nurizeko said:
Voice, these forums are first and formost about Japan, ...
Correct, and they remain as such. People posting on animal activism or the whaling is quite all right as well. Threads and sections exist for them. Like I said, activists would not want this to become an Animal Rights lopsided forum. I am glad there are very few of us here.
if these forums are an important part of the animal activist campaign then their not thinking very well.
The whole body of public forums that exist for open exchange of ideas are valued by activists for getting issues they feel important pushed to the forefront for discussion. More discussion leads to more social awareness. More social awareness could cause more influential or future influential person to be moved on the spectrum of where they stand on animal issues.
Animal acivists need to take their debates to political and enviromental sites and forums,...
The do that, but it would be wrong to not spread out as much as possible. LIke I said, it is not wise for Animal Activists to be sitting around in an animal or environmental site talking to one another. That would be speaking to the the believers. No growing of numbers in that way.
...not some obscure forum about Japan mainly visitted by J-rockers who couldnt give a **** for the whales and a few Japan ex-pats and frequent visitors.
Well, we have a disagreement. I have a more positive view of JRef than you do and I do not feel they are so obscure to not attract others with wide interests or those even open to new ideas or social issues for debate.
Japan is also my home of residence, and many in Japan do visit this site. I feel quite justified in making myself and issues important to me available for engagement by others in my community. Perhaps you don`t. I do, and I would not ask you to not do so to issues important to you or discourage you from doing it in a way you feel is most positive for you.
None of the above groups care about enviromentalism or have the power to change things, were a fringe group of society, and in no way in our current numbers influence any enviromental policy.
Nurizeko, you are wrong. I have been PMed by a few people from those groups with comments on some of my animal posts. You do presume too much into areas you cannot see. As to whether they have "power," is irrelevant for raising concious understanding of or interest in the issues.
Don`t get too hung up on numbers, as well. Most great social changes have always started with one, two, or three dedicated people who were not in power. Things take time and no one never knows where the next great social leader on any issue will rise from. Why should people visiting JRef be ruled out of the equation?
And those of us living in Japan live in a country which frankly doesnt care for foreign residents bitching about the enviroment at all.
Have you jumped from Animal Rightists/activists to environmentalists? You should know by now that I am the former, so I have no reason why you switched to environmentalists. But, I would take issue that the governement doesn`t take notice here of activists. Of course we have not won anything on a grand scale as of yet, but one of the great things foreign animal activists are doing here is exporting their views on animals from America and Europe to Japan, which is slowly taking hold. Peta has had several demos in Tokyo and are in the process of getting members here -- perhaps soon to open up a Japan office, and the Animal Rights Center of Japan has been established and they are showing every sign of being as hard core as Peta and probably more.
If your mission apart from a few whaling debates is to actually spread the enviromentalist philosophy, your best bet is to take your well written and engaging opinions to places where they can make a difference.
Addressed above. In addition, the fight for animal rights is a multi-pronged one. The fight is being taken to clothing stores in Japan, whaling/dolphin hunting ports, media, zoos, pounds, etc... Making a difference takes time.
Its like a war of the worlds scenario, where folk celebrate killing one tripod walker, is it really that big of a victory compaared to the millions upon millions of dead humans and millions upon millions more in line to join them?.
lol. Good example. But you would have been better off not using it. It suits our argumentt better. To your question: YES!
Learning how to knock down the first Tripod (although in the movie it was virus) is a very important victory. It may be the most important one besides the last one that eventually comes. Until one learns how to knock down the first one, there is just a lot of grappling in the dark for the answer.
If Huntington Life Sciences ever goes under, which they are teetering now, you will see, if not hear, the proverbial "shot heard around the world." It will be a monumental marker in the history for the struggle against corporate businesses which make their profits off the backs and bloods of animals.
Its like hammering away at a giant metal cube and eventually chipping it.
Agreed. We are doing that in a number of ways. Believe me, the industry knows they are under assault. They have been taking the AR Movement quite seriously these last 10 years. Never good to storm the gate.
What you need to do is hit it at a weak spot with a more powerful weapon.
So go forth SVF and make a difference - where it counts.
I am forth, Nurizeko. There is no front. I am involved and engaged on my piece of the puzzle when I am away from the computer.