Spanking at an international school

[julia_matsu]

I was a preschool teacher at a lousy #### International school in Saitama. I was working with 3 to 5 years old children and we had a very friendly, fun and slightly noisy working environment. But... The director always came in and said in a humiliating tone that I am a bad teacher if I couldn't keep my children sit still, be quiet and listen.

His japanese wife (the senior teacher) sometimes spanked the children if they made too much noise. But couples of days ago the director asked me to shout and spank children and make them cry if they do not obey to sit still and be quiet.

I said that I will never come to the school again in that case. So they refused to pay me my October wage.

Can any of you give me some advice how to get my money?

Now I'm thinking may be I have to talk to the police and proseed a lawsuit.

Did somebody win a lawsuit against humiliating employers?

Thanks.

 

[FrustratedDave]

I was a preschool teacher at a lousy #### International school in Saitama. I was working with 3 to 5 years old children and we had a very friendly, fun and slightly noisy working environment. But... The director always came in and said in a humiliating tone that I am a bad teacher if I couldn't keep my children sit still, be quiet and listen.
His japanese wife (the senior teacher) sometimes spanked the children if they made too much noise. But couples of days ago the director asked me to shout and spank children and make them cry if they do not obey to sit still and be quiet.
I said that I will never come to the school again in that case. So they refused to pay me my October wage.
Can any of you give me some advice how to get my money?
Now I'm thinking may be I have to talk to the police and proseed a lawsuit?
Did somebody win a lawsuit against humiliating employers?
Thanks.
:angryfire

Why? You went against the rules of the school. Refusing to obey rules will get you fired and if you refused to come into work they have every right to not pay you as you are causing them loss due to the fact that they now have to find another teacher because you never gave notice. I have no sympathy for you.

 

[julia_matsu]

Why? You went against the rules of the school. Refusing to obey rules will get you fired and if you refused to come into work they have every right to not pay you as you are causing them loss due to the fact that they now have to find another teacher because you never gave notice. I have no sympathy for you.

Oh, so, in your opinion, if they would ask me to kill a child I should also obey ?
And there is no such a rule to spank and humiliate children in any school.

 

[Ashikaga]

Your first action was to sign up to join an online forum about Japan and ask whomever what to do? I, for one, am not buying it. IF this is for real, talk to a lawyer. If this is what I think it is, shame on me for responding at all.

 

[julia_matsu]

Your first action was to sign up to join an online forum about Japan and ask whomever what to do? I, for one, am not buying it. IF this is for real, talk to a lawyer. If this is what I think it is, shame on me for responding at all.

Thanks for answering. So you recomend me to talk to a lawyer. Fortunately a friend of mine told me that there are some japanese government officials dealing with employment issues in each area, so I'm going to go there on Tuesday.
There are different ways to solve problems. I started with a forum. Do you blame me for asking for help here?

 

[ArmandV]

A better answer to your question would be "read your contract," instead of what was posted. If the contract specifies you have to spank the kids, that is one thing. But you should be paid for work performed regardless.

I agree that you should talk to a labor attorney there.

 

[julia_matsu]

A better answer to your question would be "read your contract," instead of what was posted. If the contract specifies you have to spank the kids, that is one thing. But you should be paid for work performed regardless.
I agree that you should talk to a labor attorney there.

Thank you, your words are like a balm on my wounded hart.
Would you like to know how the story will end?
Come back in few days.

 

[ArmandV]

Thank you, your words are like a balm on my wounded hart.
Would you like to know how the story will end?
Come back in few days.

You're welcome!

BTW, welcome aboard!

 

[FrustratedDave]

Oh, so, in your opinion, if they would ask me to kill a child I should also obey ?
And there is no such a rule to spank and humiliate children in any school.

Are you being asked to kill a child? No you are not , so I suggest you leave the school for good if you have a problem with the way it is run. Just don't expect things like getting paid if you break the rules like suddenly not turning up for work and not giving proper notice. You have every right to do what you feel is correct, but you sound like you want all your cake and eat it. So again, I have no sympathy for you.

 

[julia_matsu]

Are you being asked to kill a child? No you are not , so I suggest you leave the school for good if you have a problem with the way it is run. Just don't expect things like getting paid if you break the rules like suddenly not turning up for work and not giving proper notice. You have every right to do what you feel is correct, but you sound like you want all your cake and eat it. So again, I have no sympathy for you.

Thank you for pointing out that I have to place a notice. I will do that. Luckily, I worked all the working days in October and the conflict came the last day at the end of my working day, so I didn't miss any working day yet.
So you recommend me to go back to schoooooool no matter what and wait 2 weeks? But they told me that they will not pay me any money because of that conflict.

 

[butakun]

Is this your first job? Whatever you decide to do with your employer, by breaking the contract yourself you are giving them more legal ammunition. The issue between you and your employer is to be worked out in due course later, but the fact is that you are dishonoring the contract if you simply stopped showing up. So don't do that if you want your case to sort out the way you want.

 

[FrustratedDave]

Thank you for pointing out that I have to place a notice. I will do that. Luckily, I worked all the working days in October and the conflict came the last day at the end of my working day, so I didn't miss any working day yet.
So you recommend me to go back to schoooooool no matter what and wait 2 weeks? But they told me that they will not pay me any money because of that conflict.

Thats what I recommend, go back and appologise and when they pay you give them the proper notice and if they don't pay you then, you have a case. If they don't pay you after you you have done the right thing I can point you in the right direction for getting your money quickly and cleanly. And if they are saying they won't pay you for the conflict, I suggest you look at you contract and ask them for a copy of their "就業規則" ,"shuugyuukisoku", but if the company you work for has less than 10 staff they probably won't have a "就業規則" ,"shuugyuukisoku". Why I suggest this is b/c it could be written in the rules that you have to do what you are told. If you don't understand what I am talking about then please let me know?

 

[orochi]

Dave, I don't think you're being much help.

 

[FrustratedDave]

Dave, I don't think you're being much help.

How's so?..............................................

 

[Mikawa Ossan]

Thats what I recommend, go back and appologise and when they pay you give them the proper notice and if they don't pay you then, you have a case. If they don't pay you after you you have done the right thing I can point you in the right direction for getting your money quickly and cleanly. And if they are saying they won't pay you for the conflict, I suggest you look at you contract and ask them for a copy of their "就業規則" ,"shuugyuukisoku", but if the company you work for has less than 10 staff they probably won't have a "就業規則" ,"shuugyuukisoku". Why I suggest this is b/c it could be written in the rules that you have to do what you are told. If you don't understand what I am talking about then please let me know?

Actually, I thought this post was quite helpful.

 

[ArmandV]

Actually, I thought this post was quite helpful.

Yes, it was a step in the right direction.

 

[Emoni]

Actually, I thought this post was quite helpful.

I have to agree... that was exactly the sort of advice that was needed.

 

[ifjames]

This thread defies belief: distasteful in concept, as well as content, and should be renamed and locked
farewell JREF: this is not needed: I'm out of here

 

[Grandpa Frank]

I guess we are supposed to forget about the kids.....

and examine the problem from the point of view of management VS worker and the legal aspects of contracts in Japan.

Uncle Frank

 

[FrustratedDave]

This thread defies belief: distasteful in concept, as well as content, and should be renamed and locked
farewell JREF: this is not needed: I'm out of here

I would love to hear what you have to say about spanking of kids if they play up?
Just a question, are you one of the people that think that parents should not be able to spank their kids in public like Australia has now adopted?

and examine the problem from the point of view of management VS worker and the legal aspects of contracts in Japan.
Uncle Frank
:?

That is all I looking at. If some people (Fel1city) were to actually have a clue, she might realise that Japan still employs methods like this at school. What is talking about it even if someone feels it is wrong going to do about the current situation of the OP?

I think Fel1city needs to get a grip on reality and looks at what the thread is about getting the OP's money. Or did I miss something here?

 

[julia_matsu]

Thats what I recommend, go back and appologise and when they pay you give them the proper notice and if they don't pay you then, you have a case. If they don't pay you after you you have done the right thing I can point you in the right direction for getting your money quickly and cleanly. And if they are saying they won't pay you for the conflict, I suggest you look at you contract and ask them for a copy of their "就業規則" ,"shuugyuukisoku", but if the company you work for has less than 10 staff they probably won't have a "就業規則" ,"shuugyuukisoku". Why I suggest this is b/c it could be written in the rules that you have to do what you are told. If you don't understand what I am talking about then please let me know?

When I was hired, there was a little paper in English called "agreement" that I signed. It specified my payment and some dressing rules. There wasn't any rule like spanking children, I wouldn't sign such a paper if there was. There was no any shugyuukisoku.
Also there is another thing that worried me while I was working there. They performed islamic studies and prayers during the school hours, that also wasn't specified when I was hired.
I called my employer asking if I could come on Tuesday, he said that I shouldn't come any more, and I shouldn't call him any more and I shouldn't get my money. But he didn't give me any dismission document. So the next question is - should I go back to school anyway?

Thank you Dave, you are so helpful.

 

[Glenski]

You did work.
They won't pay.
That's the crux.

They owe you. If they fire you, they owe you 30 days pay or that much notice.
Talk to the Labour Standards office, a lawyer if you like, or the union (www.generalunion.org).

 

[ArmandV]

You did work.
They won't pay.
That's the crux.

They owe you. If they fire you, they owe you 30 days pay or that much notice.
Talk to the Labour Standards office, a lawyer if you like, or the union (www.generalunion.org).

This was precisely my point earlier. If a person is fired and it was justified or not, they still owe you for work performed.

End of story.

 

[FrustratedDave]

You did work.
They won't pay.
That's the crux.

They owe you. If they fire you, they owe you 30 days pay or that much notice.
Talk to the Labour Standards office, a lawyer if you like, or the union (www.generalunion.org).

This was precisely my point earlier. If a person is fired and it was justified or not, they still owe you for work performed.
End of story.

Both of you have to realise that the law is more complicated than that.
The problem is that she said she refused to take a direct order and resigned in own words without notice their could be complications, in some circumstances a company can recoup compensation from an individual for quiting without notice. The company is just excercising its right to not allow her to come back to work and I don't see it as her being fired.
julia_matsu, did you say that you would not continue to work or do so in so many words like in your first post?

According to (民法 第628条) minnpou dai 628 jyou,

（やむを得ない事由による雇用の解除）
第628条 当事者が雇用の期間を定めた場合であっても、やむを得ない事由があるときは、各当事者は、直ちに契約の解除をすることができる。この場合において、その事由が当事者の一方の過失によって生じたものであるときは、相手方に対して損害賠償の責任を負う。

民法・第３編 債権

the way the OP left work was a "無届け、突然の退職" mutodoke,totsuzennotaishoku" so the OP may very well have to pay damages.

All I can suggest is that you talk to a lawyer or someone from "厚生労働省", kouseiroudoushou.

 

[Glenski]

Dave,
You do work, well or badly, you deserve to get paid. Julia wrote:
I worked all the working days in October and the conflict came the last day at the end of my working day, so I didn't miss any working day yet.
and
But they told me that they will not pay me any money because of that conflict.

That is way over the top in penalties!

You do not have to do everything the employer says. Don't do illegal things, things against your religion, things that are harmful to others (including corporal punishment).

Am eager to see what the OP says about corporal punishment being in the contract or school policy, and whether she knew it. To actually be told to "make them cry" is an outlandish order, especially for preschool kids. I'm sure their parents don't know about such a policy, or they'd be up in arms. I know my wife and I would be!

Oh, and if this was a new contract clause, it has to be agreed upon by both parties before it is legally binding.