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Jap or Jpn?

moyashi

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I grew up in Western New York State and by the time I was 16 I had a pretty good collection of 3 letter anagrams.

It seems that most of these even have an order of creation. Whenever, a new group enters an area heavily the older group finds ways to belittle the newer group. ie, we have such terms as "hen pecking order."

It's too bad that the human condition is set so that we find it easy to prejudice ourselves against others. I wonder if the internet will help lessen this problem? On the net, we find ourselves communicating with various people of various ages of various races of various backgrounds. Now, if we could only just take this a step further.
 

Kjeld

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Evolution has given us the gift to notice differences for survival. Unfortunately it is also often used for less worthy uses. So I am grateful for this and similar forums, on and off-line, where we can all show tolerance and openness and learn in the process.

The deeper we dive into a different culture, the more we are tested. I find that encountering a very different culture teaches you about your own culture. It always amazes me how arbitrary everything is. Very often there is no good reason to do something in one way and not another. Yet, we all think that that particular way is the one and holy way to do things.

When we encounter differences, some of us learn, some don't. I hope I will always be able to learn, yet remain my ability to observe, notice and critically analyze the societies that surrround me.

;)
 

thomas

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I bear the same hope.
 
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kinjo

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sigh!! spoken like three wise men🙂

If only we could all(entire world population) adhere to your life styles and beleifs, then this world could become one population and not a series of statistics of each divided country, either by water or borders, and all people could be accepted as they are and not as they are preceived.🙂
 

thomas

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Even "wise" men are far from being perfect, Debs. Something else: "Jewish American Princess" (JAP), what's the exact meaning of that term?
 
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moyashi

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lol, my wife thinks I'm the stupidest of all her ex-boyfriends.

hmmm... Jewish American Princess. Jewish people = Rich and Princess = their daughters. So you have young Jewish girls running around who think and behave like that they are Princesses. That's part of it. I'm pretty sure that there is a bit more to this though. Sorry I didn't grow up in the NYC area.
 

geomc

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gaijin

I lived in Thailand for 9 years and the term there was Farang. Similarly it was not considered derogatory by the Thai people but we Farangs actually used it in a derogatory manner among our selves. We would see a "new comer" do something culturally embarassing and we would all say or think, "What a stupid Farang" Farang means outsider or foriegner, but basically only applies to westerners.

Geo
 

thomas

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I think the Chinese have the term "gweilo" for the same thing.

In Egypt, where I've lived for a couple of years, foreigners are called "khawaga", originally a Persian term for "lord". It's only applied to white foreigners. A khawaga is respected, but on the other hand ridiculised, as he/she usually doesn't know how to behave properly, but they are always forgiven. It doesn't carry a negative meaning as "gaijin" though.
 

moyashi

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Auslander?

hehe, Germans and Japanese are part of the same family maybe?
 

thomas

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Ausländer... hmmm, certainly doesn't mean "outsider" in the sense of "we" and "them", it just refers to someone from another country. On the other hand..... guess I have to think about it.

/me scratches his head
 

moyashi

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hehe, an old baba at a supermarket said under here breadth "auslander" while my father and I were talking in English. My father turned around and nailed her for it since he is German not American ;)
 

thomas

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Always depends on the context. "Ausländer" per se has no negative connotation. Hm, nowadays urban Europe is so "multi-cultural", I doubt that anyone would point a finger on foreigners.
 
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It's unfortunate but some words of hate still remain and will always. A while ago a person was running for a small political office, and he was a WW2 vet, and used that term. When questioned about it, he referred The word "Jap" to the soldiers who bhrutalized POW's and did other things as well. He said he wasn't talking about japanese people themselves. I remember reading about it but didn't quite follow the aftermath of it.
 

Grachan

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I know that my wife and her mother - both Japanese - find the term 'Jap' offensive. Their reason is that it is a wartime term, and they both feel that its use by western people means that they still think of them in the same way as they were seen then - as warlike people. There is certainly still a lot of sensitivity from the people I know in Japan about how the country became during that time.

My own mother used to use the term Jap all the time and it drove my wife mad! In the end I had to tell my mum to stop saying it and she told me I was being stupid as it wasn't offensive, but then I told her it was my wife who was being offended she hasn't said it since!
 

Mae

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I'm new here, so i don't know what will offend u. What in my mind is that, why can't i use jap refering japanese, i used that becoz i found that the japanese word is too long and jap is just a short form of japanese, it doesn't contain any sign of offence. And pleazz, forget those cruel and brutal memories u have, clear off ur old visions and there'll be a whole new world. -_-
 

jspecdan

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I've never found "Jap" to be anything but offensive. "I just got the Jap version of the game." or "Jap cars are awesome." Even if the word is used positively, it still doesn't work. Stick to Japanese, Japan. It's definitely not the same as sayin "nigga" and "nigger".

of course there's always JAP - Jewish American Princess as you guys mentioned.
 

den4

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of course, one of the things people overlook these days in this overly politically correct wannabe world is that far too many people are far too sensitive about the little things and get far too easily offended by the same...

one of the things that has been lost in the PC world is common sense...if you believe something is offensive, then don't do it; alternatively, if you do something offensive on purpose, expect the counterattack as a result and don't be surprised by this. If you are being offensive through ignorance, then best learn what else is offensive and correct this behavior if you wish to remain on the good side of people, and if you're one of the jerks that want to flame others, then also expect the results you receive afterwards...all pretty simple stuff.

I used to find being called such names as offensive, but of late, I really don't care, since, although I don't condone it, people will be people. Having said that, those people that insist upon purposely offending others do not receive help from me, and in the long run, like karma, what goes around comes around...

that's my take on such things...

it's the way of things.....just like Merlin says in "Excalibur"...."for it is the doom of men that they shall forget...." and repeat their mistakes over and over again into the next millenium...and this goes for women, too, who are not immune to doing foolish things

Jap is offensive and anybody telling you otherwise is living in denial.... :D
 

Dream Time

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Originally posted by thomas
I think the Chinese have the term "gweilo" for the same thing.

In Egypt, where I've lived for a couple of years, foreigners are called "khawaga", originally a Persian term for "lord". It's only applied to white foreigners. A khawaga is respected, but on the other hand ridiculised, as he/she usually doesn't know how to behave properly, but they are always forgiven. It doesn't carry a negative meaning as "gaijin" though.

yes, "gweilo" is a Cantonese term
it means 'ghost human'
it origin from when the Cantonese Chinese people first seen the Westerners,they thought their looks and languages do not look like a 'normal' human,instead they think the Westerners are like ghost
 

Dream Time

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calling Japanese a Jap
is like calling a Chinese 'Ching','Chink', or 'China man',
calling Korean a 'gook',
it is very offensive

in Chinese,people used to (especially during WW2) call the Japanese 'carrot head'
and now the Cantonese Chinese call the Japanese 'ga jai' ('ga boy', the word 'ga' is referring to the Japanese language because they always have the sound 'ga' at the end)

in Japanese,Japanese people call foreigners 'gaijin'
but when referring to 'Chinese people',they have another term to specify that,I forgot,it is something like chikku something,
and they call us something like 'zhina',this word originally was ok, but during WW2 the meaning of this word became close to 'pig',that is why some Chinese people get very angry when they hear Japanese call them this
 

Matsuyuu

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Hey, hey, hey...

I think there's a difference between being racist and politcal correctness. Think about it, does it really matter what people call your race? I'm white. I'm a cracker, redneck, wigger, what ever you wanna call me. Nobody cares when you call a white person something politically incorrect, but if you say "black" instead of "of african descent" people can get offended or say that the use of "black" is questionable.
Another reason people may use the word "Jap" is because 1.) it's easier to spell and say than Japanese, 2.) There was a whole generation around the 1940's that were told to believe that the Japanese were evil because of a world war. There is, as we all know, the person that is ignorant of another group's feelings and uses a derogatory word for the purpose of demoralizing them.
Still, I say that most Native english-speakers who use the word Jap are in the right. Personally, I wouldn't care if someone called me "Amer" or some variant thereof.
So if you don't make fun of other races, good for you (seriously, tolerance is one thing, but love of your neighbor is even better), but don't get so easily offended by some hardly-offensive word used by people you don't know.
 

den4

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yes, there is a difference between PC and racism, but they are both offensive on opposite ends of the spectrum. Where a racist will call upon class/race distinction to claim superiority/inferiority upon others, a politically correct initiative will attempt to try to neutralize any distinction between groups to the point where nothing can be done without insulting somebody---and everything becomes drab and boring with neutered-language-modified-vocabulary that ends up really insulting the intelligence of all save those that have already been lobotomized and brainwashed with the PC agenda...

both are evil in my book...because both sides fail to attempt at a balance, claiming their side is the only side that is right, and that they are the only ones that know what's good for you...

tends to increase the incompetent into positions they don't deserve in the name of fairness, where in reality it should be based upon folks that are actually willing to work well with others and promote mutual progress....I guess I'm a bit pessimistic having seen so many incompetents at my previous work places with the folks telling me constantly about their politically correct agenda...so my rant....sorry.. :(
 
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If I could post HTML, I can point out a lot of reasons why I am offended by the title Jap

I'm new here, so i don't know what will offend u. What in my mind is that, why can't i use jap refering japanese, i used that becoz i found that the japanese word is too long and jap is just a short form of japanese, it doesn't contain any sign of offence. And pleazz, forget those cruel and brutal memories u have, clear off ur old visions and there'll be a whole new world. -_-

Would you call a black person a Nigger? No? Then what makes you think that an American of Japanese ancestry would tolerate the word Jap? And if you really want to split hairs, Nigger can therefore be a reference to Niger. If you're Japanese or of Japanese ancestry, then fine, but don't expect a lot of respect from people who think that the word is distasteful.
 
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I disagree. The term "Oriental" is not offensive in the USA, any more so than the term "Causasian", or "Indian". But I think that you were getting at something else: Basically, any term CAN be offensive, if we want it to be! The opposite, I think, is also true. In my case, for example, I was so totally fascinated by just about everything that was Japanese, or Japanese related, that no one ever took offense at my mistakes, etc.! (GRIN) I am still that way, actually. I cannot get enough of Japan, and probably never will. So, I may always be a "gaijin", but my heart will always be "日本人”.
Regards,
Tachi

Tachi, you're from Japan I assume. I detest the term Oriental because it categorizes my and our identity into that proverbial melting-pot. Also, in the 60s in the United States, the activist group Yellow Brotherhood stressed the importance of self-identity, especially when our beloved government tried to group my people into one sect. In other words, you are Oriental. No the TBH said, we are Asian. With the U.S. occupying Japan, would you be offended if they tried to group you into one identity? I'm sure you would. i don't know if you know this, but titles are used to oppress people. At one time Negro was a title used by our government as a form of identification. Then after the 60s, the Black Panthers changed the relatively harmless word of Negro to Black or African American. Same goes with the term Oriental to Asian. The term itself is not offensive or racist, but it lacks the self-identity many of the Asian Americans fought and struggled for...self-realization, self-identity, autonomy and self. Unlike Japan where you folks brought up to submit to authority: No guns, no dissent, we were brought up to question authority and by subjecting ourselves to this new idea, do you and everyone else outside of our spectrum know how free we truly are. I am a gun-totting liberal, and I choose my destiny. I have no allegiance to the emperor nor do I have an obligation to take care of my parents like my parents did when my grandparents were alive. Do I hate my parents? No. I love my parents, but being here in the States, allows us to be autonomous from the culture you and my parents followed, because, I am an American, of Japanese ancestry. I am an Asian American.

I have noticed that there is a trend among American's to refer to people as 'Asian', rather than 'Oriental'. I am comfortable with both terms, but find the former too general.
In normal British usage I think that 'Asian' denotes people from India, Pakistan and the surrounding area. It would not usually be applied to someone from Turkey or China, which are geographically part of Asia.
The term Oriental, which historically has been used to describe the 'exotic east' from Turkey right through to Japan. Has in modern British usage come to mean someone from China, Korea, Japan and the surrounding area.
I have good Indian friends who describe themselves as 'Asian', but me as 'Oriental'. Which is also how I am described on the EQUITY (British Actors' Equity Association) list.

You may be, but I'm not. read the comment I wrote to Tachi
 
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Incidentally, there is a programme on British television called 'Banzai', which is a Japanese themed 'home betting show'. It features situations that people at home can bet on the outcome (either among their friends or via the interactive button on the TV). It is often slapstick and rude, but not really offensive.
I don't watch the programme, but my daughter told me that in a recent edition the presenter, himself Japanese, referred to the notion among foreign people that, "The Japanese are a nation of slanty-eyed, sandal-wearing goldfish lovers." Apparently he was quoting from a well-known film.
Would such a reference be allowed on American television?

Actually, yes. In the United States, the First Amendment to the Constitution would permit trash like this. But on the other hand, there would be boycotts and the consumer would try to determine the destiny of said show. If the consumer finds something offensive, the consume would boycott the sponsors and the show would most likely be tossed. Sounds unfair to the producers? That there is also a free speech issue.
 
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