Difference between きかえる and きこえる

[nonezumi]

Hello,

Could you please kindly explain what is the difference in meaning between きかえる and きこえる. I had read before that きこえる is passive voice form of きく. But according to conjugation rules, passive voice form also could be きかえる.

So, I am little bit puzzled how it is possible to translate sentences below.

やさしい こえが きこえる
やさしい こえが きかえる

Maybe first sentence could be translated as "Tender voice was heard", but I am not sure about meaning of the second sentence.

Thank you very much! :sorry:

 

[undrentide]

Passive form of きく is きかれる.
きこえる is potential of きく but is also often used as something is being heard i.e. one can hear it although one does not "listen" intentionally. (Similar to みえる and みる).

I've never heard of the word きかえる as a valiant of きく - could it be misspelling of something?

 

[nonezumi]

undrentideさん、

Oh, thank you so much. きかえる was my humble attempt to make passive voice conjugation from きく。 But after your kind reply i realized my conjugation was totally wrong.

Thank you much for きこえる explanation. Just i am little bit wonder maybe きける also potential of きく. If so, could please kindly tell me the difference between きこえる and きける.

Thank you so much :sorry:

 

[undrentide]

Sorry, きこえる = potential is not really correct. :sorry:

Yes, きける is the potential form of きく. (same as きくことができる）
きこえる is more like can be heard/sound.

I find the verbs such as きこえる and みえる are very hard to explain in English - きく means one should intend to, while きこえる is as if the sound is spontaneously jumping into your ears even you have no particular intention to hear/listen.

ここでならおんがくがきけます。
You can listen to the music here (because there's a CD player and stereos ) - possibility
You can listen to the music here (you cannot do it in other room but here you can) - permission

ここでならおんがくがきこえます。
You can hear the music (you cannot hear any sound in other rooms but here in this room the music played in the next door is/can be heard - you're within earshot)

 

[nonezumi]

undrentideさん、

Thank you so much for your so kind explanation. Now i realized きこえる is a verb on its own, and not きく derived form.

Thank you for kindly explaining so wonderful きこえる meaning nuances. :sorry:

 

[nonezumi]

undrentideさん、

If possible, can I ask a little bit more. I am little bit puzzled with なら。I had read, it would express speaker's supposition. But in correct translation it is statement of the fact.

Is it possible to translate ここでならおんがくがきけます as "If you are here, you can listen the music".

Sorry for asking too much :sorry:

Thank you very much!

 

[undrentide]

If possible, can I ask a little bit more. I am little bit puzzled with なら。I had read, it would express speaker's supposition. But in correct translation it is statement of the fact.

Is it possible to translate ここでならおんがくがきけます as "If you are here, you can listen the music".

～なら can be replaced by ～であれば、～だとすれば, so it does express speaker's supposition.

ここでなら (I do not know how it is about other place, but if we are talking about here)

Does this explanation make sense?

 

[nonezumi]

undrentideさん,

Yes, it completely makes sense for me. Thank you for your so kind explanations.
I apologize for asking too much questions about this. :sorry:

EDIT:
I am so sorry for asking so much, I should check older topics more carefully.

なら confusion | Japan Forum

 

[undrentide]

nonezumiさん,

There's no need to apologise at all, you're always trying very hard and we are just happy to be of some help.

Ask questions as much as you like, it is not too much.

 

[nonezumi]

undrentideさん,

Thank you so much for your kind words and so perfect explanations.

 

[Toritoribe]

Hello,

Could you please kindly explain what is the difference in meaning between きかえる and きこえる. I had read before that きこえる is passive voice form of きく. But according to conjugation rules, passive voice form also could be きかえる.

So, I am little bit puzzled how it is possible to translate sentences below.

やさしい こえが きこえる
やさしい こえが きかえる

Maybe first sentence could be translated as "Tender voice was heard", but I am not sure about meaning of the second sentence.

Thank you very much!

Grammatically, 聞こえる is categorized in 自発 or "spontaneous".
As a potencial, 聞ける focuses on the ability to hear/listen, whereas 聞こえる is as if the sound is spontaneously jumping into your ears even you have no particular intention to hear/listen, as undrentide-san perfectly explained. Furthermore, 聞かれる is used for abstract thing like opinion in contrast to 聞こえる for concrete sounds.

声が聞ける(I can hear the voice.)
優しい声が聞こえる(The tender voice is heard/sounds.)
不況を嘆く声が最近よく聞かれる(The voice/opinion lamenting the recession is often heard recently.)

 

[nonezumi]

Toritoribeさん、

Thank you so much for your perfect explanation and providing vivid examples! :sorry: