South Park censored

[Emoni]

Ok, this might seem like a chit chat thread, but I actually consider it relatively serious.

The recent South Park episodes included a story around Muhammad, the image was still censored, and in fact the show was mostly around this sort of censorship issue in typical South Park style.

Before airing the second part, to no surprise, they received threats.

The second part included censorship of even the WORD Muhammed, and then most frightening of all, a speech supposedly concerning fear and intimidation meant to be the point of the episode. The creators already posted on the site, that the censorship was not their choice. http://tv.yahoo.com/blog/south-park-producers-say-network-cut-fear-speech--1181

The episodes are 200 and 201 and can be found on the main site. South Park - Watch Full Episodes Free Online | South Park Studios US (Should be accessible soon, but you can of course find it through "other means")

Honestly, the fact that people and networks ARE reacting in fear to this really makes me sick and I see it as fairly disgraceful to have to live in fear like that. The creators actually do seem to have enough guts to stand up and speak out about this, despite the dangerous, mostly because it NEEDS to be spoken of and confronted. To censor the entire ending speech, if the statement is correct, even though it doesn't contain even the word Muhammad is just pathetic in my opinion.

Really? To be frightened of even talking about it? Something is seriously wrong here.

 

[Half-n-Half]

It is kind of sad that they would have to do this, but if you think about it Revolution Muslim's veiled threat probably did more for them than the speech could have. Kind of like a case-in-point thing. Want an example of fear and intimidation? Just look at the response we received from Revolution Muslim.

 

[Elizabeth]

It proves once and for all the show has gotten into "shock for the sake of shock" and should have faded into obscurity years ago. Seriously. Lower than the European papers that printed a CARTOON of the prophet Mohammed, that led to the death threat. And there was even an assassination attempt of the Dutch cartoonist...Pathetic.

 

[Hezam]

I don't know why they keep Intimidate people...really it's Pathetic.

 

[Emoni]

If one of the reports is correct it is a group WITHIN the US in New York too, which is odd.

Honestly though, what I find worse than the threats are the fact that people and others DON'T stand up to it and cower in fear. Yes, caution is important, but you can't run from things like this... you HAVE to stand up against it, or it grows.

 

[Elizabeth]

If one of the reports is correct it is a group WITHIN the US in New York too, which is odd.

Definitely they are New York based - not even from a real Muslim part of the world. It is just one Jamaican guy, one Jewish guy and one white guy who converted!! They are terrorists plain and simple hiding behind religious pretenses and rights of this country to stifle other peoples' freedom of speech.

I agree they should be arrested but since it was more of an indirect threat I don't know if it would stick.

 

[Mycernius]

I saw something about this recently with an interview with Matt and Trey. The strange thing is that in a series (5 I think) a few years back they protrayed Mohammad in the league of Super friend with Jesus, Buddha, Krishna. This was a few years before the Danish cartoon fiasco, and no-one complained. The odd thing about this whole thing is that in Mohammad is depitcited in early muslim texts, usually on a flying horse. This idea of not allowed to show him is a recent idea. Should these fundie idiots put a fatwa on the early muslims for shwoing Mohammad? It isn't even part of islamic tradition.
here is the clip from super friends:

 

[Elizabeth]

The second part included censorship of even the WORD Muhammed, and then most frightening of all, a speech supposedly concerning fear and intimidation meant to be the point of the episode. The creators already posted on the site, that the censorship was not their choice. http://tv.yahoo.com/blog/south-park-...r-speech--1181

If all this was written into the episode [prior to any threats], then I don't believe it was not their choice. Indeed showing how stupid censorship is seems to have been the point of the entire show ??

Fake censorship and leave your producers at Comedy Central to take the heat .

 

[Hezam]

Mocking peoples' faith is not of Freedom of speech,WHY Jesus ? Mohammad ? Budha ? ..!
Please think about it,There are things we have to respect,Can't they live without mocking religions ?
Also,Why don't the other people learn from Japanese people how to be respectful ?

 

[Haruspex]

Mocking peoples' faith is not of Freedom of speech,WHY Jesus ? Mohammad ? Budha ? ..!

Freedom of speech is to have the freedom to say, write or otherwise intimate to the public whatever it is that you want to intimate. Your claim there, that, mocking others' faith is not covered by freedom of speech is baseless. The communications of all information through all means is covered by it.

Please think about it,There are things we have to respect,Can't they live without mocking religions ?

There aren't things we have to respect. Who said there are? What evidence or proof have you got?

Also,Why don't the other people learn from Japanese people how to be respectful ?

Because we don't want to. And frankly, there is no need for dishonest, false respect.

 

[Elizabeth]

Mocking peoples' faith is not of Freedom of speech,WHY Jesus ? Mohammad ? Budha ? ..!

Free speech has never meant you can say whatever you want. Regulation of content occurs all the time on television....But this isn't even a free speech issue because it isn't government doing the censorship. Comedy Central producers evidently decided, for whatever reason, it was best not to show Mohammad among other things. It's their private channel and show to do whatever they damn well please. Freedom of speech has nothing to do with this issue....

 

[RolandtheHeadless]

"For whatever reason"? Come on. We know the reason. The network was afraid of threats and intimidation by extremist groups.

Yes, a private network has the right to determine the content of its broadcasts. But extremist groups ought not to dictate what we see. The show wasn't mocking Mohammed, but groups that think they're so special that they can never be made fun of.

 

[Elizabeth]

"For whatever reason"? Come on. We know the reason. The network was afraid of threats and intimidation by extremist groups.
Yes, a private network has the right to determine the content of its broadcasts. But extremist groups ought not to dictate what we see. The show wasn't mocking Mohammed, but groups that think they're so special that they can never be made fun of.

Because the more I think about it, it wasn't even network censorship but A JOKE AND EVERYONE FELL FOR IT. The whole point of the episode was to show how stupid censorship is – hence the bleeping of even Mohammed's name, the bleeping of the "What I learned" speech at the end, etc. No one gave in... it was done like that on purpose.

 

[Hezam]

Oh ! South Park is private network ? it's ok then,i thought it a program on the american TV like always ;P
Everyone is free to what he wants in his private network,Sorry for misunderstand you Elizabeth san.

There aren't things we have to respect. Who said there are? What evidence or proof have you got?

Are you serious ? *sigh* i REALLY want to know how you treat the other people in your real life !!

 

[Mycernius]

Mocking peoples' faith is not of Freedom of speech,WHY Jesus ? Mohammad ? Budha ? ..!

And yet you have exercised your freedom of speech against Israel on several threads on this forum. How come you don't want Mohammad insulted and yet hate speech against Jews and Israel is okay by your standards?

Please think about it,There are things we have to respect,Can't they live without mocking religions ?

They deserve to be mocked and ridiculed to put them in the place of what they are. You will mock wiccans, pagans, even dead religions because of their outlandish beliefs, yet you can see no irony when it is done to yours. Wake up.

Why is religion such a holy grail (pardon the pun)? You can mock peoples politics, countries, sex, even the colour of their hair (believe me, I know this from personal experience), and yet as soon as someone mocks a religion it is suddenly "respect my religion", and in the case of islam, more often than not, it is with the threat of violence. It isn't even all the prophets that cause the hatred, just Mohammad. You can mock Jesus, Abraham, Moses and Noah and not one muslim will threaten you with any sort of violence for mocking them, but dare say even one wrong word against Mohammad and boy you open up a can of worms. He has been put up on such a pedestal by some muslims that it is almost idolatory, almost as if he was a demi-god. Not helped by poisonous fanatics in the mosques putting such dumb ideas into the masses heads. For a religion that say you should only worship Allah it has turned into a cult that worships Mohammad with just as much fanatical devotion.

 

[Haruspex]

Are you serious ? *sigh* i REALLY want to know how you treat the other people in your real life !!

I have asked, what evidence or proof you have that we must respect certain things? If you don't bring me any, for all practical purposes, you will have lost the argument. You purport to posit a premise and I am asking you to disclose what it is based on. There are no taboos and presumptions in serious arguments and even if it appears to you evident that certain things invite respect automatically, that is not the case. I treat people like most do, I just don't purport to describe it using vacuous terms such as respectful. Any money we won't be able, unanimously, to agree on the meaning of 'respect' with the small number of members posting in serious discussion. But I'm being too adventurous, so I'll make it dead obvious. Why should I show demonstrate any respect (whatever it means) towards a religion that I blame for countless things in this world that annoy me greatly, a religion the teachings of which I don't agree with? Why? I guess my question is quite similar to the one posed by Mycernius, but it is asking the converse. Why to demonstrate respect towards any set of beliefs or belief that I disagree with?

Tell you what, the reason we have relative ideological freedom is because the generations before us realised that scrutiny's an awesome thing and took their time, thoroughly, to offend the faithful and the loyal. If the power to scrutinise is taken from us, we may well just find our old caves and stone clubs. The day that you demonstrate your respect towards Super Urinal Xenophobes is the day I will show religion any respect. In fact, I lie, I just won't, but you get the point.

 

[Chidoriashi]

If all this was written into the episode [prior to any threats], then I don't believe it was not their choice. Indeed showing how stupid censorship is seems to have been the point of the entire show ??

Fake censorship and leave your producers at Comedy Central to take the heat .

You do realize they literally make their episodes (from start to finish) one week before they air.

 

[Emoni]

Mohammad's name wasn't censored in the 200 episode originally. The censor cover was part of the gag. HOWEVER, the censorship of the bleeps in 201 were stated by Matt and Trey NOT to be part of it and the censorship by Comedy Central. It's possible it is untrue, but highly unlikely, as the studio would have stated otherwise and not just taken the fall for censorship for no reason.

Unless you have some proof, to behave as if it is an obvious trick isn't warranted.

As for respecting religion and free speech? Under the legal form of free speech, yes Comedy Central isn't the government. However, we aren't speaking of the legal forms of free speech in this context, we are speaking of the CONCEPT of free speech, expression ideas, and satire.

As for respecting religion. I have no respect at all for religion, and there is no reason that I should. If someone believes that there are invisible forces that they can't show or proof, they are CERTAINLY open to ridicule, but not just to attack but for the point of making an argument via satire and irony. Humor IS a form of rebuttal for making an argument.

I DO HOWEVER, respect the concept that everyone is free to believe or value as important and freedom of religion. As long as you aren't inflicting suffering and pain, on others, then go right ahead and believe that there is some divine force. However, don't try to state it as FACT (instead of a belief, this is different) and think I'm going to actually take you seriously! You can't have freedom of religion without freedom of speech. Religious right-winger wackos don't seem to understand this (or a lot of other things)

 

[Emoni]

The day that you demonstrate your respect towards Super Urinal Xenophobes is the day I will show religion any respect. In fact, I lie, I just won't, but you get the point.

lol at this. Preeeeeeach on bruthaaa!

 

[Hezam]

And yet you have exercised your freedom of speech against Israel on several threads on this forum. How come you don't want Mohammad insulted and yet hate speech against Jews and Israel is okay by your standards?

Nice,since you bring israel here let me ask you first "Is Israel legal country?"

They deserve to be mocked and ridiculed to put them in the place of what they are. You will mock wiccans, pagans, even dead religions because of their outlandish beliefs, yet you can see no irony when it is done to yours. Wake up.

from your point of view,but not people who know him very well,people who know how he lived his life.
But it's ok,arguement is worthless here.
Muslims have been ordered not to insult the non-muslims but yet there are many idiots insulting the non-muslims,the best way is to stop them to avoid the hate they cause and not to allow some idiots to insult them in return !
What good will come from mocking peoples' religions/tradnations/styles...etc ??????
That's why i admire the Japanese people.
It's weird of you to say that !! ?

Why is religion such a holy grail (pardon the pun)? You can mock peoples politics, countries, sex, even the colour of their hair (believe me, I know this from personal experience), and yet as soon as someone mocks a religion it is suddenly "respect my religion", and in the case of islam, more often than not, it is with the threat of violence. It isn't even all the prophets that cause the hatred, just Mohammad. You can mock Jesus, Abraham, Moses and Noah and not one muslim will threaten you with any sort of violence for mocking them, but dare say even one wrong word against Mohammad and boy you open up a can of worms. He has been put up on such a pedestal by some muslims that it is almost idolatory, almost as if he was a demi-god. Not helped by poisonous fanatics in the mosques putting such dumb ideas into the masses heads. For a religion that say you should only worship Allah it has turned into a cult that worships Mohammad with just as much fanatical devotion.

Are we gonna start another bullshit here ?

I have asked, what evidence or proof you have that we must respect certain things? If you don't bring me any, for all practical purposes, you will have lost the argument. You purport to posit a premise and I am asking you to disclose what it is based on. There are no taboos and presumptions in serious arguments and even if it appears to you evident that certain things invite respect automatically, that is not the case. I treat people like most do, I just don't purport to describe it using vacuous terms such as respectful. Any money we won't be able, unanimously, to agree on the meaning of 'respect' with the small number of members posting in serious discussion. But I'm being too adventurous, so I'll make it dead obvious. Why should I show demonstrate any respect (whatever it means) towards a religion that I blame for countless things in this world that annoy me greatly, a religion the teachings of which I don't agree with? Why? I guess my question is quite similar to the one posed by Mycernius, but it is asking the converse. Why to demonstrate respect towards any set of beliefs or belief that I disagree with?

It's not about evidence/proof,Is there another way to show that his faith is wrong,his point of view is wrong because ...etc.
There are things we should be careful with,You can't change anything by this way..
You can make alot of friends by respect and you can make alot of enemies by mocking/insulting...
You are older than me guys,You are supposed to be good example,If the Muslims/Christians/Jews/Budhists/Hindu..etc respect each other there will be no wars no hate no Extremists.

Hope you got it.

 

[Emoni]

Um, you're missing the point again Hezam and misunderstanding what he is say. On top of that you didn't really answer half of what he said, just added unrelated things on top of it (i.e. Israel)

If the Muslims/Christians/Jews/Budhists/Hindu..etc respect each other there will be no wars no hate no Extremists.

Why did you include Buddhists in that? Where are the Buddhist terrorists? I guess they get on the plane and refuse to get off till it "eventually crashes" by itself? Or would that be Daoist terrorists?

Oh WAIT! I can't make that joke because it "isn't respecting religion" and might be making some Buddhists smile somewhere or something. :/

 

[Hezam]

Um, you're missing the point again Hezam and misunderstanding what he is say. On top of that you didn't really answer half of what he said, just added unrelated things on top of it (i.e. Israel)

I will be thankful if you clear it for me.

Why did you include Buddhists in that? Where are the Buddhist terrorists? I guess they get on the plane and refuse to get off till it "eventually crashes" by itself? Or would that be Daoist terrorists?

I don't like what you are reffering to,Terrorism is a western concept so please i am sick of it.
Budhism is one of the largest religions so i must include it here ! there is a war in thailand between Budhists and Muslims,in the past in japan between Budhists and christians...etc.
okashii ! why did you ask such question !

About respecting Budhism,Yes i really respect them to much,See how peaceful they are,and how respectful..See the differents between Europe-Middle East (Islam-Chriistianity) and South East Asia ( Islam-Budhism ) the first place is full of wars and blood..but in south east asia it's very peaceful,both Muslims and Budhists respect each other so no wars excepting Thailand witch is political more than religious.
That's what we got from respecting the others..

 

[Haruspex]

It's not about evidence/proof,Is there another way to show that his faith is wrong,his point of view is wrong because ...etc.

It is about evidence and proof. Absent evidence and proof, why should I hold something to be true? Requesting someone to disclose evidence and/or proof is a perfect way of proving someone's views wrong.

There are things we should be careful with,You can't change anything by this way..
You can make alot of friends by respect and you can make alot of enemies by mocking/insulting...

We've been mocking, insulting, wounding and offending the church/churches for a while now, in the west that is. It seems to be working. We can take the piss out of Jesus and Ratzinger will be waving his hands around inviting us to repent and atone for our sins, but not much. Somehow this scoundrel culture that we have here in the EU seems to enjoy the best freedom of speech protection in the world (There's no beating the European Convention on Human Rights when it comes to human rights). Its not us who need to start providing religion special treatment, religious adherents need to learn to take a ******* joke.

You are older than me guys,You are supposed to be good example,If the Muslims/Christians/Jews/Budhists/Hindu..etc respect each other there will be no wars no hate no Extremists.

I don't respect any of the people you listed there. I'm neither a good nor a bad example, merely an example of the average person who doesn't feel like giving up all the **** we've fought for, against the Catholic church (mostly), for years and years.

Why is it that I need to **** and not the rabid vermin who go on to wreak havoc in the name their illusionary prophets? Why can't they shut the bleeding **** up? Oh wait, beause it is totally justified to threaten with violence and even death because someone has violated one of their arbitrary rules, right? The west has allowed argumentation with no quarter and no holds barred, and now what? A bunch of zealots are trying reverse that and they have had relative success in the past. How ridiculous are we people in the west? We have separated church and state in our own states, but failed to separate our states from a faraway church. What a disgrace.

This whole **** disgusts me. I am sickened by these ridiculous arbitrary values and rules and regulations. Two of the three major religions are trying to corrode our rights and liberties day and night and the third is simply too far away and unable to. Ratzinger inviting me to repent?! Condescending cretin! He truly is a representative of the religious craze. It is all like an invisible, floating fascist state that is shouting arbitrary commands and telling people what is good for them. Are you, Hezam, telling me that despite this ridiculously strong hatred that I cannot even properly voice, this hatred I feel over having been denied the rights and the progress the world would have made but for the continuous intervention of religion, I am supposed to rape my own self and put on a fake smile? No chance. Forget about it. You see only one side of religion, the one which you want to see. You cannot deny all the **** God junkies have caused in the past and are causing right now.

Returning to the issue of evidence and proof, I invite you once again to disclose it. You are continously trying to sidestep my argument without facing it head on. I guess there isn't much else that could be done, considering how there is nothing in the natural world that seems to support that we are supposed to respect certain things. You are not disclosing your evidence or proof because you don't have any, because it just doesn't exist. </rant>

 

[Emoni]

Terrorism is a western concept so please i am sick of it.

How is terrorism a western concept? What exactly are you sick of?

there is a war in thailand between Budhists and Muslims,in the past in japan between Budhists and christians...etc.
!

Eh?? Um... wait you see the current conflict in Thailand as a religious battle between Buddhist and Muslims, and you see the Pacific War between Japan and the US as a religious war between Buddhists and Christians???? Holy generalizations Batman!

Ok, now things are getting totally off track it seems, I'm not sure "some members" even really know what the point or the topic was in the first place now :/

Just to reiterate, I was mostly posting in protest of the concept of censorship in the name of FEAR of a religious groups threats. As much as you might be rather peaceful yourself (unless Israel comes up...) "respecting Islam" isn't going to take care of the wackos, nor would it in any religion. Nor is their any need to respect religion, what about respecting a cult? Satan worshipers, or pagan religions? I don't think you'd quite be going that distance, especially if you saw HARM being done by that belief's actions. Moreover, the issue of respect is totally disconnected from the actions they choose and unrelated to the topic in my opinion.

 

[RolandtheHeadless]

Regardless of whether religion can be proved to an objective truth, religion is a big part of a people's culture. It forms much of one's self-identity and fundamental values and view of the world. When you attack someone's religion, you're attacking them, personally. I myself prefer to be respectful on this subject.

I'm not saying that religions should be protected from criticism and ridicule. In a free market of ideas, a religion is just as much a fair target as political and social beliefs. But I have to agree with Hezam about respect. The Japanese indeed have much to be admired here.

I don't see a lot worth defending in what "South Park" did. Insulting someone just to provoke them? I never much cared for that show, to tell the truth. The humor strikes me as sophomoric, but too adult-themed for kids to watch. Must have a fairly narrow target audience.