昼間の電話 / 「いりません」といえない

Hi,

A couple of hard sentences that I am struggling with....


1. 昼間の電話でないに限る。・・・（中略）・・・誰からかかってくるというのでない昼間の電話は、勧誘、宣伝 の類いである。

a) 昼間の電話でないに限る -- Could this mean "There's nothing better than a day without any telephone calls"?

b) 誰からかかってくるというのでない昼間の電話は -- This would seem to make sense if it meant "daytime telephone calls, whoever they are from...", but I don't see how we get that meaning. I am especially confused by 誰から ... のでない.

c) 勧誘、宣伝の類いである -- Looks like it means "... are (telephone calls) of the canvasssing or sales type"?


2. が、ここですぐ「いりません」といえないのは日本人ゆえか、話だけは聞こうかと、一回、このおトクな期間を 確認したのが、墓穴を掘った。

a) が、ここですぐ「いりません」といえないのは = "But, not being able to quickly say 'I don't want it' at this point [i.e. this initial stage of the sales call] ... "?

b) 日本人ゆえか = ??? Don't understand ゆえか.

c) 話だけは聞こうかと = ???

d) 一回、このおトクな期間を確認したのが、墓穴を掘った。= ??? Trying to translate this, I get "one time, confirming this economical term dug me into a hole"... The salesman is trying to sell the author a cable TV package, and I'm guessing the author is talking about inadvertently appearing to show interest in the salesman's pitch, but the exact meaning is eluding me.

Hi eeky,

1. 昼間の電話でないに限る。・・・（中略）・・・誰からかかってくるというのでない昼間の電話は、勧誘、宣伝の類いである。

a) 昼間の電話でないに限る -- Could this mean "There's nothing better than a day without any telephone calls"?

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The only thing you should do is not replying any calls during daytime.
限る should be limited to, i.e. only thing you can/should

電話にでない＜電話にでる to answer call(s)

b) 誰からかかってくるというのでない昼間の電話は -- This would seem to make sense if it meant "daytime telephone calls, whoever they are from...", but I don't see how we get that meaning. I am especially confused by 誰から ... のでない.

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誰からかかってくるというので（は）ない modifies 昼間の電話
誰からかかってくる means calls from a certain person ( someone you expect to call you)
They are ramdom phone calls you got during day time.

c) 勧誘、宣伝の類いである -- Looks like it means "... are (telephone calls) of the canvasssing or sales type"?

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Yes.
(Those phone calls) are of solicitation, promotion (of commercial goods), etc.

2. が、ここですぐ「いりません」といえないのは日本人ゆえか、話だけは聞こうかと、一回、このおトクな期間を確認したのが、墓穴を掘った。

a) が、ここですぐ「いりません」といえないのは = "But, not being able to quickly say 'I don't want it' at this point [i.e. this initial stage of the sales call] ... "?

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Correct.

b) 日本人ゆえか = ??? Don't understand ゆえか.

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ゆえ＝故. A little classical sounding word (but still in good use) meaning 理由.
日本人であるせいか、日本人であるためか。

c) 話だけは聞こうかと = ???

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(For a promotional call), I might hear what the person is talking about.
No intention to buy or join but just hear what the person is talking.
話しを聞く ＋だけ (to limit only 話）

d) 一回、このおトクな期間を確認したのが、墓穴を掘った。= ??? Trying to translate this, I get "one time, confirming this economical term dug me into a hole"... The salesman is trying to sell the author a cable TV package, and I'm guessing the author is talking about inadvertently appearing to show interest in the salesman's pitch, but the exact meaning is eluding me.

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Your interpretation is correct.

Thanks for your help undrentide.

1a. Aha, this でない is 出ない, right? (I was thinking of でない as in で（は）ない.)

However, is 電話でない a valid abbreviation of 電話にでない, or is there a typo (missing に)?

2. I'm sorry, despite staring at this for ages I still do not understand the overall structure of this sentence.

I understand your explanations, but I do not grasp how the parts fit together (e.g. the purpose of か and かと, or the relationship between といえないのは and 日本人ゆえ). Would it be possible for you to put it all together for me in English?

Also, as far as the last part is concerned, you say that my translation "one time, confirming this economical term dug me into a hole" is correct, but unfortunately I do not understand what that translation means! It is just a "dictionary translation" where I plug in words I looked up in the dictionary, which produces something that is largely gibberish to me. Would you be able to rephrase it, especially "this economical term" part?

1a. Aha, this でない is 出ない, right? (I was thinking of でない as in で（は）ない.)

However, is 電話でない a valid abbreviation of 電話にでない, or is there a typo (missing に)?

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Oh yes, you're right.
It must be a typo, it should read . 昼間の電話はでないに限る。・

2. I'm sorry, despite staring at this for ages I still do not understand the overall structure of this sentence.
I understand your explanations, but I do not grasp how the parts fit together (e.g. the purpose of か and かと, or the relationship between といえないのは and 日本人ゆえ). Would it be possible for you to put it all together for me in English?

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が、ここですぐ「いりません」といえないのは日本人ゆえか、
However, not being able to say 'no, I do not want it' right away is perhaps because I'm being Japanese,
（The speaker is wondering/asking himself if the reason is his being Japanese, and one could guess he answers himself 'yes'.)

Also, as far as the last part is concerned, you say that my translation "one time, confirming this economical term dug me into a hole" is correct, but unfortunately I do not understand what that translation means! It is just a "dictionary translation" where I plug in words I looked up in the dictionary, which produces something that is largely gibberish to me. Would you be able to rephrase it, especially "this economical term" part?

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墓穴を掘る is a set phrase, literal translation is digging one's own grave, which I guess can be rephrased as "shoot oneself in the foot" or "signs one's own death warrant".
By asking about the how long the offer is valid, the speaker got himself trapped.

Does this make any sense?

undrentide said:

Oh yes, you're right.
It must be a typo, it should read . 昼間の電話はでないに限る。

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Oh, right, I understood earlier that the expression was 電話にでる. Does 電話はでる mean the same?

undrentide said:

Does this make any sense?

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Thanks, I understand much of it now, but there are two things I am still unsure about:

What is かと? Is it か + と? Is か questioning again? Is it saying "However, not being able to say 'no, I do not want it' right away is perhaps because I'm Japanese, and perhaps because I might listen to what the person is talking about (without intending to buy)"? If that's correct, then what is the purpose of と?

Also, what is the purpose of 一回? Does it mean "one one particular occasion -- namely the occasion that I am telling you about now -- I dug a hole for myself"?

eeky said:

Oh, right, I understood earlier that the expression was 電話にでる. Does 電話はでる mean the same?

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昼間の電話は出ないに限る is the topicalization of 昼間の電話に出ないに限る, so you can also say 昼間の電話には出ないに限る.

eeky said:

What is かと? Is it か + と? Is か questioning again? Is it saying "However, not being able to say 'no, I do not want it' right away is perhaps because I'm Japanese, and perhaps because I might listen to what the person is talking about (without intending to buy)"? If that's correct, then what is the purpose of と?

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" ここですぐ「いりません」といえないのは日本人ゆえか " expresses the reason why the writer thought to hear what the salesman was talking about and confirmed the term. かと is indeed from "か + the quotational と", but this か expresses that 話だけは聞こう is talking to himself as a confirmation; "OK, I just hear".

［終助］文末にある種々の語に付く。
７ 引用した句の意味やある事実を確かめ、自分自身に言い 聞かせる意を表す。「急がば回れ―」「そろそろ寝ると する―」

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か - goo辞書

eeky said:

Also, what is the purpose of 一回? Does it mean "one one particular occasion -- namely the occasion that I am telling you about now -- I dug a hole for myself"?

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It's the same as 一度.
I confirmed just once, then I got myself trapped.

Thanks Toritoribe, I get it now.