Could please help me with some phrases

GreenCat · 29 Aug 2009

"It is as well to be provided for everything"

From context, I guessed that "it is as well to be" is an equivalent of had better but I guess there is some differences like sort of people who would use this etc.

Also how the connotation vary from the below?

"we should be prepared for anything"

"we had better be ready for anything"

I suppose it is pretty basic but just can't figure this out alone, please help and if you think I should find these things on the web somewhere, it would be so nice if you can direct me to those sites/web dictionaries/references.

Thank you for reading

Mikawa Ossan · 29 Aug 2009

Could you provide us with the context it is in, please? I don't know about anyone else, but that would help me a lot!

GreenCat · 1 Sep 2009

Mikawa Ossan said:
Could you provide us with the context it is in, please? I don't know about anyone else, but that would help me a lot!

Thank you for posting Mikawa.

Well, your post actually answered more than half of my question, I suppose the expression "it is as well to be" is not much used any more.

The line is from Alice Through The Looking-Glass, chapter 8 by White Knight:
'You see,' he went on after a pause, 'it`s as well to be provided for everything. That's the reason the horse has anklets round his feet.' 'But what are they for?

I read the book in hope to make my English a bit more intelligible because many people, in the past , pointed out that I tend to ramble and sound amazingly unnatural. But, oh well, maybe I picked a wrong book, after all it is about 100 years old now.

Mikawa Ossan · 1 Sep 2009

Hmmm....I have never read this book, but it sounds to me like the knight is saying that it's good to be provided with everything. Could you tell me his response to the question, "But what are they for?"

undrentide · 1 Sep 2009

Interesting topic.

Mikawa Ossan, I quote the text which will answer you question:

'I was wondering what the mouse-trap was for,' said Alice. 'It isn't very likely there would be any mice on the horse's back.'
'Not very likely, perhaps,' said the Knight: 'but if they DO come, I don't choose to have them running all about.'
'You see,' he went on after a pause, 'it's as well to be provided for EVERYTHING. That's the reason the horse has all those anklets round his feet.'
'But what are they for?' Alice asked in a tone of great curiosity.
'To guard against the bites of sharks,' the Knight replied. 'It's an invention of my own. And now help me on. I'll go with you to the end of the wood--What's the dish for?'

GreenCat san, I happen to have find that in the book translated by 窶禿ｮﾂ静ｬﾂ税ｸﾅｽq, it is ﾂ「窶堙遺?堙俄?堋ｲ窶堙??堙俄?堋ｹ窶堙ｦﾂ、窶敕ｵ窶堋ｦ窶堋?窶堙ｪ窶堙寂?寧窶堋｢窶堙遺?堋ｵﾂ」 so your interpretation (should/had better) should be correct though I do not know the difference in nuance between this particular sentence and another two you mentioned...

英日・日英翻訳訳語辞典 — 辞遊人（DictJuggler）
窶ｰp窶愿ｺﾂ・窶愿ｺ窶ｰpﾂ窶倒窶禿ｳ窶禿ｳﾅ津ｪﾅｽﾂｫ窶弋

Chidoriashi · 1 Sep 2009

My feeling as a native speaker is "had better" gives a greater sense of urgency than "should". Not mention depending on the context "should" could mean conjecture, in the sense that they "think" they are ready for anything.

GreenCat · 1 Sep 2009

undrentide said:
Interesting topic.

Mikawa Ossan, I quote the text which will answer you question:

GreenCat san, I happen to have find that in the book translated by 窶禿ｮﾂ静ｬﾂ税ｸﾅｽq, it is ﾂ「窶堙遺?堙俄?堋ｲ窶堙??堙俄?堋ｹ窶堙ｦﾂ、窶敕ｵ窶堋ｦ窶堋?窶堙ｪ窶堙寂?寧窶堋｢窶堙遺?堋ｵﾂ」 so your interpretation (should/had better) should be correct though I do not know the difference in nuance between this particular sentence and another two you mentioned...

英日・日英翻訳訳語辞典 — 辞遊人（DictJuggler）
窶ｰp窶愿ｺﾂ・窶愿ｺ窶ｰpﾂ窶倒窶禿ｳ窶禿ｳﾅ津ｪﾅｽﾂｫ窶弋

Thank you Mikawa-san.

The web link you gave me is really useful, not like I always agree with how people translate things but it is very helpful to be able to see how the other people interpret things. The site may even save me hundreds of hours!!

Chidoriashi said:
My feeling as a native speaker is "had better" gives a greater sense of urgency than "should". Not mention depending on the context "should" could mean conjecture, in the sense that they "think" they are ready for anything.

Hmm, that means I should not use "had better" for coaxing people: Using language wrong can be pretty embarrassing sometimes, now I added it to my list, so hopefully I won't bumble; incidentally, what I got in the first place of the list is not to say "**** down" instead of "sit down"...

Thanks to you two, now my life's a bit better with less things to brood over
Your time and help much appreciated

Mikawa Ossan · 1 Sep 2009

Don't forget to thank Undrentide!

And I would like to thank her, also. After reading that excerpt, it's quite clear that you are all correct that he's talking about being prepared for anything and everything. It's really quite comical; I'll have to read that book one of these days! The translation was interesting to read, also!

GreenCat · 2 Sep 2009

Mikawa Ossan said:
Don't forget to thank Undrentide!
And I would like to thank her, also. After reading that excerpt, it's quite clear that you are all correct that he's talking about being prepared for anything and everything. It's really quite comical; I'll have to read that book one of these days! The translation was interesting to read, also!

O, true how so very rude of me...Thank you undrentide and sorry about getting your name wrong.

undrentide · 2 Sep 2009

GreenCat said:
O, true how so very rude of me...Thank you undrentide and sorry about getting your name wrong.

No problem, and you're welcome, GreenCat san.

DavidPe · 4 Sep 2009

English teacher here

Do you want a conversation exchange?

Ryan- · 5 Sep 2009

I certainly wouldn't use Lewis Carrol as a model for language. Not because of the age of the book, but because he does weird things with language.

Also, to my mind:

"we should be prepared for anything"
"we had better be ready for anything"

The former, to me, seems like we just did something that will prepare us for the future.
The latter seems maybe that we need to do something else to prepare for it.

moofs · 6 Sep 2009

The modern version of "it is as well" is "might as well". Or "may as well", with the difference in nuance between may and might.

E.g. "Although it may be two years before the world changes, change it certainly will and it is as well to be ready for it."

Same as: "Although it may be two years before the world changes, change it certainly will and it might as well to be ready for it."

As for the two example sentences with "should" and "had better", check out these two pages:

Had Better | ENGLISH PAGE
Should | ENGLISH PAGE

To me, "had better" is a lot stronger than "should", for "should" is merely a suggestion (but that can change with tone). "Had better" has more of a sense of urgency and warning that something unfavorable will happen if you do not listen.

GreenCat · 7 Sep 2009

Ryan- said:
I certainly wouldn't use Lewis Carrol as a model for language. Not because of the age of the book, but because he does weird things with language.

Also, to my mind:

"we should be prepared for anything"
"we had better be ready for anything"

The former, to me, seems like we just did something that will prepare us for the future.
The latter seems maybe that we need to do something else to prepare for it.

Thanks Ryan, that is very true to think about it:
"we should be prepared for anything"
is pretty close to
"Now we should be(probably are) prepared for anything"

While the difference between the two was not my main concern, I guess I was not fully aware of the possible meanings that they can have. Thanks for posting

moofs said:
The modern version of "it is as well" is "might as well". Or "may as well", with the difference in nuance between may and might.

E.g. "Although it may be two years before the world changes, change it certainly will and it is as well to be ready for it."

Same as: "Although it may be two years before the world changes, change it certainly will and it might as well to be ready for it."

As for the two example sentences with "should" and "had better", check out these two pages:

Had Better | ENGLISH PAGE
Should | ENGLISH PAGE

To me, "had better" is a lot stronger than "should", for "should" is merely a suggestion (but that can change with tone). "Had better" has more of a sense of urgency and warning that something unfavorable will happen if you do not listen.

Thank you moofs, I am slightly confused because when I googled the phrase, I got some hits like this:
British Cactus & Succulent Society - Home

But probably not used all that often any longer I guess.
And thank you for the web links, I will check them out for sure.

P.S
If I am to go a bit deeper, my dictionaries gave me 4 matches for the phrase while I do not trust them fully as they contain semi-archaic phrases as well:
jut as well
(just ) as well
just as well
may[might] (just) as well do

all with slightly different definitions Sometimes I hate English...

The evolution of these phrases is pretty interesting to think about: Maybe a phrase that was used to express that doing something is potentially useless evolved into a phrase to point out different option and then, like the way we say"I believe we do not want to stop by and have a cup of tea?", ended up as a phrase to say "it is sensible or desirable to do something". Or maybe it happened in an entirely different order or possibly all evolved independently?

Could please help me with some phrases

GreenCat

先輩

Mikawa Ossan

いかんわ！

GreenCat

先輩

Mikawa Ossan

いかんわ！

undrentide

Japa'n vagyok

Chidoriashi

In imagination land

GreenCat

先輩

Mikawa Ossan

いかんわ！

GreenCat

先輩

undrentide

Japa'n vagyok

DavidPe

後輩

Ryan-

先輩

moofs

先輩

GreenCat

先輩

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