読みますと読めます、何が違うですか

[Janet Merai]

As the title mentions, I am trying to clarify my understanding between the two.

In the book I am reading, eBook for clarity, 「私も漢字は読めません。」
It translates to "I can't read Kanji, either." in the book.

Now, I know the translation and understand why it translates as the above... I just want to know what the difference is between 読みます and 読めます。

Is it just a state of being difference or action changing element?

Thank you for any help :3

 

[Toritoribe]

Now, I know the translation and understand why it translates as the above

Sorry if this sounds sarcastic, but really? If so, you must know the difference between "to read" and "to be able to read".

Also, the polite form of the verb 違う is 違います, and not 違うです.;-)

 

[Mike Cash]

And Japanese usually phrases it as どこが違う instead of 何が違う

Have you not yet learned the potential form of verbs?

 

[Janet Merai]

I'm still studying grammar to be honest :3

Thank you :3

 

[Mike Cash]

Well, stop whatever else you're working on and get up to speed on grammar. Grammar is the set of rules that tells you just how all the parts of sentences relate to each other and allow you to properly understand what is going on.

If I may be my usual blunt self, if you're trying to read stuff without even having learned something as basic and fundamental as this then you have your cart about a hundred miles out in front of your horse.

 

[Anchann]

And Japanese usually phrases it as どこが違う instead of 何が違う

I don't think I've ever heard that. Is it a local thing?

 

[Mike Cash]

I don't think I've ever heard that. Is it a local thing?

Perhaps you've just never noticed it or you've just not had sufficient exposure yet. I believe it is pretty much standard. Perhaps one of our native speaking friends will help us out on that point.

 

[Toritoribe]

I don't think I've ever heard that.

Just because you haven't had enough experience of the language, as Mike-san pointed out correctly.

 

[Anchann]

Well those are a couple of pretty arrogant replies if I ever saw them. What makes you guys so sure you're experts on the matter, just out of curiosity? Have you traveled the entirety of Japan and can really vouch that it isn't a local phrase? If you can, I'll sure take my foot out of my mouth.

 

[Toritoribe]

Can't you see our profiles?

 

[Anchann]

I didn't look before. My point still stands though. I've met countless Japanese who weren't aware of other phrases used in different parts of Japan. Still, you are more knowledgeable than me obviously, so I will bow out of this argument.

 

[Mike Cash]

What was arrogant about it?

It was certainly no more arrogant than assuming something must be a regionalism if you haven't encountered it yet.

But if your breadth and depth of exposure to the Japanese language are so extensive that you're already familiar with all the natural and common ways of phrasing things in standard Japanese and have nothing left to learn, then have it your way....it's a regionalism.

I may be arrogant, but when it comes to these matters I do at least have the good sense to defer to the native speakers, such as the (apparently) equally arrogant Toritoribe. I certainly wouldn't expect you to accept a categorical statement of fact regarding the language from me, and would actually advise against it. I can't imagine what your beef is about hearing it from a native speaker, though.

 

[Anchann]

I wasn't aware he was a native. Regardless, advising someone that they are incorrect because they don't have enough experience with the people here is pretty arrogant if you ask me. I simply asked if it MIGHT be based on region, that was all. A simple, "I'm pretty sure it isn't" would have sufficed. No need to sound as if you know more than the person who inquired. I will ask around just to make sure. I could very well be wrong, but I could be right.

Also, not to be rude to the Japanese individual, but being native doesn't always make you 100% correct on regional expressions. I sure wouldn't be presumptuous towards anyone on what is said in my part of the States. Neither should he. Or anyone for that matter.

 

[Toritoribe]

My point still stands though. I've met countless Japanese who weren't aware of other phrases used in different parts of Japan.

自分を含めたこの人間の群とどこが違うのかしらんなど と考え、
郁る樹の詩 大庭みな子、大庭優

ジャイナ教などと、仏教とどこが違うかというと、
守護霊を持て 桐山靖雄

３連帯保証人はただの保証人とどこが違うのか。
法の世界へ 池田真朗

今の若い人と昔の若い人ではどこが違うと思われますか 。
二十歳のころ 曽野綾子、中村義哉

キンパプとのり巻き、どこが違うの？
韓国ドラマの不思議に迫る 内野由美子、辻啓子

映画とレナードの原作と、どこが違うんですか？
牙をむく都会 逢坂剛

怒れるスサノオは取り合わない。「どこが違うんだよ？
月を読む君 十掛ありい

生まれ変わる決心と死ぬ決心とどこが違っているのかな
日のあたる白い壁 江國香織

まずさっきの家裁の審判とどこが違うだろうか。
マンガからはいる法学入門 矢野達雄

どこまで同じで、どこが違うのだろうか。
チンパンジーの心 松沢哲郎

Do you want more examples? Or, should I give you the authors' hometowns, too?

 

[Anchann]

I appreciate the examples. Can you then explain to me these?

トップアスリートの動きは何が違うのか: スポーツ科学でわかる一流選手の秘密
山田 憲政 (著)

スパイス・調味料 プロの隠し技―何が違うのか、どう使えばよいのか
辻調理師専門学校 (編集)

ネットワークの考え方―ルータとスイッチは何が違う?
戸根 勤 (著)

確定拠出年金と確定給付企業年金の基礎の基礎―何が違う?どう変わる?
年金問題研究会 (著)

Thank you.

 

[Toritoribe]

I just say your comment "I don't think I've ever heard that" is from your lack of experience, and it's not a matter of "dialect". As you can see, I've never say 何が違う is wrong, right?

 

[Anchann]

Correct. I was referring to his comment that Japanese people usually use the former and not the latter. That is all I was questioning. Not that it was correct or not, but in the usage. And, as you can see, it's not based on my lack of knowledge.

ありがとうございました。

 

[Mike Cash]

I wasn't aware he was a native. Regardless, advising someone that they are incorrect because they don't have enough experience with the people here is pretty arrogant if you ask me. I simply asked if it MIGHT be based on region, that was all. A simple, "I'm pretty sure it isn't" would have sufficed. No need to sound as if you know more than the person who inquired. I will ask around just to make sure. I could very well be wrong, but I could be right.

You said you've never heard it. It is the standard way of phrasing in Japanese. What other conclusions are there to be drawn but that the reason you've never heard it is either 1) you just never noticed it or 2) you just haven't heard enough for it to have come up yet? That's just simple logical deduction and was offered in explanation of why you've never heard it. It wasn't a dig on you. Get your back up in the air over and feel insulted all you want, but I didn't insult you. If it embarrasses you to have some shortcoming of your Japanese ability noticed, then you may wish to refrain from airing your shortcomings. I'm far from being perfect in the language and don't delude myself that I have been exposed to every aspect of it yet. That's why I suggested that some of our native speaking friends may wish to confirm for us. Apparently you're still stuck in that Japanese-knowledge/experience-is-a-contest frame of mind and take personal umbrage at somebody knowing something you don't and want to yank them down as "arrogant". It is one of the more tiresome phenomenon gaijins engage in. Guess what? Sometimes people do know more than the person who inquired and I'm not going to act like I don't just to keep from hurting your feelings.

Anyway, based on your answers in another thread and not being familiar with the phrasing in question in this thread, I already had a pretty good idea that I do know a bit more than you do. That's not arrogant; that's just a fact.

Also, not to be rude to the Japanese individual, but being native doesn't always make you 100% correct on regional expressions. I sure wouldn't be presumptuous towards anyone on what is said in my part of the States. Neither should he. Or anyone for that matter.

It isn't a regionalism. It's the standard way of phrasing it. What the hell is presumptuous about that? The only person being presumptuous here is you in presuming some Japanese phrasing you haven't encountered yet must be a regionalism.

 

[Anchann]

Hey Mike, we already got it settled. I believe you might have been proven wrong, but it doesn't look like you noticed that part. Ironic that you said I was the one playing the "I'm better than you" game, because it appears you were doing that all along. Pot calling the kettle black and all that.

I have already stated three times what my question was. I'm not going to state it again. I got the answer myself. English might not be your first language, so I apologize if any of my wording confused you. If you want to still throw a tantrum, be my guest. But as far as I'm concerned, if I want another question of that caliber answered, I best go somewhere else.

But hey, nice try though.

 

[Mike Cash]

In what way was I proven wrong?

I wasn't playing "I'm better than you". That's your own perception. You've never heard a common way of phrasing it. The only explanation is that maybe you haven't heard quite as much as you like to think you have. In what way does pointing out that blindingly obvious fact equate to "I'm better than you"?

But gaijins resenting another gaijin telling them about some aspect of the Japanese language they didn't already know is as old as dirt and as common as stupidity, so I suppose I shouldn't be surprised to encounter it yet again. You remind me of a British lady I once knew who was studying for JLPT3. I offered to help her out if I could and in a voice just dripping with derision she replied, "I didn't come all the to Japan to learn Japanese from another foreigner".

You're an extraordinarily thin-skinned touchy piece of work if you take offense and start the "you're arrogant" crap over something as simple as having mentioned a plain-as-the-nose-on-your-face fact like your perhaps not yet having encountered the entirety of Japanese phrasing. Or would you have us believe that you have?

Before you go off and sulk, though, please do point out how I was proven wrong.

If I'm wrong, then Toritoribe is also wrong; he already told you it is not a matter of dialect. Have it your way, though. You obviously wandered in here wanting to be BMOC and show off your Japanese and you're in a bit of a snit to find that maybe you're not the hot snot you thought you were.

どこが違う = 23,800,000 hits

何が違う = 6,540,000 hits.

Maybe you ought to get out and pay a bit more attention to the Japanese being spoken around you. If your ignorance embarrasses you, strive to eliminate the ignorance rather than getting your a$$ on your shoulders and shooting the messenger.