September 11th true or false?

On 9-11 3 steel framed buildings collapsed due to fire. If the building was hit hard by debris it still does not collapse. Have you seen buildings from war torn countries? Have you seen pictures from say Beirut or Sarajevo? The buildings have alot of holes and is shattered but they still don't collapse.

And they're also incomparable because they are made of different materials, construction techniques and were damaged in different ways. This isn't hard stuff to understand, mate.

Have you seen pictures of Kobe after the earth quake? How many buildings collapsed like they did on 9-11? 0.

Again, genius, your comparing apple and oranges. How is an earth quake like being hit by a jet liner or a cloud full of hundreds of tons of concrete debris?

Buildings collapsed but not like they did in New York. This could be because of the construction design but I think that possibility sounds even less likely.
Yes.

Based on what? Do you see the recurring theme here in my questioning: why? Why is it less likely?
We see clear pictures of rockets being shot so how hard can it be to show a clear picture of a commercial airliner? In one of the most heavily secured buildings on this earth.

What rockets? When? Try introducing an element before discussing it. What rockets caught on clear picture?

Suicide bombings is not regarded as suicides but martyr operation.

Right, that cleared that up.

Seriously, what are you going on about? So the same halfwits who think killing innocent people is a great idea also consider it a martyr operation, who cares? How does that change what people who in theory have an IQ above 12 think of the matter?

Scarificing your life in battle is not seen as coward.

How is killing innocent people who can't fight back 'a battle'? It's an exercise in murder by most people's definitions I think.

I think they have more guts than American soldiers hiding behind millitary tanks shooting at bomb shelters though.

It takes a lot of guts to murder innocent people who you've taken completely by surprise and who have no means of defending themselves.

I don't agree with any of them but if I have to chose what I think is the most coward. It surely is not the peopole who are willing to sacrifice their lives for a cause. Any attack on civilian is wrong. I personally think punching people is wrong too.

Then what in the name of God were your last few paragraphs about?

It also is coward to impose sanctions on a country and starving close up to a million people like what US did to Iraq prior to the war leading to 9-11.

Which naturally makes everything else completely all right?

If you look at that picture how come the buildings around WTC 1,2 did not collapse but only WTC7?

Because these pictures show the path of debris and the relative structure of buildings? These things are more important than looking at a photograph.

WHo cares who said what.

I care immensely when you're making up these random bat**** data to support what you're saying.

With your own eyes. Take a look at the picture and see for yourself.

Again with this total w***.

The whole point is jet fuel fire does not get hot enought to melt steel! The law of science says that this is impossible. If the water temperature is 60 degrees the water does not start to boil. This is another law of science.
They say it doesn't have to melt but only make it softer. And that is enough to make the building collapse. However I argue that it didn't get hot enought to even make steel softer.

And on WHAT do you base this? ***.

While I am not an engineer so I am not a specialist in this field.
That much is cripplingly apparently.
Just the fact that a number of engineers are critical to the US version makes it strange.

'Critical' does not equate to 'it's a huge conspiracy look at the photos LOL' really, does it?

Google jet fuel fire. And you end up with alot of web results.

Which means what?

If it wasn't a set up you would have thought that they would atleast not clean the mess and ship the steel away ASAP like the US government did.

Or alternatively it wasn't a set up and they didn't feel the need to leave the rubble there just to please bozos on the internet with too much time on their hands.

Do you remeber how quick they were to point at someone? Then one of Bush's quotes was that there is no room for conspiracy?

Standard politics, blame someone quickly to give the public focus.

These same people wrote a few years earlier through PNAC that a Pearl Harbour style attack is needed to boost millitary spendings. Need a Pearl Harbour? You have to be a nutcase to state in public that US needs a Peral Harbour.

So the US instigated the whole thing to increase military funding. And then lose all of that funding in the cost of fighting two ongoing wars in the Middle East.

So the whole exercise was essentially to get the military's budget increased and then blow it all on extra cruise missiles?

http://www.guildcafe.com/gallery/data/500/icantbelieve128386848407685000.jpg

Here is a picture, since you seem to like them so, now study it. Study it VERY CAREFULLY. OPEN YOUR EYES. Do you see, now?
 
And they're also incomparable because they are made of different materials, construction techniques and were damaged in different ways. This isn't hard stuff to understand, mate.

If they were damaged in different ways and were made of different material, both steel framed buildings and different design then it is even stranger that they came down the exact same way. No it is not hard to understand is it?

Because these pictures show the path of debris and the relative structure of buildings? These things are more important than looking at a photograph.

There are things more important than the photo. But just an overview and that photo speaks to my advantage. Because buildings around WTC7 are in ruin but they havent collapsed.

Then what in the name of God were your last few paragraphs about?

Suicide bombings is not regarded as suicides. It is regarded as Martyr operations by the people who carry out these operations. That was my point.

So the US instigated the whole thing to increase military funding. And then lose all of that funding in the cost of fighting two ongoing wars in the Middle East.

So the whole exercise was essentially to get the military's budget increased and then blow it all on extra cruise missiles?

Yes and no. False flag operations are covert operations conducted by governments, corporations, or other organizations, which are designed to appear as if they are being carried out by other entities.

In 1953, the U.S. and British-orchestrated Operation Ajax used "false-flag" and propaganda operations against the democratically elected leader of Iran, Mohammed Mosaddeq. Information regarding the CIA-sponsored coup d'etat has been largely declassified and is available in the CIA archives.

During July 1954, the Israeli Operation Susannah (later known as the Lavon Affair) bombed several American and British targets in an attempt to frame Egypt.

False flag - Wikipedia

This is the oldest trick in the book. To be able to invade you need to get attacked first. When Japan bombed Pearl harbour US knew that Peral Harbour was about to get bombed. When Germany invaded Poland, the Nazis staged a murder by the Polish border blaming it on the Poles so that they could invade Poland.

No one starts a war because they think they will lose in the first place. Resisting is one thing but waging a war 10,000 kilo meters away from home is an another.

And the motives? Its the oil stupid.
 
Sounds like pretty strange paranoid tabloid stuff. Bigfoot, UFO's and 9/11 conspiracies.

Since we know the attacks were planned and executed by al Qaeda... They publicly took credit... and since we know who the attackers were, how they attacked and since engineers have figured out how the building collapsed any talk of US government involvement in conspiracies is kind of nutty.
 
If they were damaged in different ways and were made of different material, both steel framed buildings and different design then it is even stranger that they came down the exact same way. No it is not hard to understand is it?

You just said they didn't come down, that the ones in wartorn countries stayed up!

There are things more important than the photo. But just an overview and that photo speaks to my advantage. Because buildings around WTC7 are in ruin but they havent collapsed.

Which we just effectively covered above.

Suicide bombings is not regarded as suicides. It is regarded as Martyr operations by the people who carry out these operations. That was my point.

Then you should have stuck to it IMO instead of bringing an attitude of 'Leave the brave American stuff out of this thread etc.'

It's the oil stupid

And how much oil have we got from Afghanistan then, genius? Afghanistan produces poppys, not crude.
 
of course it's true. Who cares about conspiracies....the people who died were real and true nothing changes that fact!
*nods* Things happen. We can't keep arguing about how it happened or blame anyone. Ok. I sound wack. See ya.

:eek:
 
You just said they didn't come down, that the ones in wartorn countries stayed up!

Exactly. I said buildings in war torn countries hit by missiles don't come crumbling down. In New York one building wasn't hit by anything and still came crumbling down the exact same way as the 2 other buildings hit by jets.

And how much oil have we got from Afghanistan then, genius? Afghanistan produces poppys, not crude.

Exactly. CIA has a long track record of making huge profits from the cocaine business in SOuth America and there is the pipe line carrying fossil fuel which runs from the Caspian Sea to Pakistan through Afghanistan therefore both Pakisistan and Afghanistan plays a vital geo political role.

If US wanted to catch bin Laden then why is US building millitary bases by the pipe line? Is it to protect the pipe lines from bin Laden? I thought thery invaded Afghanistan to catch bin Laden.
 
Sounds like pretty strange paranoid tabloid stuff. Bigfoot, UFO's and 9/11 conspiracies.

Since we know the attacks were planned and executed by al Qaeda... They publicly took credit... and since we know who the attackers were, how they attacked and since engineers have figured out how the building collapsed any talk of US government involvement in conspiracies is kind of nutty.
I'm with you there:nuts:
 
We don't know that it was Al-Qaida. Or if there were more than Al-Qaida. Just because CNN says so 100 times does not make it more true. Such mature thinking Mycernius.
 
Exactly. I said buildings in war torn countries hit by missiles don't come crumbling down. In New York one building wasn't hit by anything and still came crumbling down the exact same way as the 2 other buildings hit by jets.

Exactly. CIA has a long track record of making huge profits from the cocaine business in SOuth America and there is the pipe line carrying fossil fuel which runs from the Caspian Sea to Pakistan through Afghanistan therefore both Pakisistan and Afghanistan plays a vital geo political role.
If US wanted to catch bin Laden then why is US building millitary bases by the pipe line? Is it to protect the pipe lines from bin Laden? I thought thery invaded Afghanistan to catch bin Laden.

I'm going to save myself time instead of disassembling this: you haven't backed any of this up with anything- in the first instance you're not even debating, you're just being contradictory, and the second is entirely supposition on your part due to the lack of data to back it up.

So: you're either bat**** crazy enough to believe all this, or you're just trolling.

Either way debating this is obviously a lost cause. I give up.
 
Well I have backed up how 3 buildings collapsed atleast tried to back up with links.

As for Afghanistan and the pipleine.

Turkmenistan–Afghanistan–Pakistan–India Pipeline - Wikipedia

Like Most US Wars... - LewRockwell

As for cocaine and CIA.

Cocaine Importing Agency

Don't put a label on me just because my opinions and what I believe in is so far off your opinion. Do research yourself. And find out for yourself.

I am confident. This 9-11 was a big set up.

Watch this movie

Zeitgeist Film Series

Its an eye opener.
 
We don't know that it was Al-Qaida. Or if there were more than Al-Qaida. Just because CNN says so 100 times does not make it more true. Such mature thinking Mycernius.

Why is it that I have this feeling that you're trying to tell us who is trustworthy and who isn't? Why would we buy your stuff? Why would it be true because you said it 100 times? How are you any different?
Honestly, you can suspect everything, really, everything, but whats the point? You could go around saying that black is white because xy source says so, and there's a great conspiracy in the background to fool people into believing that black indeed is black.
Honestly, the fact that I hate sweets doesn't mean that the guy who bakes them wants to poison me.
Couldn't even hide that high and mighty know it all attitude of yours, nor the resentment for America, so we can assume that whatever the pro-America or neutral camp would bring up, you would still say that their information is false, simply because something that doesn't reek of contra-American propaganda can only be wrong. Thats not how things work. You want to believe that the American government is guilty, thats all you want. You actually don't give a damn about what happened, not a damn, simply, you want another reason to hate that country, and a nice little argument that you could present in pretty much any and every topic in the serious subforum that has anything to do with America.
Honestly, you think CNN had his little bro Al Jazeera broadcast what he wanted? Thats insane. "Wait, I HEAR SOUNDS, they say Bush is an alien who came to destroy the world... no, they now say that all Americans are aliens... oh drat, the voices are telling me to save the pure races from teh evul American aliens!"
Why don't you play chess instead? I mean honestly, such complicated campaigns and tricks can only happen in chess.
 
Why would we buy your stuff? Why would it be true because you said it 100 times? How are you any different?

You don't need to believe me because I am saying it 100 times. I am just saying study each episode more carefully an don't take everything you get from TV as granted.

Power corrupts people. Wake the føkk up.
 
My brothers and sisters, this day our eyes were opened by none other than the great, the magnificent, the brave, the pure [please insert all positive adjectives here] CENTRAJAPAN.
You revealed the truth that's been obscure for long years.
We shall now worship you.
This is how it all happened.
6ks6heh-1.webp
 
You are ridiculing because you are running out of arguments. What are you? The secret witch hunt gestapo? Thats what Vatican used to do 300 years ago. Get with the programme.
 
yawn.. Since you know very little about this subject its rather strange that you start to ridicule. Grow up.

How can 2 jets bring down 3 buildings in the same fashion?
Thats how you need to be thinking.
 
May I ask one question?
Do you believe in what Stephen King writes? No, serious, if you do that explains it all, I won't argue with you anymore.
 
God why am I doing this... why... it's like talking to a brick wall...

Well I have backed up how 3 buildings collapsed atleast tried to back up with links.

No, you kept posting 'Look at the picture!' and not addressing a single thing I said. Try again.


It says 'proposed' pipeline, and even then:


This guy is a reporter for a rather dubious health website! He's hardly an authority on the subject. Doesn't matter though, since he's heading in the direction you want to go in.


Nearly all from secondary newspaper articles. There isn't a single credible primary source! It's effectively heresay.

I'm sure the CIA has got up to loads of dubious stuff (for once I'm not being sarcastic, I believe they probably have) but you're going to have to do much better than this.

Don't put a label on me just because my opinions and what I believe in is so far off your opinion. Do research yourself. And find out for yourself.

Here we come to the nub of the matter.

Read this carefully:

The US Govt. might well have had something to do with 9/11. I don't rule that out. However I have seen no evidence that they have, you have presented a series of loosely connected circumstantial happenings from a variety of sources of vastly differing levels of credibility.

You can think whatever you like, however presenting your dubious double-think and logically fallible reasoning as truth is something I feel fully justified in having an opinion on and 'labelling' you for.

I am confident. This 9-11 was a big set up.
Watch this movie
Zeitgeist Film Series
Its an eye opener.

You've strung together an incredibly tenuous set of reasons with nothing vaguely resembling an unbiased, credible primary source to back up any of it.

Want to believe it? Go nuts. This whole twaddle about 'opening your eyes' though could really do with a rest. As could your opening animosity towards the USA and the attacks in general. I would possibly have treated your opinion with respect if not for that.

Grr.
 
I still believe the architect who said the buildings came down exactly as he had figured they would. He said the impact of the jets blew the sprayed foam fire retardant off the structural support beams and that is why they were able to melt so fast. This was not an ordinary fire. I think that's an important fact that some people aren't understanding. This was a super heated fire that was fueled by jet fuel and plenty of combustible material. If you think a fire can't melt metal your wrong. Our neighbors house burned down and the fire had gotten so hot it melted their fridge and stove. They were melted pools of metal. I also believe that Al-Qaida tried with a car bomb years ago to blow the WTC up and they failed. This time they wanted to get it right. They did.
 
No, you kept posting 'Look at the picture!' and not addressing a single thing I said. Try again.

Try again. What are you trying to say. I don't understand.

It says 'proposed' pipeline, and even then:

The pipeline is a fact. So the proposed pipeline is not a fact because it is only propsed?

The US Govt. might well have had something to do with 9/11. I don't rule that out.

Nice one. We agree.

Dont think because it is USA they are good or because it is US they can't do anything that evil.
 
The pipeline is a fact. So the proposed pipeline is not a fact because it is only propsed?

No the pipeline is hypothetical since it doesn't exist. You were talking about it in terms that it was a physical thing the US wanted to defend. If you read further on your wikipedia article you'll find that the war in Afghanistan has actually stalled its construction indefinitely.

So obviously the war was started just to get control of this pipeline then!

Which doesn't exist yet.

And won't be finished for years.

Because of the war.

Which America started with 9/11.

Because they wanted this pipeline.

Nice one. We agree.
Dont think because it is USA they are good or because it is US they can't do anything that evil.

Awesome. Except nobody said that that USA was totally good and incapable of evil. Yay for knocking over the straw man. Did he put up a fight?
 
We don't know that it was Al-Qaida. Or if there were more than Al-Qaida. Just because CNN says so 100 times does not make it more true. Such mature thinking Mycernius.
Such paranoid anti-US rubbish that deserves the respect I give it.
Plus quoting or posting articles from Wiki is hardly a credible source.
 
I still believe the architect who said the buildings came down exactly as he had figured they would. He said the impact of the jets blew the sprayed foam fire retardant off the structural support beams and that is why they were able to melt so fast. This was not an ordinary fire. I think that's an important fact that some people aren't understanding. This was a super heated fire that was fueled by jet fuel and plenty of combustible material. If you think a fire can't melt metal your wrong. Our neighbors house burned down and the fire had gotten so hot it melted their fridge and stove. They were melted pools of metal. I also believe that Al-Qaida tried with a car bomb years ago to blow the WTC up and they failed. This time they wanted to get it right. They did.

Don't forget Popular Mechanics did a research study and experimented on the theory, and it was proven true. Therefore, even science agrees that it was due to the planes, fuel, heat, and design of the structures, and not some cruse missile hitting the towers.

-Doc 🙂
 
The collapse of the 47-story which was never hit by an airplane

Afghan pipeline

BBC News | BUSINESS | Afghanistan plans gas pipeline

The fire is the most misunderstood part of the WTC collapse. Even today, the media report (and many scientists believe) that the steel melted. It is argued that the jet fuel burns very hot, especially with so much fuel present. This is not true.... The temperature of the fire at the WTC was not unusual, and it was most definitely not capable of melting steel.
In combustion science, there are three basic types of flames, namely, a jet burner, a pre- mixed flame, and a diffuse flame.... In a diffuse flame, the fuel and the oxidant are not mixed before ignition, but flow together in an uncontrolled manner and combust when the fuel/oxidant ratios reach values within the flammable range. A fireplace is a diffuse flame burning in air, as was the WTC fire. Diffuse flames generate the lowest heat intensities of the three flame types... The maximum flame temperature increase for
burning hydrocarbons (jet fuel) in air is, thus, about 1000 ツ≫?ケC -- hardly sufficient to melt steel at 1500 ツ≫?ケC."

"But it is very difficult to reach [even] this maximum temperature with a diffuse flame. There is nothing to ensure that the fuel and air in a diffuse flame are mixed in the best ratio... This is why the temperatures in a residential fire are usually in the 500 ツ≫?ケC to 650 ツ≫?ケC range [Cote, 1992]. It is known that the WTC fire was a fuel-rich, diffuse flame as evidenced by the copious black smoke.... It is known that structural steel begins to soften around 425 ツ≫?ケC and loses about half of its strength at 650 ツ≫?ケC [Cote,
1992]. This is why steel is stress relieved in this temperature range. But even a 50% loss of strength is still insufficient, by itself, to explain the WTC collapse... The WTC, on this low-wind day, was likely not stressed more than a third of the design allowable... Even with its strength halved, the steel could still support two to three times the stresses imposed by a 650 ツ≫?ケC fire."

http://www.journalof911studies.com/...ollapse_Jones_Thermite_World_Trade_Center.pdf
 
Back
Top Bottom