Troubled Euro is a good lesson for Asian common currency

Astroboy

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Greek bonds rated 'junk'
Greece's debt has been downgraded to junk status by rating agency Standard & Poor's amid concern it could not take steps to tackle its economic crisis.
BBC News - Greek bonds rated 'junk' by Standard & Poor's

Greek government has faced mission impossible as they cannot control monetary policy on its own as they are a part of Euro.

In short, Euro system worked only in the case that all economies under Euro common currency system are expanding. When economy of Euro-zone begins to go awry, all becomes mess. After all, monetary policy is another side of coin (national sovereignty). If a country wants to keep sovereignty, you shouldn't abandon own currecny.

This is a good lesson to Japan and Asian countries, considering Asian common currency.
 
Portugal Suffering Greek Contagion Pressures EU Bonds
While Portugal's public debt of 77 percent of gross domestic product is on a par with that of France, the burden including corporate and household debt exceeds that of Greece and Italy, at 236 percent of GDP. The savings rate is the fourth-lowest among 27 members of the Organization of Economic Cooperation and Development, according to the Paris-based group's data.
Bloomberg - Are you a robot?

In short, both government and household of Portugal had enjoyed beautiful life until recently only by borrowing money. Banks of Germany, France, etc. had lend money to Portuguese, Greek, Spain, etc. and let them purchase their Made-in-Germany products and Made-in-France, etc. German/French companies enjoyed brisk sales without risks of exchange rate as they are all under common currencly -Euro & the beautiful EU flag. But all was just an illusion or bubble.....

EU said to Japan .... 1) Japan should not eat whale meat; 2) Japan should not eat tuna fish; 3) Japan should reduce more CO2 emmission; 4) Japan should reduce government debts; 5) EU will not consider FTA trade talks until Japan change its own domestic system/dietary life/culture to European ones.

Now I am remembering a Buddhist concept that the proud will surely be destroyed.
 
President of the European Commission Jose Manuel Baraso has arrived at Japan.

Official visit to Japan 28 April 2010
President Barroso will attend the 19th EU-Japan Summit held in Tokyo alongside President of the European Council Van Rompuy. The meeting will be hosted by Japanese prime minister Yukio Hatoyama and will focus on the discussion of the future framework for bilateral political and economic relations. It will also be an excellent opportunity to identify areas of concrete cooperation in the fields of global and regional issues, peace and security, economy and trade.
President José Manuel Barroso - Official visit to Japan 28 April 2010

I hope his visit to Japan has nothing to do with Greece and Portugal.
EU has recently told Japan "EU does not plan to start FTA trade talks with Japan as Japan is a strange country". So I wonder what is his aim to talk with J-government ?
 
I don't know what will Greece do to Pay off debt !
more than 400 billion dollars !! and they also need around 50 billions !!!!!!

President of the European Commission Jose Manuel Baraso has arrived at Japan.
Asking Charity,They don't feel shame...the U.S caused that crisis to Greece so why don't he go to America ?
 
Asking Charity,They don't feel shame...the U.S caused that crisis to Greece so why don't he go to America ?

I think his visit Japan was scheduled before. So Greek financial crisis is just a coincident, I think.

Either way, Japan is defined as a strange country by EU, meaning Japan's domestic regulatory system is not the same as EU, Japanese speak Japanese (not European language), Japanese consumers shopping behaviors are inscrutable to them, Japan's domestic distribution system is more complicated than EU countries, and of course Japanese eat whale meats.

They said ... Japan needs to change such uniquness to EU style if Japan wants to conclude FTA with EU. I think this is very arrogant. We are talking about Free Trade, not culture/tradition. So J-government should tell EU "No Thank you".

Financial help to Greece ? ..... We cannot help you as we are a strange/inscrutable to them. :D
 
This reminds me Turkey,Turkey tried very hard to join the EU but they still reject every single try Turkey make.
The reason is very clear as france declared,"Turkey is 99% Muslim country" so it's culture matter.

And i can add "Turks don't eat pigs" :D
Thanks God there is no whales in Turkish sea,otherwise it will be another excuse to reject turkey again :D

Who cares,anyway the EU economy is dieing ....
 
This reminds me Turkey,Turkey tried very hard to join the EU but they still reject every single try Turkey make.
The reason is very clear as france declared,"Turkey is 99% Muslim country" so it's culture matter.

And i can add "Turks don't eat pigs" :D
Thanks God there is no whales in Turkish sea,otherwise it will be another excuse to reject turkey again :D

Who cares,anyway the EU economy is dieing ....

I believe that Turkey should not join EU or Euro zone as they are increasingly being mess. If Turkey joins Euro zone, Turkish government will not be able to control monetary system., but instead controlled by Frankfurt/Brussel.
 
S&P cuts Spain's rating one notch on economic view
S&P cuts Spain's rating one notch on economic view

Greece, Portugal and now Spain are getting pushed around by Anglo-American rating firms, while they do not downgrade sovereign bonds of USA/UK.

Those three countries will be force to cut government spending, but reduction of government spending in the midst of recession will cause more Unemployment, failure of corporations and banks.
I don't think ordinary citizens of those countries can be patient with such tough life.
 
It is one of the biggest paradoxes in the debt markets: the developed country with the world's biggest debt burden enjoys its cheapest borrowing costs.
Subscribe to read | Financial Times

Japan is not a paradox, but Financial Tmes is a paranoid, which continue to tell "Japan is unsustainable & debt-laden country!". I suggest FT to worry about UK economy as UK is a truly unsustainable & debt-laden.
 
Explaining German angst over Greece
merkel_afp595-1.webp


The US Washington Post recently said "Japanese Prime Mister Hatoyama Is Loopy." I don't deny it, but I wonder how the Western media describes the German Prime Minister? Leaders of euro zone, including Mrs Merkel, spent more than 3-months to agree on rescue plan about Greek economy, but as of today, they cannot reach an agreement yet.

When economy of euro zone was brisk, they welcomed Greece as it lives in the same Europa with same values, but when it goes wrong, they do not welcome Greece. PLus, they try to involve Loopy Japan as Japan is the second largest investor to IMF.
 
I am watching what's happening to Greece these days,it's very interesting..looks like the EU is regret for accepting Greece to join them.( Mrs Merkel says : Damn it :D )
Not only a good lesson for Japan but to all other countries :)
 
Bad news one after another from EU

Spain unemployment rate hits 20%
Athens clash over Greece austerity cuts

I suggest EU/ECB to provide more money to those countries for their government spending. Government-spending is the only hope for economy after bubble burst, which is the Japanese Lesson.

Debt-Laden ??? Never Mind. Germany is there! Germany benefited from Euro for past ten years. If Euro system go collapse, Germany will suffer the most. Thus, Germany will come soon.
 

Thanks. I had a quick look at the long article. It was very interesting as I learned air of crisis in USA. Please see my comments as below:

ツ"If you print money like in Zimbabwe... the purchasing power of money goes down, and the standards of living go down, and eventually, you have a civil war.ツ"

This points out "risk of inflation", but where is inflation today in USA ? But you are seeing deflation, arn't you ? After bubble burst, Inflation won't come even in unlimited printing money as everybody is now rushing deleverage.

the Economist proclaims that the promising side of the inevitable de-leveraging of the U.S. economy will be realized as the domestic savings rate soars, and the U.S. learns to ツ"export or die.ツ"

Partly right as our economy (aka GDP) is composed of 1) Household consumption; 2) Private sector investment; 3) Government expenditure; and 4) Net export/trade surplus. Thus, after bubble burst, the No 3 (government expenditure) is the best & prompt solution to maintain the GDP.

While this lifted exports, it did not achieve a trade surplus. To the contrary, as the dollar depreciated by 35% oil prices escalated by 363% from an average of $27.39 in 2000to $99.65 in 2008, when the U.S. trade deficit stood at almost $700 billion, practically double the 2000 trade deficit of $379.8 billion.

Japan does not produce oil AT ALL. We imports All energy, but we don't see little problem.
Thus USA can overcome the diffuclties ahead. It must be easy. Nothing to worry about.

President Obama launched the National Export Initiative in his State of the Union message of January 2010. The Administration aims to develop a coherent export policy, with a stated goal of doubling US exports in five years. But the proposals announced lack a key component – the need to encourage American companies to send US citizens to sell US goods.

I don't understand well. Why US companies need to send US citizens overseas to sell US goods? Business trip is enough, isn't it? unless US compnaies need to operate factories or similars.

The apparent prosperity anchored in U.S. high value manufacturing, resulted in only about 400,000 more Americans finding employment from December 1999 through December 2009. Meanwhile, the population of the United States grew by about 30 million during that decade. Ouch.

This happens everywhere, not only in USA. We call it "higher productivity". Unlike 1950s - 1970s, we are living in more high-tech world and we are producing more than before with less people as shareholder demanded it or due to global competition.

U.S. citizenship carries more fiscal burdens than that of any other country. U.S. citizens alone, among leading economies, must pay U.S. taxes whether they reside in the U.S. or not....So-called exit taxes, the fiscal equivalent of the Berlin Wall, have been imposed to prevent successful Americans from escaping a lopsided tax burden...

This is beyond my imagination --- "successful Americans aim to escape from USA to avoid tax burden." Just unbelievable. As far as I know, typical Americans are very patriotic, singing "Good Bless America". Majority voted Barak Obamam, who intended to introduce National Health Care System. It was Obvious that National Health Care System will be equivalent of more tax burden, and it was the result of "Democracy", wasn't it? So to me, it sounds like complaints of rish Americans who enjoyed high income as US citizens.

There was a surge of persons leaving the U.S. after the on-set of the Second Great Contraction in December 2007. If, indeed, it amounted to a 67% increase in the number of Americans living outside the U.S., it marks a major inflexion point. For the first time since the depths of the Great Depression in the early 1930s, more persons appear to have left the U.S. than moved in.

I think it was just a result of temporarily worsening job market in the USA.

In my view, after the current surge based on massive bailouts and stimulus is exhausted, the U.S. economy is destined to grow slowly, or not at all. I believe you will look in vain for rapid growth in the U.S. for the next half century as leverage is subtracted from the system.

Agree. As I said, USA and other developed countrues will follow Japan's path - low growth rate + deflationary economy unless we move up to different world via innovation. Developing countries will catch up with USA, Japan and etc. sooner or later because they are NOT stupid. Plus catch-up-speed is faster than before as we live in more high-tech world. So all what we need to do is continuous efforts for innovation, which is only the way to keep developed countries as "developed".

Economic growth, without government spending and private sector's innovation for high end products/service, is only Bubble Economy (aka fake economic growth).

The Inside-Out Strategy

This is an interesting strategy. Probably good strategy for rich Americans for exodus, but again beyond my imagination, but not a solution for US economy, I think.

In addition to the ツ"National Debtツ" you are also on the hook as a U.S. taxpayer for ツ"National Liabilities,ツ" including $14.286 trillion for Social Security, $18.901 trillion for Prescription Drugs and a whopping $75.167 trillion for Medicare.

Usually people worry about "Government Debt" as it will be a future tax. But as I said, it will not be future tax in case of Japan and USA.

Japan: Chronic National Account Surplus country + Ageing population + the world's largest creditor nation. In Japan, money is abundant, but people are not interested in spending. Thus government spends money on behalf of us for maintaining GDP. As a result, JGB's 10-year yield is the lowest in the world - about 1% per annum. Plus more 96% of JGB (printed in JPY) is owned by Japanese. This means "Government Debt is Japanese citizens' Assets".

USA: Chronic National Account Deficit country + Growing population + the world's largest debtor nation. US government has increased government spending for the past years to maintain GDP. As a result, UST-bond 10-year yield is arising but lower - about 3-4% per annum - than before-Lehman-shock. Although majority of UST-bonds is owned by foreigners, it is issued in USD, which is your currency. If USA needs to repay it, just print.

In addition, when we had looked at the sovereign bonds history, government debts had NEVER be repaid by tax. What the governments did before was "ROLL-OVER" + "Devaluation via inflation". The past Default countries such as Russia, Argentine, Mexico, etc. are borrowed money in USD (foreign currencies). Because of USD-based bonds, they could not repay the debts when their currencies dropped.

In short, in this planet, Only Japan and USA are possible to survive as a debt-laden country. Do you understand ???? 🙂
 
Greece has reached agreement with the EU and IMF on an aid package to stave off bankruptcy, and has no choice but to implement new harsh austerity measures, Prime Minister George Papandreou has said.
Greek PM warns of tough times ahead after bailout agreement

Congratulation on the rescue plan agreement about Greece. This news will help Japanese Yen not soar against Euro next week. But Although the governments agree, Greek people will not agree, I think.
 
Monetary union has delivered a 'German Europe' after all
Monetary union has delivered a 'German Europe' after all

This is correct. From a Japanese standpoint, when Euro was introduced, I thought that Germany really did a good job as German companies can export merchandises/lend money to all of euro zone countries without risk of soaring German Mark. Unlike Japanese companies, in fact German companies enjoyed good sales for the past ten years.

But as I said before, this German-led monetary union system work only in the time when economies of all participant countries go brisk. Contorary, when they fail, it will be reverse. So we are seeing one big experiment of "Monetary Union without abondoning sovereignty".

Article also says:
What is undeniable is that Club Med and Ireland are being told to implement the same policies that crippled Europe in the early 1930s, that led to Laval's "deflation decrees" in France, and led in different ways to Hitler, Franco, Antonescu, and Metaxas in Greece. Is that a good idea?

I do hope that Japanese lawmakers will abondon the concept to establish Asian-version Monetary Union.
 
Greek MPs pass austerity bill

201055123210356734_5gif-1.webp




Greece's parliament has voted in favour of an austerity bill proposed by the government to address the country's financial crisis.

The measure, which will pave the way for Greece to receive a joint European Union-IMF emergency loan, was passed with 172 votes in favour and 121 against.

The bill has officially become law, after it was approved in a second vote later on Thursday.

The vote came a day after three bank workers died in a petrol bomb attack as protests over the planned austerity measures turned violent.

The bill was passed as thousands of Greeks gathered outside parliament during the vote in a clear show of anger at the measures, which include salary and pension cuts as well as tax hikes.

"For the immediate future, this is the end of the matter and the government is telling the people that EU leaders will deliver a very generous aid package," Barnaby Phillips, Al Jazeera's correspondent in Athens, said.

more in this link :
http://english.aljazeera.net/news/europe/2010/05/20105617102254784.html

It's getting worse,it's expected that Greece's economic crisis may effect some countries like Portugal,Spain and UK...
 
Asia sees double standards in IMF Greek rescue
The International Monetary Fund's proposed bail-out for Greece is being criticised by Asian countries, as they worry that Athens may be getting an easier ride than Asian countries during the Asian financial crisis in 1997/98.
Subscribe to read | Financial Times

Asian countries (South Korea/Thailand/Indonesia) do not forget that US/Europe-led IMF had acted like a "Leviathan" in those countries. However, when Greece faced financial crisis, IMF becomes very generous.

I wonder how long such a double-standard can last in the times of G20. Europe will pay for the cost soon or later.
 
Japan is going to extend financial help to Greece through IMF. Loan amount is not fixed yet, but after G7 conference call of yesterday, Japan Ministry of Finance has confirmed to join rescue package for Greece via IMF. http://www3.nhk.or.jp/news/html/20100508/k10014306341000.html

I wonder why the world's worst debt-laden (200% GDP) Japan can afford to help Greece or Europe ???
 
Last edited:
I wonder why the world's worst debt-laden (200% GDP) Japan can afford to help Greece or Europe.
It's not new nor weird,they destroyed Iraq and Saudi Arabia with Arab Gulf countries pay the bill.
It's always like this.
 
The 110bn euro (£95bn) bail-out of Greece was formally signed off at the crisis talks, with the eurozone to provide 80bn (£69bn) over three years and the IMF offering a further 30bn (£26bn).
The Latest News from the UK and Around the World | Sky News

Congratulation on bail-out agreement under the "beautiful EU flag".

I do hope they will do the same bail-out to other countries such as Portugal, Spain, etc., but I don't know whether it's possible or not. Either way, major European banks will be more burdened by bad loans as they lend money to the Club Med countries and enjoyed higher yields until recently.

From the Japanese Lesson, Bad Loans will continue to increase unless the banks write off dud loans, meaning collapse of ordinary business or borrowers. Plus European banks will become more reluctant to lend money to ordinary businesses as they need to balance their Balance Sheet.
 
Value of the euro is falling down :


201051014330715734_5-1.webp


European Union finance ministers have announced a nearly $1 trillion emergency package to safeguard the euro currency and protect vulnerable economies from falling into the same debt crisis as Greece.

Under the three-year aid plan, announced early on Monday after 11 hours of talks in Brussels, the European Commission will make about $77bn available, while countries from the 16-nation euro zone promised loans and loan guarantees of $570 billion.

The International Monetary Fund (IMF) is to match at least half of the EU's total contribution, or about $324bn, Elena Salgado, the Spanish finance minister, said.

"We are placing considerable sums in the interest of stability in Europe," she said.

Olli Rehn, the EU's monetary affairs commissioner, said the agreement "proves that we shall defend the euro whatever it takes".

for more here:
http://english.aljazeera.net/news/europe/2010/05/201051013420931946.html
 
Value of the euro is falling down :

But EU ministers offer 500bn-euro plan to support currency

And Today's Nikkei stock market rebound as soaring JPY has been eased. However, The European Central Bank (ECB) also announced that it would buy eurozone government and private debt "to ensure depth and liquidity in those market segments which are dysfunctional". BBC News - EU ministers offer 750bn-euro plan to support currency

This means ECB (Central Bank for Euro zone) will hold a massive toxic assets, which will harm soundness of ECB as well as the common curency Euro on a long term basis.

Japanese policy makers as well as Asian leanders should have a close look at the experiment of "common currency" and the results (but not yet).
 
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