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Help translating and explaining this sentence

Shasaur

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Hey, it'd be nice if anyone could translate the following sentence (it's from a really great song) and explain which romaji corresponds to which kanji and word in english.
"Asobi hanbun de kami ga michibiita banjou no sekai"
I know the hiragana alphabet and some katakana along with a few kanji here and there, but even with the following kanji/hiragana that are supposed to represent this sentence:
遊び半分で 神が導いた 盤上の世界
I had trouble understanding which specific kanji and particles correspond to what word. It would help my learning a lot if someone could clear it up.

Thanks a lot in advance.
 
Have you learned grammar, for instance adnominal/attributive/modifying clause?
 
I'm in the process of learning the grammar at the moment, and I was hoping that this would help in providing an example I could work with.
 
I had trouble understanding which specific kanji and particles correspond to what word.
Does this mean you don't know the function of で / が / の or the conjugation of verbs?
 
I posses understanding of those particles now, however I still find difficulty in translating the sentence meaning due to not being able to make out what parts of it mean and the words that they correspond to.
 
You mean you can't parse the sentence/clause/phrase; 遊び / 半分 / で / 神 / が / 導いた / 盤上 / の / 世界?
 
I'm in the process of learning the grammar at the moment, and I was hoping that this would help in providing an example I could work with.

Unfortunately, it really won't.

What materials are you using for learning?
 
You mean you can't parse the sentence/clause/phrase; 遊び / 半分 / で / 神 / が / 導いた / 盤上 / の / 世界?
Yes, although I'm familiar with 世界 (world) and 神 (god), I had the most trouble trying to translate 盤上 as dictionaries weren't really returning anything. Your splitting of the sentence actually kinda helped, thanks. But do you have any idea on what each part means and the overall sentence meaning?
Unfortunately, it really won't.

What materials are you using for learning?
I don't specifically follow a book or a structured guideline, my methods of learning are rather unconventional but they're a lot more interesting and entertaining to keep me involved.
 
That sounds fascinating. Could you type up an explanation of your methods and tell us some of the aspects of Japanese grammar you have managed to intuit so far, please?
 
遊び半分で = 遊び半分に
遊び半分に
partly for fun
「遊び半分に」の英語・英語例文・英語表現 - Weblio和英辞書

「導く」の英語・英語例文・英語表現 - Weblio和英辞書

「盤」の英語・英語例文・英語表現 - Weblio和英辞書


読み方:じょう
文法情報(grammatical information)(名詞(noun) 接尾辞(suffix))
(2)
aboard (a ship or vehicle); on top of; on; above
http://ejje.weblio.jp/content/上
Thus, 盤上(の) means "on a gameboard".

Now you got the meanings of all the words/particles, right? I wonder how you interpret the meaning of the entire phrase* without knowing even the function of the modifying clause. (*Your example is a noun phrase, not a sentence.)
 
Alright thanks a bunch, that cleared those parts up so that they made more sense. I'll try to translate it:
遊び半分 => Partly for fun
で => 'de' particle indicated it is a reason
神 が => god (subject)
導いた => 導 = to lead/to show the way/to bring (although I'm still unsure of the いた part)
盤上 => on/on top of/aboard a gameboard (didn't realize this way two seperate words, no wonder I couldn't find the meaning)
の => 'no' particle joins the possessor and possessee
世界 => world

So something along the lines of:
Partly for fun, God brought us to a world on top a gameboard

How for off am I? It would be very generous of you to explain which parts I didn't quite get right.
 
How for off am I?
The biggest problem is you don't know modifying clause, as I wrote repeatedly.

although I'm still unsure of the いた part
This shows that you are still a pure beginner and are not ready for translating Japanese sentences yet. First of all, you HAVE TO remember the conjugations of all types of verbs. My two cents.
 
Ah alright, thanks for the useful tips. I'll work on learning the verb conjugations from now.
 
Ah alright, thanks for the useful tips. I'll work on learning the verb conjugations from now.

I would appreciate it if you would answer my question.
 
I would appreciate it if you would answer my question.
Well it's a shame you didn't bother to answer mine. I haven't been learning for that long, so I'm not sure about the viability of my methods yet, I'll share them if they end up proving useful.
 
Well it's a shame you didn't bother to answer mine. I haven't been learning for that long, so I'm not sure about the viability of my methods yet, I'll share them if they end up proving useful.

Answering yours would have been pointless, as already demonstrated by your inability to correctly understand the answer you were subsequently given.

I just get a little tired of people who know absolutely nothing, who are either too smart, too cheap, or too something else to make use of existing learning materials and don't seem to realize that their "unique" learning methods consist essentially of having us type up just especially for them individualized explanations/lessons...the same thing they would find in a textbook if they didn't consider themselves too special to use one.

We're here to help others understand things they're having trouble with learning Japanese, not to write anew individualized lessons from scratch based on whatever random phrase or sentence somebody drags in from a comic book.

Your sentence fragment would require us to write you lessons on:

1. Particles in general
2. The use of で (you got the wrong one)
3. The use of が
4. Verb conjugation
5. Modifying clauses

Get off your I'm-too-special-for-a-textbook thing, plunk down a few bucks, and start from learning the basics in a sensible manner and order if you seriously want to learn Japanese. Your current plan is a recipe for wasting time and spinning your wheels.

You haven't been with us to notice it, but Toritoribe's answer was essentially a passive-aggressive version of what I just told you. He dropped all that stuff in your lap to let you wallow through it and on the far end be told that you haven't figured it out in order to make the same point I'm making: your special "method" won't work, is a waste of your time, and that we aren't going to be textbook replacements for you by writing lessons just for you when they already exist and you just choose to turn your nose up at them.

There, I've answered your question. Now tell me your special method for intuiting Japanese grammar. Why it failed to tell you that 導いた is the past tense of 導く would be a good start.

Tell me in what way your method would figure out the differences between the following:

飲む
飲める
飲んでいる
飲んだら
飲めば
飲みたい
飲みたくない
飲み
お飲みになる
飲まれる
飲ませる
飲ませた
飲ます
飲ました
飲みました
飲めました
飲まれたら
飲まん
飲めん

and several other variants of 飲む, all DOUBLED by the existence of the more "polite" conjugations.

There is more to learning Japanese than just figuring out how to copy-paste kanji into some sort of lookup device. You have about as much chance at figuring out Japanese grammar by your special method as the proverbial million monkeys with a million typewriters typing for a million years have of turning out the works of Shakespeare.

Now, once you get over the indignation of being talked to like that, the answer to your next question is: A commonly recommended textbook is the Genki series. Get the accompanying workbook and audio materials as well.

And, yes, we will help you with it.
 
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I found a while back some attempts of mine at translating songs on an ancient hard drive, which was mildly hilarious. It's something a lot of beginners do, and it's a terrible way to start out because songs don't follow the usual rules in any language (imagine a learner of English trying to make sense out of Lucy In the Sky With Diamonds, or basically any lyrics by my hero, Neil Finn).
 
Mike, thank you for spending all that time typing up that fine answer.

Your post, and this entire thread actually helped me understand a lot, it showed me the areas in which I need to master to translate an entire Japanese sentence (so I guess that does prove that my methods work heh) and helped provide an example that I now understand a lot better. Your posts (especially your list), allowed me to obtain a guideline of what to also focus on in my learning sessions besides my usual. Thank you fine sirs, you've accelerated my learning already.

PS: To clarify: I prefer going at a more relaxed pace and having fun on the way is personally a better alternative than dreading through another dictating textbook (even if it may be slower overall, I'm not in the rush you seem to think I am in order to learn the language). This little interactive learning experience in this thread has been fun.

PPS: I'll let you know in 10 years if I actually learnt anything at all.

PPPS: I just realized you're taking a very anti-Socrates approach to new methods.

I tried to pick a sentence that wasn't too abnormal, obviously I'm not just going to be using songs to learn Japanese (but I'll still make sure I go through some interesting lines they contain).
 
So just what is this new "method" you've invented?

By the way, you are far from being the first person we've encountered with their own unique "method" for learning Japanese. You're practically part of a meme.

Interestingly, we always see them at the point where they have learned hiragana, figured out how to electronically look up kanji, know about a half-dozen words....and are sure they're going to figure out the rest through their superior intelligence. Some of them even convince themselves their knowledge and "method" make them the ideal person to teach Japanese and they set up websites, blogs, or YouTube channels to inflict their ignorance on the world at large.

I don't expect to hear back from you in ten years. I'd be amazed if you're still with this ten weeks from now.

By the way, obtuse one, for the umpteenth time...what you selected was not a sentence.
 
I figured I'm not the first, but I would have never guessed that I fall so perfectly into that category you described. Well, that just makes me even more determined to surpass all those that have fallen at this point – thanks for the motivation. Although do people actually make YouTube channels and websites for this? I suppose teaching someone else is reinforcing their own memories, so it helps themselves learn it, at least theoretically.

Oh and that 10 years thing was a joke, you were supposed to have at least a slight chuckle, ah well... Also, is that a challenge I hear? Well, don't be surprised in 10 weeks then. I've got an additional set of clear learning targets to aim for now thanks to you guys, there is no reason I should fail.

You sure like giving more reasons to keep studying don't you.
 
If anything I have said encourages you to study, that's fine. You wouldn't be the first person to learn Japanese motivated at least in part to spite somebody who thought you couldn't. I doubt that I was the first one either. So if spite works for you like it worked for me, then I am by no means distressed to be the target of it.

My initial goal, by the way, was "reasonable proficiency in ten years". So you have the "this is going to take a while" bit, which is more promising of eventual success than the ones who immediately want to know how quickly and with what minimal effort they can learn Japanese.

I would say your prospects are good if you hold onto the spite and determinedly trudge along.

(What's your method?)
 
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I'll work on learning the verb conjugations from now.
If an English learner asked you "I already learned alphabet. I can look up each word in the dictionary, but what's the meaning of 'ing' in 'learning', 'ed' in 'asked' or 'en' in 'eaten'?", what would you do for them? You may be able to explain about the present progressive, perfect tense or passive voice, but instead, to say "Well, I think it's still too advanced for you to translate English lyrics" is a reasonable response, don't you think so?
 
I forgot to mention...adjectives conjugate too.
 
Of course, I agree with you there. When I set out to translate that line of the song, I wasn't planning on getting the translation anywhere near perfect the first time around, I was just using it to expand my kanji vocabulary and to get familiar with the sentence structure. Now, after help from you guys and some more learning, I have a much better idea of what a sentence in Japanese should look like. In my opinion, being able to at least understand a sentence as "Alphabet I already learn" is a more important point to get to first rather than mastering the grammar.

As I already said, I'm not in a rush, although I think I should be able to at least follow general dialogue and simple conversations in about a years time. Although giving yourself 10 years to be "reasonably profficient" is too much time, if you don't limit yourself to a stricter timescale, you'll cause yourself to go at a much slower pace than you are capable off. I can tell you my methods at the end of those 10 weeks if you're still interested.
 
It's something a lot of beginners do, and it's a terrible way to start out because songs don't follow the usual rules in any language
I completely agree with nekojita-san. Song lyrics are not a good choice as a learning material for beginners.
So, you got an idea about the modifying clause now?
 
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