Translation of one word

Gandja · 1 Aug 2004

Hi!
My first question is what does ドッグ mean??Also I will be greatful if somebody wrote it in romaji(because I'm not sure).

Second question is how to write on this forum in japanese language? (now I just copy->paste )

blessed · 1 Aug 2004

in romanji that is doggu, but i dont know what i t means... sounds like dog though... although in japanese thats "ken".

TwistedMac · 1 Aug 2004

ﾄﾞッｸﾞ
doggu i think this is..

and since it's katakana... "dog"? i dunno..

edit> heh, i took too long typing and got beaten by blessed XD

in any case.. i thought dog in japanese was inu?

Elizabeth · 1 Aug 2004

: Doggu :

ドッグ andiron; dog; locking dog [Ex][G][GI][ S ] (as in hot dog, the food)
ドッグファイト dogfight; (P) [G][GI][ S ]
ドッグレース dog racing

blessed · 1 Aug 2004

ahh, the kanji has two readings: ken and inu. which one is the compound one i don't know. :sorry:

Gandja · 2 Aug 2004

I thought that ッ mean 'shi' not 'g'?

TwistedMac · 2 Aug 2004

when it's smaller than the rest of the signs like that it's used as a sudden halt.. it adds a letter in romaji..

also, it's the tsu sign..

fixelbrumpf · 2 Aug 2004

blessed said:
ahh, the kanji has two readings: ken and inu. which one is the compound one i don't know. :sorry:

That would be "ken". The kun reading of 犬 is "inu", the on reading is "ken", used in words like "aiken" (pet dog.)

The small tsu is "doubles" the preceding consonant, by the way.

Glenn · 2 Aug 2004

fixelbrumpf said:
The small tsu is "doubles" the preceding consonant, by the way.

It doubles the following consonant.

TwistedMac · 2 Aug 2004

that's a very romaji way of thinking though.. how would you explain it if romaji didnt exist?

if you compare doggu to dogu you'll notice dogu would have a longer o sound.. sooo.. i still stand by my abrupt halt theory

Glenn · 2 Aug 2004

TwistedMac said:
that's a very romaji way of thinking though.. how would you explain it if romaji didnt exist?

Well, this is assuming that the person knows what a doubled consonant means in the first place. It would obviously be impossible to try to tell someone looking at romaji how to pronounce the double consonant by saying that it's a double consonant.

TwistedMac said:
if you compare doggu to dogu you'll notice dogu would have a longer o sound.. sooo.. i still stand by my abrupt halt theory

I don't think that the length of vowels in Japanese is determined by the following consonants, and this supports that thought (scroll down to 1.2.3.).

TwistedMac · 2 Aug 2004

When followed by a plosive like "t" and "k", /Q/ is a breath stop with the mouth position to pronounce the next consonant.

i'm not sure, but i think this is exactly what i'm saying..

Glenn · 2 Aug 2004

TwistedMac said:
i'm not sure, but i think this is exactly what i'm saying..

Um, it says that there is a pause between the vowel and the consonant, but the vowel isn't pronounced any longer than if it weren't there. It sounded like you were saying that the "o" in doggu would be longer than the "o" in dogu.

TwistedMac · 2 Aug 2004

do you have any idea what small amounts of this stuff my brain can handle? i'm getting completely confused here >_<

anyway, i WAS saying that in the case of romaji, a double consonant basically shortens the vowel preceding it.. just to annoy me i can't think of any good words in english but a million in swedish.. (not a literal million, no)

if you say doggu (assuming it was an english word) you'll pronouce it like dog with the attachment gu, right? dogu however wouldn't be pronounced like dog, it would go more along the lines of [dougu] (like the o in tofu)... am i even slightly on the right path here?

anyway, that would shorten the vowel preceding the tsu by halting it quickly after saying it instead of allowing it to stretch, creating a pause... i think...

maybe the reason i cant find any examples in english is you pronounce dogu and doggu exactly alike? in which case i'm wrong, please go back to bed.

i guess a swedish example would be in order anyway...

kapa [caupa] (hijack)
kappa [cappa] (coat)

Glenn · 2 Aug 2004

Alright, here is my understanding of how it works in Japanese.

All morae are pronounced for the same length of time. The small tsu, n, and the elongated vowel are all morae. Every vowel, consonant + vowel, and consonant + semivowel are all one mora, as well as the above mentioned three. So, even the halt is pronounced with the same duration as every other part of the word. That means that dogu is two morae, and doggu is three. As far as I can tell, the small tsu does nothing to the previous vowel, it is merely a silent mora. Does that help to clear things up at all?

TwistedMac · 2 Aug 2004

hm.. not really.. wouldnt that sorta make it sound like two words with a halt inbetween instead of like doggu?

Glenn · 2 Aug 2004

TwistedMac said:
hm.. not really.. wouldnt that sorta make it sound like two words with a halt inbetween instead of like doggu?

Well, I don't think that kata sounds like one word and katta two, so, I would say no. But I guess it depends on how that sounds to you.

TwistedMac · 2 Aug 2004

yeah.. i'm gonna trust your knowledge on this one, you're the senpai after all

Elizabeth · 2 Aug 2004

Glenn said:
Well, I don't think that kata sounds like one word and katta two, so, I would say no. But I guess it depends on how that sounds to you.

There seems to be more variation in enlongated vowels than consonants, for instance I've heard 'ei' mora that sound closer to a sequenced e and i and I've heard them with no distinction whatsoever. Although there probably is some individual difference in 'choppiness' and 'glide' with the long ggu as well.

Mike Cash · 2 Aug 2004

TwistedMac said:
i guess a swedish example would be in order anyway...

kapa [caupa] (hijack)
kappa [cappa] (coat)

Is it possible that the Japanese raingear "kappa" gets it's name from Swedish?

TwistedMac · 2 Aug 2004

not impossible, but i would think improbable =/

The swedish language hasn't exactly made an impact on the world we've shared ombudsman, smörgåsbord and one that has to do with rocks.. i forget...

David Hallgren · 2 Aug 2004

Tungsten (The Swedish word that has to do with rocks...)
or in Japanese
タングステン
And for those of you who don't speak Swedish:
"Tung" means Heavy
"Sten" means Stone

PaulTB · 2 Aug 2004

mikecash said:
Is it possible that the Japanese raingear "kappa" gets it's name from Swedish?

More likely from the other 'kappa' associated with things wet in Japan.

They these guys? 河童屋（カッパヤ）業務用合羽製造販売袖口から濡れない特殊雨合羽は必見です in 龍神村

Translation of one word

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