- Thread starter
- #26
Haha, yes, I've heard this is common. Certainly not an arrangement I'd ever consider doing, but each to their own.
Marriage - financial/legal implications
- Thread starter Pavinder
- Start date
- Thread starter
- #27
Yes, this is exactly where we're at - in no rush, and calmly considering financial/legal implications.
- Thread starter
- #28
That's absolutely true in terms of my ability to work, live here etc.
I think the financial side of things is a major consideration, as neither of us would be marrying for religious reasons. We can be together regardless of whether we marry or not.
That's valuable information. Thanks. I'll investigate this.
Of course I'd be taking on some responsibility, and certainly wouldn't be "turning my back" should I not adopt them. But as they're getting on for adulthood, it's a bit different than if they were only 4 or 5.
I still see these as seperate choices: being together, marriage, responsibility for her children.
From the children's perspective, they're mid-teens and I'm a relative newcomer from a completely different culture who has played no role in their upbringing - hardly someone they feel to be a parent.
Shibui
後輩
- 7 Sep 2017
- 38
- 9
Hi Pavinder
Looks like you are going into this with your eyes wide open and not wearing rose coloured glasses.
Given the kids are mid teens is it worth waiting until they hit 18 at which time they will legally be adults. I have teenage kids and their a handful to manage and they are biologically mine. God knows how hard it would be IF you ended up a single father to them were your partner to pass.
Best of luck in the future.
S
Looks like you are going into this with your eyes wide open and not wearing rose coloured glasses.
Given the kids are mid teens is it worth waiting until they hit 18 at which time they will legally be adults. I have teenage kids and their a handful to manage and they are biologically mine. God knows how hard it would be IF you ended up a single father to them were your partner to pass.
Best of luck in the future.
S
- 6 Mar 2003
- 9,318
- 9,447
If you separate marriage as a civil institution from marriage as a lifetime commitment than it makes perfect sense. You don't need "marriage" to make a commitment.
In the U.S. married people can file as a family unit or they can file separately in a special category of "married filing separately." Usually filing as married is beneficial but in some situations filing separately is better. For example if both people have high incomes. Or one has high student loans or medical debt. etc. So I'm guessing that's what he meant.
Exactly. "If you love her you should get married" is not only old fashioned thinking, it often doesn't work anyway judging by the divorce rates.
- Thread starter
- #31
Exactly the reason I'm asking, Shibui! Being legally obliged to provide for their future when I have played no part in their upbringing is not a situation I would choose.
I wish you great management over the next few years.
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What a guy...!
- Thread starter
- #33
Thanks, Johnny, although I do think it's pretty much what most people in such a position would be thinking.
I would be interested to know if you would be approaching this differently had she been a single unmarried woman or a divorcee with children of 4-5 years of age.
Also If you have lived in Japan for 15 years, you should understand the culture by now, but while you may not regard yourself as a parent to her children, you could try to be a friend they look up too.
Shibui
後輩
- 7 Sep 2017
- 38
- 9
I think that's kind of the whole point of the discussion and the question isn't it?. Pavinder has asked for opinions on this particular scenario . Any other scenario is irrelevant really.
There is also a huge gulf between 'trying to be a friend they look up to' and being a parent. Parents often have to say 'no' when friends don't. My divorced friends experience this a lot. Kids are happy when the new partner lets them do what they want, ******* and pricks when their not.
Pavinder has asked for opinions on this particular scenario . Any other scenario is irrelevant really.
I was trying to establish what his view point would be if his partner was a single woman without children, or children young enough for them to regard him as a parent, because personally he appears to be more concerned with the financial implications of being in a relationship than the actual relationship.
There is also a huge gulf between 'trying to be a friend they look up to' and being a parent.
When a single parent looks to get married the most they can expect from their partner is to be a friend to the children, because to expect them to be a replacement mother/father is expecting too much.
Parents often have to say 'no' when friends don't.
This is true, but if he cannot be a replacement father and or a friend, what do you expect his position to be with the children, have you ever been a single parent and faced these kinds of issues?
My divorced friends experience this a lot. Kids are happy when the new partner lets them do what they want, ******* and pricks when their not.
A lot depends on where the children have been raised, because based on my experience children who are raised outside Japan, do not have the same level of respect of adults as children raised in Japan with Japanese values.
I was trying to establish what his view point would be if his partner was a single woman without children, or children young enough for them to regard him as a parent, because personally he appears to be more concerned with the financial implications of being in a relationship than the actual relationship.
There is also a huge gulf between 'trying to be a friend they look up to' and being a parent.
When a single parent looks to get married the most they can expect from their partner is to be a friend to the children, because to expect them to be a replacement mother/father is expecting too much.
Parents often have to say 'no' when friends don't.
This is true, but if he cannot be a replacement father and or a friend, what do you expect his position to be with the children, have you ever been a single parent and faced these kinds of issues?
My divorced friends experience this a lot. Kids are happy when the new partner lets them do what they want, ******* and pricks when their not.
A lot depends on where the children have been raised, because based on my experience children who are raised outside Japan, do not have the same level of respect of adults as children raised in Japan with Japanese values.
Shibui
後輩
- 7 Sep 2017
- 38
- 9
Hi JT
1. Partly. Financial and future obligations appear to be of concern.
2. Depends on the relationship. I have friends who have lawfully adopted their step children. I have a friend who has very very little to do with his step children and the family is happy with that arrangement. All relationships are different.
3. As for 2. His position is whatever the people in the relationship want it to be. I am lucky and have not been a single parent but again have lots of friends and family who are and have worked in juvenile aid with kids facing these issues.
4. Children can be respectful and obedient and still make the whole family a misery through passive resistance and shutting themselves out.
I respect what you have said and your opinions are valid. I simply think Pavinder is being honest about his expectations and that should be accepted. Sure its not everyones cup of tea or view on how a marriage should be but we are all different.
Cheers
1. Partly. Financial and future obligations appear to be of concern.
2. Depends on the relationship. I have friends who have lawfully adopted their step children. I have a friend who has very very little to do with his step children and the family is happy with that arrangement. All relationships are different.
3. As for 2. His position is whatever the people in the relationship want it to be. I am lucky and have not been a single parent but again have lots of friends and family who are and have worked in juvenile aid with kids facing these issues.
4. Children can be respectful and obedient and still make the whole family a misery through passive resistance and shutting themselves out.
I respect what you have said and your opinions are valid. I simply think Pavinder is being honest about his expectations and that should be accepted. Sure its not everyones cup of tea or view on how a marriage should be but we are all different.
Cheers
Are your examples of relationships and children based on those living and being raised in Japan?
Have your children been raised in Japan?
Shibui
後輩
- 7 Sep 2017
- 38
- 9
No. And?
Your points would not be valid, as children raised in Japan with a Japanese education do not behave as you have indicated in your posts.
The children are more likely to respect Pavinder, out of respect for their mother.
I have children in the Japanese education system, so I have first hand experience of how polite and respectful students are (its part of the education system here).
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- Thread starter
- #41
Thanks for the responses and points you are making.
On a few points mentioned:
If my partner was a single woman without children, of course the situation would be totally different. We would have far more freedom to have a spontaneous life together, travel, be very flexible in our lifestyle, have more vibrant social lives, with no responsibility for anyone but ourselves. I also imagine we would be living together or at least spending many nights at each other's places.
If she had children 4-5 years of age, I doubt very much we'd be in a relationship. I would not be prepared to accept such responsibility, nor the necessary changes to my lifestyle.
So the current situation is somewhere in between - and perhaps we're waiting until the kids reach 18 (as Shibui suggested). Once that happens, we can begin having a more "single" life together. However, this being Japan, kids unfortunately tend not to leave home until many years after 18...this worries me.
Yes, my questions here are purely about the financial/taxation/etc implications of being married. Not about the style of our relationship or any moral viewpoint on the meaning of marriage.
I am like a friend to the children, although because of the language gap (they've spent all their lives in Japan, while my Japanese is not up to understanding what Japanese teenagers are usually saying), I simply try to help and encourage them however I can.
On a few points mentioned:
If my partner was a single woman without children, of course the situation would be totally different. We would have far more freedom to have a spontaneous life together, travel, be very flexible in our lifestyle, have more vibrant social lives, with no responsibility for anyone but ourselves. I also imagine we would be living together or at least spending many nights at each other's places.
If she had children 4-5 years of age, I doubt very much we'd be in a relationship. I would not be prepared to accept such responsibility, nor the necessary changes to my lifestyle.
So the current situation is somewhere in between - and perhaps we're waiting until the kids reach 18 (as Shibui suggested). Once that happens, we can begin having a more "single" life together. However, this being Japan, kids unfortunately tend not to leave home until many years after 18...this worries me.
Yes, my questions here are purely about the financial/taxation/etc implications of being married. Not about the style of our relationship or any moral viewpoint on the meaning of marriage.
I am like a friend to the children, although because of the language gap (they've spent all their lives in Japan, while my Japanese is not up to understanding what Japanese teenagers are usually saying), I simply try to help and encourage them however I can.
But she is not a single women without children.
Is this your view of the relationship or does she hold the same views, if so I feel you are both being selfish.
This says it all!! I personally do not feel you should be in the relationship, because based on this post you only want her and not her children.
There is no need to be sarcastic.
If I was in your position the children would not be an issue, as you are making them to be.
If you both value the relationship you share, then the children should be apart of that relationship, regardless of their age.
- Thread starter
- #45
But you are not in my position so your opinions, which are completely off the point of this thread, are totally irrelevant here.
You are welcome to respond to my questions, but not to spout irrelevant and judgemental speculations.
If you want to discuss your definitions of a "good relationship", please create another thread to do so.
I am happily married to a Japanese woman and have a wonderful family.
You are the one that came here for advice concerning your relationship and your partners children and the financial implications.
As for being judgmental you are the one who stated "If she had children 4-5 years of age, I doubt very much we'd be in a relationship."
The age of the children should not make any difference.
- Thread starter
- #47
JT, I am not interested in:
a) Your relationship.
JT, I am not interested in:
b) Your misunderstanding and mischaracterization of what this thread is about.
JT, I am not interested in:
c) Your opinions on my (or anyone else's) relationship,
d) You labelling me as judgemental for simply stating a fact, or
e) Discussing pronouncements you have made which ignore obvious truths.
Please stop trolling this thread. If you have nothing to contribute related to the point of this thread (clearly stated in the title), your absence would be appreciated by those who are interested in proper discussion and sharing of relevant information.
