own country? I mean the Chinese living in Richmond, BC, I love to ask them when they are going to bother to learn English, but they came to Canada, and thus obligated to accept multicultralism. But those who stay on their own soil and never bother coming over to the West, all I can say is let them be. I can accept them not accepting me, but my Japanese fiance, it is a whole new matter. How about Issei borns who repatriated and married their own back home? Do they just let them be like gaijins and get left alone, or are they like or worse than my fiance, made to bring their understanding of both language and culture to not just semi-functional like I am striving for, but to Mastery where they finally cannot distinguish the difference between the repatriate and the rest?

Why not get your wife to apply for Canadian citizenship? If she is going to get gaijin status, maybe she should get the "benefits" of it also!

Mikawa Ossan · 7 Dec 2006

Mrjones said:
Frankly...Mikawa Ossan, I have hard time to really believe anything of that.

"where they're coming from ?" so where are they coming from then ?

Which part don't you believe?

Where are the Japanese coming from? If you don't believe anything I have said thus far, then why should I assume that you'll listen to anything I have to say from now on?

Mrjones · 7 Dec 2006

I have hard time to believe my japanese girfriend can take it, but I am not optimistic person anyways.
"Which part don't you believe?" becouse all you are saying is common sense and it is very little of the context what you have writen is raleted to topic.

Mikawa Ossan · 7 Dec 2006

Mrjones said:
"Which part don't you believe?" becouse all you are saying is common sense and is minimal of the context of your writings are not raleted to topic.

Yes, I'm glad you noticed that it is "common sense". Then what is your problem?

Mrjones · 7 Dec 2006

"Yes, I'm glad you noticed that it is "common sense". Then what is your problem?"

read the topic

Mikawa Ossan · 7 Dec 2006

Mrjones said:
"Yes, I'm glad you noticed that it is "common sense". Then what is your problem?"
read the topic

I did. That's why I gave you common sense.

Mrjones · 7 Dec 2006

to make it clear.. the topic is : Racisim in Japan, between younger generantion people, below age of 25.

"Yes, I'm glad you noticed that it is "common sense". Then what is your problem? " ok I can live with that.. now just leave the topic for other people

Mikawa Ossan · 7 Dec 2006

Mrjones said:
ok I can live with that.. now just leave the topic for other people

That's fine with me. I'm going to bed soon, anyway. It was nice talking with you. Good luck with your future endeavors here in Japan!

what is the reason for racism in Japan ?

先輩

いかんわ！

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puzzled gaijin

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Kouhai

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The Canadian

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Kouhai

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いかんわ！

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いかんわ！

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