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The jref curse;

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Doc said:
I don't think it would work out. ;-)

Doc 🙂

Yeah, me neither. The color of my eyes might turn him off, my hair has been kind of mangy lately, and I haven't shaved in a few weeks. Ar, I'm a mess. 😊

But I'm done here (this thread), so whether it's locked or not is fine. I don't really have any hard feelings toward RockLee, really, and I'm sure he's a nice fellow in person. I was more than a bit troubled by the nature of his posts though. So yeah.

Um. How about those wrasslers?
 
lastmagi said:
I believe the level of this thread's discussion has dipped somewhat... I'm unsure why RockLee is starting to focus his anger at me, so if this continues into another angry argument thread, I'll have to ask Maciamo to lock this, because what is being discussed at present isn't really worth anyone's reading time.
Let me explain my motivations to you.


Originally Posted by RockLee
I know he posted some offensive things, but I didn't see anything really offensive that would get him a ban.


That may be true. You might not have seen anything offensive in particular, but apparently there were many others, including myself, who saw something offensive, and we made every effort to reason and argue with him before he got banned. Must we justify once again our arguments? Are you the sole, standalone arbitrator of what is to be offensive or not? I respect the fact that you have confidence in your own sense of what is right and wrong, but one's senses alone is never 100% perfect. Perhaps our moral consciousnesses differ that you feel so strongly in support of him (in which case I wonder why you did not participate or reason your arguments as strongly as you could in the McTojo threads)?
I don't know but isn't it exactly what I'm doing right now? Unfortunately Maciamo decided to ban him before we could even defend him.Also one is entitled on his own opinions as long as he doesn't enforce them on other.This is a bandwagon thing, more than one person wanted him to leave because they didn't agree with his opinion and find his posts offensive.But who are you to decide that it is really offensive?

You also seem to imply that you have better, clearer judgement than others?
Are you the sole, standalone arbitrator of what is to be offensive or not? I respect the fact that you have confidence in your own sense of what is right and wrong, but one's senses alone is never 100% perfect.

Aren't you doing the same thing as you are accusing me of ?


Originally Posted by RockLee
You're implying too much, and I recommend you stop doing that.


Well, taking things at face value is not something I like to do, so... Anyway, there is no valid reason not to draw obvious implications from any statement, and you didn't really give a good point of argument with solid reasons for this particular quoted statement, so I'll leave it there.
I take it by that statement that you don't believe that he has made some offensive remarks? You also seem to imply that you have better, clearer judgement than others?Will this suffice? Stop acting like you know everything man.I can't stand THAT behaviour ! It's one of the reasons I replied to you on your post.

OK. I think we all know where this discussion is headed. I don't really mind that you gave me a bad rep point, but the reason for it was rather immature (or maybe that's why I don't mind in the first place), and suggests your hypocrisy as far as the abuse of the rep system goes. I won't give you a bad rep, because the last thing I want is to sink to that level of heated mud-slinging. I have already responded to what you addressed in the rep message, but for the sake of privacy, you'll have to dig around to find it.
What, I thought you said it meant for giving feed-back? Wasn't that exactly what I did ? Sake of privacy ? you posted this :
Furthermore, I will be placing you on my ignore list for an as-yet undetermined length of time. I'm sure you won't mind, and I think it's for the better.
First tell everybody that you put me in your ignore list and then sending me a pm you put me into the list.Talking about sinking low...

That may have been true (at least, in part). Then why did you not stand up for him more prominently before? The JREF forum is not just about the rep points, you realize, but the discussions. Perhaps those discussions could have used your contribution. Logic would suggest that the fact that you are so strongly defensive about him now + that you agreed with one of his points = you would have at least contributed something to McTojo's cause before, when he was really under fire (of reasoned debate, that is). That you didn't suggests to me that you had nothing to add and/or your justification was on shaky ground (not necessarily mutually exclusive).
Why make a double post? You already asked this.If it's about the discussions, then why ban someone if you don't want him to discuss? True, he tried to stirr up a stink on occasions, but he had good threads too.

How? I admit, I have a natural aversion to arguments that use "Still! X is [adjective]" because it doesn't really add any new points.

To whom is it provocative? McTojo was neither mentioned nor alluded to in the original post. All the OP was about was a rumored "curse" in JREF regarding the bad rep points. Eventually the discussion got around the McTojo, but that was because he had 3 bad rep points, and thus relevant to the discussion.
I can't believe you actually posted this :sick:

And finally, please review the examples I gave of what a provocative poster is, if you didn't before (or if you decided to ignore it). I thought that since you seemed so energized about provocative posters needing to be banned that you would at least have acknowledged those passages, but you didn't, which suggests, at best, denial of arguments that go against you, and at worst, hypocrisy that you would support someone who did the same things you accused the OP of doing.
That's not provoking, that's having a debate.The intention of this post was to cause a stink towards McTojo's rep points.And from there this mess started to grow bigger and bigger.

I think that the amount of faith-based arguments in your post (not in the traditional sense, mind you; I mean stuff like: "But still!", "well I think it was okay", "You are ____" with no reasons/evidence given, etc) highlights the extent to which you can handle this discussion. You did nothing but finger-pointing, and your excited nature of your posts did not help either. Not only that, but as I've noted, since your justifications for your arguments are on shaky grounds, it lends one suspicion about hypocrisy and immaturity. For these reasons, I will be requesting Maciamo to lock this thread, with my apologies to the original poster, jack2.
By posting replies like this :
That is why I am at a fundamental disagreeance with RockLee bla bla bla
and attacking me because of my opinions it seems you are the one who can't debate in an appropriate way.You start accusing me of things and claiming I know things better.That sort of attitude I cannot tolerate, another reason I posted a reply.

Furthermore, I will be placing you on my ignore list for an as-yet undetermined length of time. I'm sure you won't mind, and I think it's for the better.

Good day.
Wow, you had to say that in public didn't you?

edit: I realize this post may reek of pomposity. If anyone thinks I am saying something along the lines of "Well, I'M the one on the higher ground because I'M mature," don't worry. I know I probably have a poor EQ and I know I have a really bad IQ, but there are simply some behaviors that I just cannot stand. :sorry:
Knowing yourself is the start of all wisdom.


I'm sorry I always have to be part of this kind of arguements, but sometimes I'm getting sick of how some people act on this forum.I don't know where it went wrong...hope there won't be anymore incidents.
 
This has become nothing more than an argument between the two of you. If you gentlemen would like to continue your debate, might I suggest you do it in PMs. This thread is now closed. I want peace.
 
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