絵を見ている少年 / で / 体験する, 実感する, ひく / か

eeky

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Hi,

1. Describing an optical illusion:

絵を見ている少年に話しかけても振り向くはずがない(写真2)。実はそれも絵の一部なのだ。しかし、後ろ姿を見ていると、今にも振り向きそうに感じるから不思議である。

My translation: "You also can't turn round to chat to the boy looking at the picture. In fact, he's part of the picture too. However, when you see the back of the figure [i.e. the back of the boy who is looking at the picture], it's amazing how it seems like he's just about to turn around."

Is this correct? I am unsure, especially, about the subjects of some of the verbs, like 振り向く in the first sentence.


2. 私を含めて、全部で10人で行くことになった。

My translation: "Including me, in all ten people will be going."

a) Is 全部で a set form of words? I probably should know this, but I'm having a blank about the use of で.

b) What is the purpose of the second で? I thought it might have a sense of "with" or "among", but I don't see how that works with the rest of the sentence.


3. These are three remaining sentences in a fill-in-the-blanks exercise.

1. 重要だと思ったところに線を_おく。
2. いろいろ_、勉強になった。
3. 実際にやってみて、その大変さを_。

The remaining words to be inserted, with any necessary changes of grammatical form, are 体験する, 実感する and ひく.

a) I'm assuming #1 needs ひく, but what is the resulting sentence talking about? Is it talking about underlining important parts of a text? Is the sentence describing what the speaker is doing, or habitually does, or is it an imperative?

b) I'm assuming #3 needs 実感する, and that it's basically talking about realising the difficulty of something when one tries to do it. However, I'm not sure who is the likely subject (the speaker? the reader? people in general?), or what tense is appropriate.

c) By a process of elimination I assume #2 needs 体験する, but I'm not certain of the meaning. Is it roughly something like "Wide/varied experience is as good as study"?


4. 入学試験にパスし、希望の大学に入れた場合はいいが、試験に落ちた生徒は、もっとやさしい大学に入るか、卒業後一年間浪人する。

My translation: "It's fine if you pass the entrance exam and get into the university of your choice, but pupils who fail the exam either enroll at an easier university or spend another year studying for the exam after graduating from high school."

Is this OK? Does ...入るか... 間浪人する mean "pupils do A or do B" as I translated it, or is there a more complicated sense going on? Originally I had "pupils must decide whether to", but I took that out because it didn't seem to be literally in the Japanese.
 
Hi,
1. Describing an optical illusion:
絵を見ている少年に話しかけても振り向くはずがない(写真2)。実はそれも絵の一部なのだ。しかし、後ろ姿を見ていると、今にも振り向きそうに感じるから不思議である。
My translation: "You also can't turn round to chat to the boy looking at the picture. In fact, he's part of the picture too. However, when you see the back of the figure [i.e. the back of the boy who is looking at the picture], it's amazing how it seems like he's just about to turn around."
Is this correct? I am unsure, especially, about the subjects of some of the verbs, like 振り向く in the first sentence.

You've missed it quite a bit. Normally when you call to someone looking in the other direction, they will turn around and look your way. The first sentence is saying the boy looking at the picture won't do that. (He's part of the picture).

2. 私を含めて、全部で10人で行くことになった。
My translation: "Including me, in all ten people will be going."
a) Is 全部で a set form of words? I probably should know this, but I'm having a blank about the use of で.
b) What is the purpose of the second で? I thought it might have a sense of "with" or "among", but I don't see how that works with the rest of the sentence.

If you saw 一人で勉強する you would probably translate it as "by myself" or "by himself". In the case of plurals it is just sort of a "collectivizer", if I may be allowed to create a word, and indicates that some action will be taken collectively by the number given before.

3. These are three remaining sentences in a fill-in-the-blanks exercise.
1. 重要だと思ったところに線を_おく。
2. いろいろ_、勉強になった。
3. 実際にやってみて、その大変さを_。
The remaining words to be inserted, with any necessary changes of grammatical form, are 体験する, 実感する and ひく.
a) I'm assuming #1 needs ひく, but what is the resulting sentence talking about? Is it talking about underlining important parts of a text? Is the sentence describing what the speaker is doing, or habitually does, or is it an imperative?

Could be the speakers habit, or it could be instructions. The important part here is that they're just checking you know ひく is what you do to a 線.

b) I'm assuming #3 needs 実感する, and that it's basically talking about realising the difficulty of something when one tries to do it. However, I'm not sure who is the likely subject (the speaker? the reader? people in general?), or what tense is appropriate.

No context, impossible to tell. Dictionary form.

c) By a process of elimination I assume #2 needs 体験する, but I'm not certain of the meaning. Is it roughly something like "Wide/varied experience is as good as study"?

Probably best to think of 勉強 as "a learning experience" here (which is the way it is often used....it doesn't always mean sitting down with a textbook). One translation might be "I experienced many things and learned a lot (from the experiences)".

4. 入学試験にパスし、希望の大学に入れた場合はいいが、試験に落ちた生徒は、もっとやさしい大学に入るか、卒業後一年間浪人する。
My translation: "It's fine if you pass the entrance exam and get into the university of your choice, but pupils who fail the exam either enroll at an easier university or spend another year studying for the exam after graduating from high school."
Is this OK? Does ...入るか... 間浪人する mean "pupils do A or do B" as I translated it, or is there a more complicated sense going on? Originally I had "pupils must decide whether to", but I took that out because it didn't seem to be literally in the Japanese.

That's about the size of it. If you don't get accepted by your first choice you either implement Plan B or go home and study for another year.
 
3) b)
If you choose the past tense 実感した, it expresses the speaker's personal experience. Thus, whichever form you choose, the difference between the dictionary form and the past tense corresponds to the difference between #1 and #2.
 
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