Is it time for US Force to leave Japan?

pharaoh21 said:

Eh....I don't think so. If China and Russia and those hostile nations surrounding America join forces together, then USA will be defeated militarily. Although China still has a long way to go in their military upgradings but the commies have man-power while Russia has always been good at missile tech.

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China and Russian will have to fight against Britain also. Canada being sandwiched in the middle will be the haven for all these US refugees will be running to for help. I could just see millions of Americans becoming Canadians at that point, and Queen Elizabeth II will have no choice but to excercise the powers that she never does to allow all British citizens to live in Canada and have the same rights as a Canadian citizen. Canada which is amazing for loving the British Queen more so than the Engish themselves, will probably be willing to allow them to come, although the Yankee will be given only refugee status.

I could see the Queen coming to live in Canada at that point. Japan will be obliterated by North Korea, and Japan will be a country that is no more. Only Japanese expats will remain, and will be forced to have a card that proves that they are not Chinese to the allied power.

Shooter452 said:

I was stationed in Japan (Okinawa) while I was on active duty and I think it would be a shame for the US to pull its military forces from Japanese soil. But I think that perhaps that it is time to leave.
Having military forces in Japan was a financial benefit to the Japanese when they recovered from the devastation of the Second World War, and was a benefit to the US startegic plans during the Cold War. Japan no longer needs the economic assistance. The US is no longer attempting to contain the Soviet Union. The Japanese do not fear China (although perhaps they should) and are contemplating the expansion of the JDF. They do not need us. They want us less and less to be there.
The shame is that without US forces on Japanese soil, the avearge US citizens are less likely to see Japan, the people there, and the interchange of culture and ideas will decrease. Travel is expensive, more so in Japan. Without the social exchange between our people, understanding will lessen and the specter of simple generalization might replace it.
I am not Japanese. I would never want to live in Japan. But I will always value my experiences there and I fear that I will never go there again.

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Hey shooter, could you comment on your personal experience of working with Japanese Americans working on the bases at Okinawa? I heard that AJA often work as translators and are commissioned with a butter bar having desk jobs in Okinawa. How do the Okinwanas view a Japanese who is seen wearing US uniform? Are they proud to see them doing this, or do they feel it is a shame, and something that is treson. I wonder what would happen to a dual national who is caught doing this?

What about a Japanese who is a permant resident of USA becoming a US 2nd Lieutanant. If this Lieutenant was not a dual citizen but only a permant resident, how would Japan strip him of his citizenship? Or does it not matter, as Japan and the US are now friends, just as a Canadian citizen can also become a US solider and it is okay with Canada.

Or will the United States save the Lieutenant from becoming Stateless by making him a citizen as he proved his loyalty to the USA by becoming an Army Lieutenant?

I have zero Japanese ancestry, but how competitive is if for a Canadian to get a job as a Japanese-English translator in the Army? I have strongly considered it, as you can see, I have done some research. I heard you don't have to see combat if I take a MOS as a translator in Okinawa, and I wonder what I would have to do to obtain a greencard to do this?

I will have a B.A. in Japanese. Do I have to compete with the Nikkei whose linguistic competency acquision is just mindblowing and extradordinary? Am I in a handicap since there is lots of American Japanese to comepete against? Or will the United States consider that a white guy like me will be less dubious with regards to national security than if they had a American Japanese who might be suspicious of working on the Japanese side, and thus be seen as more trustworthy?

Brooker said:

Even now when I go to Japan with my US $$s I get less yen in return. When I take my yen back to America it almost doubles in value. It seems that the Yen is USUALLY more valuable than the dollar.

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That is because the US dollar is declining over the last few years. Pretty soon, you will see that the Canadian dollar will be at par with yours. It is not that the Yen is getting strong, but the US dollar is decreasing. I feel that the Canadian government should be offering our oil to you folks. I will be happy to give our oil to you in exchange for having the war on Iraq to end.

jonathancameron said:

That is because the US dollar is declining over the last few years. Pretty soon, you will see that the Canadian dollar will be at par with yours. It is not that the Yen is getting strong, but the US dollar is decreasing. I feel that the Canadian government should be offering our oil to you folks. I will be happy to give our oil to you in exchange for having the war on Iraq to end.

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Actually it is more than just a few years nowmore like something in the neighborhood of 20 or so. The first major drop was when Reagan was President. When I first came to Japan the yen rate was a bit over 270 to the $ and dropped to 170 or so when I left.

When I came back it was down to about 130 or so and the bottom fell out at around 80 Yen to the $. I also know people who remember the yen at 360 to the $

It has been fluctuating between 105 to 117 or so for the past few years, it dropped because the Japanese economy was strong and the yen undervalued.

Having been a military brat and Dad was in the Air Force until the major shutdown of bases was in the 70s when Vietnam was pretty much over. Whether they should leave and shut down to save American Dollars $$ may be important for a few of us, in the long run, It is a needed security to have our Advanced bases in case of a major crisis. As the USA are the Policemen of the World, we tend to be in everyone's back yard. Yes we can be mis-behave a little or a whole lot too while in the position. We are not the Major power over any country. The game field has even out a little. Can Japan haf=ve its own Military force ready? how many japanese (men and women ) would join the military (JASDF) to protect their country? If the Peace Constitution can be revisioned and other Asian countries NOT PANIC about Japan will be come a militaristic WARMONGER like it was in the mid 30-40s. WE are always looking over our shoulders of what the others are doingin thier backyard.

BTW,, Heisei tenno BANZAI !!

Ichi-KAZE

Ichiroll said:

As the USA are the Policemen of the World, we tend to be in everyone's back yard.

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nothing personal, but "self-appointed" is the adequate adjective missing from the sentance above.

There are many smaller issues masked here. The US military's presence here in Japan serves both parties' interests. The US gets to maintain strategic bases near China and NK. Japan gets FREE protection.
A question for those who want the US to leave: How long do you think it would be before China took a VERY aggressive stance toward Japan? The conflicted islands, oil reserves, fisheries, etc would be gobbled up in no time. Japan would lose all influence in the region instantly. Japan has a wonderfully trained MSDF (navy). I have worked with them quite extensively. However, the SDF's navy is way too small to protect an ISLAND NATION! If you think that NK is aggressively hostile now, wait until we leave. Those 'test' missiles might stop being 'tests' since there is no way that Japan could ever, EVER mount a successful attack against the entrenched country.
Bottomline: Japan is a sitting duck with many neighbors that really dont like them. The main reason that things have remained peaceful is the presence of the US military AND THE PROMISE THAT WE HAVE GIVEN JAPAN TO PROTECT THEM.

justinod said:

There are many smaller issues masked here. The US military's presence here in Japan serves both parties' interests. The US gets to maintain strategic bases near China and NK. Japan gets FREE protection.
A question for those who want the US to leave: How long do you think it would be before China took a VERY aggressive stance toward Japan? The conflicted islands, oil reserves, fisheries, etc would be gobbled up in no time. Japan would lose all influence in the region instantly. Japan has a wonderfully trained MSDF (navy). I have worked with them quite extensively. However, the SDF's navy is way too small to protect an ISLAND NATION! If you think that NK is aggressively hostile now, wait until we leave. Those 'test' missiles might stop being 'tests' since there is no way that Japan could ever, EVER mount a successful attack against the entrenched country.
Bottomline: Japan is a sitting duck with many neighbors that really dont like them. The main reason that things have remained peaceful is the presence of the US military AND THE PROMISE THAT WE HAVE GIVEN JAPAN TO PROTECT THEM.

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Thank you for saying so.
I totally agree with you.
off topic:
We have "Konpira-shrine" near here, as a guardian deity of the sea. Japan-MDF ships sometimes come here to visit "Konpira-shrine". We can board "goei-kan(Defense Destroyer)" and enjoy cruising on that "friendly day". I love it.

"Self-appointed" is matter of interpretation by each generation. Just think after Vietnam , the US military winded down to point their budget was axed, nothing was being developed and NO ONE wanted ANOTHER Vietnam where we lost our edgee of being A Winning side. We lost our MIGHT in Vietnam. Those who served in Vietnam was looked down by the Public as being the "HEEL" or just a criminal of some sort.

In the movie, RAMBO, at the end of the movie, RAMBO said this we should be appreciated to have served its Country in any war or situation we are in.

Do you agree?

As for those serving Iraq now, there are amny support programs for soldiers returning and being part of the CIVILIAN life again. It is the transition timethat all of us would want when we are in a stress situation , SUCH as a"Life or Death situation"....

IchiRoll

From what I understand the book that the First Blood movie was based upon (same name) was actually an anti-war story to show the futileness of war.
And the sheriff was not the 'bad guy' he was protrayed in the movie.
But, you know hollywood. Allergic to ideas.

The book The Spitting Image: Myth, Memory, and the Legacy of Vietnam claims the spat upon returning soldier from Vietnam is a myth. Author could find not one documented case of such. Here's an interview with the author about his claim.

The sodliers WERE the protestors, if anything soldiers coming back that were against the war were dissed by those back home who supported the war the most. Then...well, I'll let you read the article for yourself.
I don't know, I wasn't there either.

the U.S.forces in Japan are hostages

justinod said:

There are many smaller issues masked here. The US military's presence here in Japan serves both parties' interests. The US gets to maintain strategic bases near China and NK. Japan gets FREE protection.

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Free protection? Are you kidding?

caster51 said:

the U.S.forces in Japan are hostages

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yup. hostage of the US military-industrial-congressional-complex empire and ignorance & fear that is used by those who promote it:

Income Redistribution in Disguise Escalating Military Spending

Sukotto said:

yup. hostage of the US military-industrial-congressional-complex empire and ignorance & fear that is used by those who promote it:
Income Redistribution in Disguise Escalating Military Spending

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Over half of the U.S. government's budget is on Medicare and Medicaid. In addition, most of these news sources you sited are incredibly extremist, myopic, and so brutally biased as to be a questionable source. This sort of journalism makes Rush Limbaugh look moderate by comparison. Instead, site reputable sources, please, and leave the left-wing conspiracy theories at home. Sensationalist, radical journalism like this has been as thoroughly discredited as anything Michael Moore's ever done.

In addition, I've spoken to numerous Vietnam veterans who have recounted incidents in which they had been spat upon and called "babykiller". One commented sardonically how there is no difference between him and a pro-choice lobbyist, in that case. Again, this Lembke's work is not reputable, and is, in fact, revisionist history, and scholarly journals (which are, themselves, often leftist), have not favorably reviewed this work because it is openly biased and the research was deliberately flawed.

caster51 said:

the U.S.forces in Japan are hostages

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I would actually agree with you, here. I don't think most Americans want us to have a military presence in Japan. Most Japanese I know are indifferent toward it, but most Koreans and Taiwanese most certainly want a base there in case China or North Korea try anything.

Admittedly, these South Koreans and Taiwanese are also nervous that Japan might try again to build a Greater East-Asian Co-Prosperity Sphere, but I doubt that will occur again. At least, not with Japan as the aggressor.

GodEmperorLeto said:

Admittedly, these South Koreans and Taiwanese are also nervous that Japan might try again to build a Greater East-Asian Co-Prosperity Sphere, but I doubt that will occur again. At least, not with Japan as the aggressor.

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Really?
I don't think that many Westerners understand the relationship between Japan and Taiwan enough well. Taiwan is not same as South Korea which stands clearly China side.
Taiwanese are very realistic people.

hanachan said:

Really?
I don't think that many Westerners understand the relationship between Japan and Taiwan enough well. Taiwan is not same as South Korea which stands clearly China side.
Taiwanese are very realistic people.

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I agree that the Taiwanese are more worried about China. At least, that's what all the Taiwanese that I know are saying. But they also tell me they don't like Japan's plans for military development. They don't talk about it as much as the Koreans, though.

Taiwanese are also nervous that Japan might try again to build a Greater East-Asian Co-Prosperity Sphere

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I think Japan learnt it from history that is the stupidest thing.
that is, japan do not want to be related anymore.
I think Japan know "USA thought" well because it is very similar and simple and military tactics.
however Japan can not understand what china and korea are thinking.

I would actually agree with you, here. I don't think most Americans want us to have a military presence in Japan. Most Japanese I know are indifferent toward it, but most Koreans and Taiwanese most certainly want a base there in case China or North Korea try anything.

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If US force leaves Japan, japan would amend article 9.
I want to see american way in Asia that Japan could not do .
vietnum war and korean war were kind of good show. what is next?

caster51 said:

Japan can not understand what china and korea are thinking

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We don't think in a way of Chinese and Koreans.

By the way,
Yesterday, April 28, was the day when the Treaty of San Francisco between the Allied nations and Japan came into force.
It is Japan's Independence Day though even the most of Japanese forget.
:cracker: :cracker: :cracker: :56:

I don't think that US Force leaves Japan.
US Force can get all they need here.
Their hi-tech equipments need high level technology for maintenance.
Actually they consign some support work to Japan.
Infrastructure got ready well, clean environment, high standard of living, high technology...
Don't you think that Japan is too precious base to give to other?

It is Japan's Independence Day

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Independence from what?

Obeika said:

Independence from what?

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from the situation of occupied

hanachan said:

We don't think in a way of Chinese and Koreans.
By the way,
Yesterday, April 28, was the day when the Treaty of San Francisco between the Allied nations and Japan came into force.
It is Japan's Independence Day though even the most of Japanese forget.
:cracker: :cracker: :cracker: :56:

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Your recognition is wrong.
The times when the Allied Forces occupied Japan,
Because there were the Japanese cabinet and legislature,
Japan was a limit sovereign state.
The SF agreement is a formal war conclusion agreement.
Japan is not doing the declaration of independence.

Japan is not doing the declaration of independence.

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if it says well, Us force is hostage.

or Japan is still.............................

Thanks Nagashima san and caster51 san.

Japan was a limit sovereign state.

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☝ naruhodo...
I got it.

naruhodo...

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dont say like that^^
we should get angry

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hanachan said:

from the situation of occupied

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But there's still U.S. Bases there. Japan will be independent when the last U.S. base is closed down.