Combining Sentences?

Nocturne · 7 Jun 2010

Hi all, I'm having a mental blank here. I want to combine these short sentences into 1. What's the best way to do this?
ゆみさんの学部は薬学部です。ゆきさんの学部は環境科学です。よこさんの学部は経済学と法学です。
They are 3 different people with 3 different faculties. I attempted the below sentence, but I don't think it's correct:
ゆみさんの学部は薬学部で、ゆきさんは環境科学で、よこさんは経済学と法学です。
In general、Is there a rule for combining similar/different sentences? What if I want to say:
"Yumi want's to become a doctor, Yuki want's to teach English and Yoko wants to play football professionally."
How can I say this above example in one sentence?

教えて下さい.

undrentide · 7 Jun 2010

Nocturne said:
Hi all, I'm having a mental blank here. I want to combine these short sentences into 1. What's the best way to do this?
ゆみさんの学部は薬学部です。ゆきさんの学部は環境科学です。よこさんの学部は経済学と法学です。
They are 3 different people with 3 different faculties. I attempted the below sentence, but I don't think it's correct:
ゆみさんの学部は薬学部で、ゆきさんは環境科学で、よこさんは経済学と法学です。
In general、Is there a rule for combining similar/different sentences? What if I want to say:
"Yumi want's to become a doctor, Yuki want's to teach english and Yoko wants to play football professionally."
How can I say this above example in one sentence?

教えて下さい.

Basically it is correct to use て／で to combine more than 2 sentence into one.
But when combining three (or more), one may feel there are too many repetition.
In that case you can omit that part.
e.g.
ゆみさんは医師になりたいと思っています。
ゆきさんは英語の先生になりたいと思っています。
ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたいと思っています。
↓↓↓
ゆみさんは医師に、ゆきさんは英語の先生に、ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたいと思っています。

By the way, female name Yoko is ようこ not よこ.

Nocturne · 7 Jun 2010

undrentide said:
Basically it is correct to use て／で to combine more than 2 sentence into one.
But when combining three (or more), one may feel there are too many repetition.
In that case you can omit that part.
e.g.
ゆみさんは医師になりたいと思っています。
ゆきさんは英語の先生になりたいと思っています。
ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたいと思っています。
↓↓↓
ゆみさんは医師に、ゆきさんは英語の先生に、ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたいと思っています。

By the way, female name Yoko is ようこ not よこ.

Undrentideさん、直してくれてありがとうございます！
I have a couple of quick questions though: 「ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたいと思っています。」
Is it okay to use 「たい」 for 3rd person? I thought you would have to use: 「たがる」？
だから：「「ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたがると思っています。」？
Also, why do you use:「思っています」？ If it's your opinion, shouldn't it be 「思います」? I thought 「思っています」 was just for other people's thoughts?
Thank you again

Toritoribe · 7 Jun 2010

The following thread might be somewhat helpful.

verb form vs adj form -- question | Japan Forum

ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたいと思っています。＝ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたがっています。
Thus, the subject of 思っています is ようこ, not "I."

Nocturne · 7 Jun 2010

Toritoribe said:
The following thread might be somewhat helpful.
ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたいと思っています。＝ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたがっています。
Thus, the subject of 思っています is ようこ, not "I."

Thankyou for your help, Toritoribeさん、But I'm still quite confused unfortunately

たい Vs. たがる－ Both are wants when it involves a verb (otherwise I'd be using ほしい/ほしがる for just nouns etc). After reading your suggested thread, it's made me even more confused. My textbooks say たい is used for your own desires and asking about someone elses. たがる is describing someone elses desires...

As for 思っています： What if I knew for certain (like say I asked Yuuko), that she wanted to become a football player. So it's my opinon isn't it? It's what I know/think.'

ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたいと思っています
(Yuuko thinks she wants to become a pro football player)
Vs.
ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたがると思います。
（I think Yuuko wants to become a pro football player).
Vs.
ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりがります。
（Yuuko wants to become a pro footbally player).

Perhaps I should have mentioned beforehand: These sentences are actually interview answers from 3 Japanese people that we had to write a report on. So I actually asked "What do kind of career do you want" and got those answers. Does that make a difference?

Thanks again

undrentide · 7 Jun 2010

Nocturne said:
たい Vs. たがる－ Both are wants when it involves a verb (otherwise I'd be using ほしい/ほしがる for just nouns etc). After reading your suggested thread, it's made me even more confused. My textbooks say たい is used for your own desires and asking about someone elses. たがる is describing someone elses desires...

As for 思っています： What if I knew for certain (like say I asked Yuuko), that she wanted to become a football player. So it's my opinon isn't it? It's what I know/think.'

ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたいと思っています
(Yuuko thinks she wants to become a pro football player)
Vs.
ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたがると思います。
（I think Yuuko wants to become a pro football player).
Vs.
ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりがります。
（Yuuko wants to become a pro football player).

Perhaps I should have mentioned beforehand: These sentences are actually interview answers from 3 Japanese people that we had to write a report on. So I actually asked "What do kind of career do you want" and got those answers. Does that make a difference?

～たい is a bit tricky.
It basically describe one's own wish (I want), so when describing the 3rd person, you should use ～たいと思っている／考えている or ～たがる.
The latter is used only for the 2nd/3rd person, you cannot use it for yourself.
～たがる sometimes sounds judgemental, so to avoid misunderstanding ～たいと思っている／考えている would be "safer" in most situation.

Toritoribe · 7 Jun 2010

Nocturne said:
たい Vs. たがる－ Both are wants when it involves a verb (otherwise I'd be using ほしい/ほしがる for just nouns etc). After reading your suggested thread, it's made me even more confused. My textbooks say たい is used for your own desires and asking about someone elses. たがる is describing someone elses desires...

As for 思っています： What if I knew for certain (like say I asked Yuuko), that she wanted to become a football player. So it's my opinon isn't it? It's what I know/think.'

ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたいと思っています
(Yuuko thinks she wants to become a pro football player)
Vs.
ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたがると思います。
（I think Yuuko wants to become a pro football player).
Vs.
ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりがります。
（Yuuko wants to become a pro football player).

Perhaps I should have mentioned beforehand: These sentences are actually interview answers from 3 Japanese people that we had to write a report on. So I actually asked "What do kind of career do you want" and got those answers. Does that make a difference?

certain thing, speaker knows it.
ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたがっています。
ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたいと思っています。

uncertain thing, speaker's opinion/guess
ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたがっていると思います。
ようこさんはプロのフットボール選手になりたいと思っていると思います。(a bit repetitive, though)

So the former ones should be used for your situation.

Nocturne · 8 Jun 2010

そうですか。分かりました。 Thank you both for being so helpful!

If I have any more questions that are bit off topic to what I originally asked, is it ok to ask it here? Or should I start a new thread?

Thanks again,
-N.

Toritoribe · 8 Jun 2010

Nocturne said:
If I have any more questions that are bit off topic to what I originally asked, is it ok to ask it here? Or should I start a new thread?

Both are OK.

Nocturne · 11 Jun 2010

Haha, ok great ^^ I do have another question:

「というのも、実はこの部屋、天井全体がプラネタリウムになっている。」
(Because, actually this room has a planetarium in the ceiling)

What does the 「なっている」 mean in this sentence?

I'm familar with ようになっています, ことになっています and Intransitive Verb て＋います、 but just this plain なっています is confusing me slightly.

Thank you

Glenn · 11 Jun 2010

It's more like the room's entire ceiling is a planetarium. になっている here is a lot like だ, except it implies that at one point the entire ceiling wasn't a planetarium, and it at some point became that and still is. だ would imply more that it always has been.

Nocturne · 13 Jun 2010

Glenn said:
It's more like the room's entire ceiling is a planetarium. になっている here is a lot like だ, except it implies that at one point the entire ceiling wasn't a planetarium, and it at some point became that and still is. だ would imply more that it always has been.

Ah, I see! Thank you Glenn - can't believe it was so simple ^^

Ok, new question：

ご両親はユミさんにピアノを弾いてもらいたがっていましたが、いくら練習しても、できませんでした。

Does the sentence I've written mean: "Yumi's parents wanted her to play the piano, but no matter how much she practiced, she couldn't do it."

I just need clarification because of the whole たい／たがる issue I seem to have ^^;;

Thank you all again,
-N.

Yukiko chan · 13 Jun 2010

I understood the sentence the way you intended it, but I think に should be replaced by が and いくら by (何れ程) どれほど... I could be mistaken. May the senseis correct me please if I am!!

ご両親はユミさんがピアノを弾いてもらいたがっていましたが、何れ程練習しても、できませんでした。

Elizabeth · 13 Jun 2010

Nocturne said:
ご両親はユミさんにピアノを弾いてもらいたがっていましたが、いくら練習しても、できませんでした。
Does the sentence I've written mean: "Yumi's parents wanted her to play the piano, but no matter how much she practiced, she couldn't do it."
I just need clarification because of the whole たい／たがる issue I seem to have ^^;;
Thank you all again,

Yes, that's right.

Yukiko chan · 13 Jun 2010

And are the changes I made completely wrong? :?

Elizabeth · 13 Jun 2010

Yukiko chan said:
And are the changes I made completely wrong? :?

I believe the original sentence was from a Japanese text. Nocturne was interested only in the correct translation.

Yukiko chan · 13 Jun 2010

Ah, I see. I thought she wrote it herself...

undrentide · 13 Jun 2010

Yukiko chan said:
I understood the sentence the way you intended it, but I think に should be replaced by が and いくら by (何れ程) どれほど... I could be mistaken. May the senseis correct me please if I am!!

ご両親はユミさんがピアノを弾いてもらいたがっていましたが、何れ程練習しても、できませんでした。

(1) No, the に here cannot be replaced by が.
To have/make/let someone do something, it is always に（～してもらう、させる）.

(2) いくら is quite natural in this context.
It can be replaced by どれほど (usually written in hiragana) or どれだけ but they are just alternative.

Yukiko chan · 14 Jun 2010

Thanks for the explanation undrentide san. I've never used いくら in such a context, which why it sounded weird to me.

Elizabeth · 14 Jun 2010

Yukiko chan said:
Thanks for the explanation undrentide san. I've never used いくら in such a context, which why it sounded weird to me.

You can also use "どんなに~~しても"

Nocturne · 14 Jun 2010

Yukiko chan said:
Ah, I see. I thought she wrote it herself...

*giggle* I did write it myself ^^

I thought about what I wanted to say in english then I translated it. I wanted to make sure the way I was using たい／たがる was correct.

This is all in preparation for a semester exam, so I need all the help I can get

Thankyou all for the advice

Toritoribe · 14 Jun 2010

You did pretty well! Just a tiny thing but I would say like this.

ご両親はユミさんにピアノを弾かせたがっていましたが、彼女はいくら練習してもできませんでした/弾けませんでした。

When the parents make their daughter do something, もらう sounds a bit weird. させる would be more common.
The topic tends to be cover to the sentence end, so you'd better to show who the topic is when the topis changes in the compound sentence.

Elizabeth · 14 Jun 2010

Toritoribe said:
ご両親はユミさんにピアノを弾かせたがっていましたが、彼女はいくら練習してもできませんでした/弾けませんでした。

When the parents make their daughter do something, もらう sounds a bit weird. させる would be more common.

Double posted !

Elizabeth · 14 Jun 2010

Toritoribe said:
You did pretty well! Just a tiny thing but I would say like this.
ご両親はユミさんにピアノを弾かせたがっていましたが、彼女はいくら練習してもできませんでした/弾けませんでした。
When the parents make their daughter do something, もらう sounds a bit weird. させる would be more common.

Oh, that's so true. I completely overlooked it. Moraitagatte iru would be for a child who demanded something from the party of a higher status.

"弾いて欲しがっています" is still acceptable, though ?

Nocturne · 14 Jun 2010

Toritoribe said:
You did pretty well! Just a tiny thing but I would say like this.
ご両親はユミさんにピアノを弾かせたがっていましたが、彼女はいくら練習してもできませんでした/弾けませんでした。
When the parents make their daughter do something, もらう sounds a bit weird. させる would be more common.
The topic tends to be cover to the sentence end, so you'd better to show who the topic is when the topis changes in the compound sentence.

（笑）いええ、まだまだですね。

I've been studying the ～てほしい structure, that's why I was using it rather than just a causitive command. So, I have the same question as Elizabeth: How about if I used ～弾いてほしたがっている？ My textbook doesn't say anything about ～てほしいｆor 3rd parties... so I'm not sure...？

Another sentence I'm not sure if I can say about 3rd parties is this:

ゆみさんは公務員になりたいという思いがあります.
(Yumi think's she wants to become a Government worker).

I know there is is easier ways to say the above sentence, but the structure: "～たいという思いがある", I was wondering if it can be used in that way?

Thanks again!

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