Self Employed in Japan?

Hi! So I have a few questions about moving to Japan (obviously).
I have spent quite a bit of time lately looking up information on work visas, resident visa, etc. but I seem to just be running myself around in circles and getting more and more discouraged every day.
My boyfriend and I have never actually been to Japan, we are planning on getting tourist visas to check it out but more than likely we will still end up wanting to live there.
Basically our story is this; My uncle used to live/work in Japan about 20 some odd years ago, he still has a property there and has given us permission to use it in exchange for paying property taxes/upkeep.
Now like I said, we do want to visit first but are looking to make it a more permanent situation.
Neither of us have college degrees, he has 12+ years experience as a locksmith whereas I have pretty much zilch.
As for current employment, we are both self-employed as transcriptionists, which is a home-based job, and make around $2,500/mo each.
The issue I seem to be having is that we don't want to give up the jobs we have (seeing as we could still work them if we were living in Japan) but I don't see any other way for us to get anything other than a tourist visa.
Am I wrong in thinking this? Is there any way for us to work towards a more permanent status in Japan without switching occupations?

KitsuneJ said:

My boyfriend and I have never actually been to Japan, we are planning on getting tourist visas to check it out but more than likely we will still end up wanting to live there.

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I'm sorry, but that is just a silly statement. If you've never lived in Minnesota, Baghdad, Paris, or Moscow, why would you say that you are so likely to live there? Japan is no different. No experience in a country or location is really an empty cup.

Basically our story is this; My uncle used to live/work in Japan about 20 some odd years ago, he still has a property there and has given us permission to use it in exchange for paying property taxes/upkeep.
Now like I said, we do want to visit first but are looking to make it a more permanent situation.

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You will need to check into whether he can legally do that. As far as BOTH of you coming permanently, you are not married now, so BOTH of you will need proper visas. Once you get married, only ONE of you needs the work visa, and the other can be a dependent. But dependents can't work full-time.

Neither of us have college degrees, he has 12+ years experience as a locksmith whereas I have pretty much zilch.

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Big problem. Nobody is going to want a foreign locksmith, and I bet he doesn't even speak, read, or write the language. Degrees are needed to get work visas, and even that guarantees nothing, since most non-teaching jobs (easiest to get) require experience and fluency in the language..

As for current employment, we are both self-employed as transcriptionists, which is a home-based job, and make around $2,500/mo each.

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Moot point.

The issue I seem to be having is that we don't want to give up the jobs we have (seeing as we could still work them if we were living in Japan) but I don't see any other way for us to get anything other than a tourist visa.

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Yup.

Seriously, you two need to come here as tourists first and look around. Two weeks is not enough. Two months is not enough. Get more experience in seeing what Japan is like before diving into the deep end and thinking of committing yourselves to living here.

Glenski said:

I'm sorry, but that is just a silly statement. If you've never lived in Minnesota, Baghdad, Paris, or Moscow, why would you say that you are so likely to live there? Japan is no different. No experience in a country or location is really an empty cup.

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I understand that but since I was very young I have always wanted to live there (I grew up in a mostly asian community with many of friends parents who were from Japan, Laos, Korea) not saying that changes the fact that yes we DO need to visit first and make sure it is something that we both want which is what we plan to do before making the decision to make a permanent move. I would say I'm more than likely to make a decision to move there permanently because of how much I respect their culture and ideals (again I do realize that I have not experienced it firsthand and it could be quite different from what I believe it to be).

Glenski said:

You will need to check into whether he can legally do that. As far as BOTH of you coming permanently, you are not married now, so BOTH of you will need proper visas. Once you get married, only ONE of you needs the work visa, and the other can be a dependent. But dependents can't work full-time.

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I would think it would be something like being a caretaker for the property? It was a property that he had on the market but could never get a decent offer for it so he recently took it off. If you or anyone else on the forums know anything about that I would love to know otherwise I'll have to do some more checking for it.

Glenski said:

Big problem. Nobody is going to want a foreign locksmith, and I bet he doesn't even speak, read, or write the language. Degrees are needed to get work visas, and even that guarantees nothing, since most non-teaching jobs (easiest to get) require experience and fluency in the language..

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Actually we both speak a little of the language (not fluent by any means, a lot more work ahead to get anywhere near there) although neither of us can read/write.

Glenski said:

Seriously, you two need to come here as tourists first and look around. Two weeks is not enough. Two months is not enough. Get more experience in seeing what Japan is like before diving into the deep end and thinking of committing yourselves to living here.

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The longest you can get a tourist visa for is 180 days (if you are extremely lucky) but from what I read the average is about 90 days, am I right on that? Which as I said is what we plan to do for sure. Since I've posted this though I've been looking around and I was thinking maybe a better idea for us is to get a student visa and attend one of the culture and language schools. That way we would be able to spend more than a just couple months out there as well as learning the language.

Americans get tourist status for 90 days. If you are lucky, you might get an additional 90 but not consecutively in most cases. I certainly wouldn't bank on it.

No reading or writing? Forget 99 percent of non-teaching jobs. Just how "much" do you two speak?

Yes, a student visa would allow you to stay longer, but unless you also work part-time on it, you will still be exposing yourselves to only half a lifestyle.

Forgive my harsh attitude on this next point. Your childhood experiences have not prepared you at all for making a decision to up roots and relocate permanently. It's merely a fantasy right now, and mostly to test the waters, even though you will probably deny it. Even if you learn more of the language, you don't have the necessary factor to get a work visa: a college degree.

We speak enough for basic conversation, and are currently working on learning more as well as beginning to learn some reading/writing.

With a student visa you're allowed to work part-time up to 28 hours a week yes?

As for the last part, I feel you have misunderstood what I said. I am not basing a permanent move like this off of just a childhood whim, the reason I am here is to get information on such a move and to find out what I will need to know/do to even begin to make that a possibility.

I do realize that I need to spend a good deal of time there before I make a decision which is why I believe that a student visa would be the best route for me at this point, it would allow me to learn the language, experience the culture firsthand, and spend a couple of years living there.

As for the work visa, maybe I'm being too much of an optimist here but after learning the language and becoming fluent in it, I find it hard to believe that there are absolutely NO jobs/companies that would sponsor a work visa unless you have a college degree.

KitsuneJ said:

We speak enough for basic conversation, and are currently working on learning more as well as beginning to learn some reading/writing.

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Can you describe "basic conversation"?

With a student visa you're allowed to work part-time up to 28 hours a week yes?

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yes

As for the last part, I feel you have misunderstood what I said. I am not basing a permanent move like this off of just a childhood whim, the reason I am here is to get information on such a move and to find out what I will need to know/do to even begin to make that a possibility.

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Well, I'm going off 3 statements you made:
* more than likely we will still end up wanting to live there.
* we do want to visit first but are looking to make it a more permanent situation.
* we don't want to give up the jobs we have (seeing as we could still work them if we were living in Japan)

I do realize that I need to spend a good deal of time there before I make a decision which is why I believe that a student visa would be the best route for me at this point, it would allow me to learn the language, experience the culture firsthand, and spend a couple of years living there.

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Doesn't matter in the end. A couple of years at uni here won't give you a college degree. Good experience and PT work possible, but after that, b'bye!

As for the work visa, maybe I'm being too much of an optimist here but after learning the language and becoming fluent in it, I find it hard to believe that there are absolutely NO jobs/companies that would sponsor a work visa unless you have a college degree.

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You'll have to trust me and MOFA on this. It's the law.
日本法令外国語訳データベースシステム - [法令本文表示] - 出入国管理及び難民認定法第七条第一項第二号の基準を定める省令
If you are married, whether to each other or to a Japanese, you won't need a degree, but that's different. the person married to a foreigner can only work PT (or lose dependent status and have to pay taxes instead of being exempt from taxes on the other person's return). Being married to a Japanese lets you work FT, but we're back to the part about being perceived as qualified for a job again.

Just what kind of jobs did you figure you were going to get, anyway? You said something about keeping your current jobs (transcription? What's that?), but if it's what I figure, you're looking at tons of competition from Japanese locals for very low paying work that fits temp workers who have to pass lots of written and oral exams just to have a chance. Self-employment here means you have to set up a formal company (unless one is a dependent). Look at the link to see what it takes to get an investor/business manager visa (no degree but far more qualifications). Plus, owning your own business is very risky.

You need to prove that you have what a Japanese doesn't in order to get hired. Being a native speaker is good if you want to teach English, but if you want anything else, a degree and experience/skills PLUS high fluency (JLPT2 on the old scale) are usually the benchmarks. Look at the jobs on Daijob or Career Cross web sites.

And, uh, just how long did you figure it would take to become "fluent"? Certainly not a couple of years! No way.

The immigration requirements aren't really a surprise. I don't know of any countries that will just hand out a work visa as long as you have a job offer (special cases like working holidays and transferees excepted - but those tend to be short-term visas).

In the UK, for non-EU working visas (the "skilled labour" scheme) you need to be in a shortage occupation or the company needs to show that they can't recruit within the EU and then if you change jobs within the term of your visa you might just have to do it all over again, depending on whether whoever handles your case at the home office is in a good mood that day or not. NZ & Australia have point systems which are much the same - higher qualifications, high-paying job offer, shortage occupation - preferably more than one of these. At least as an American you wouldn't have to take an English test.

I once had an issue where I couldn't be sponsored for a visa to work in the US, because the visa category in question required a degree and I was still an undergraduate at the time. Since it was only a summer job, and I was young enough I got in using a third-party sponsor under a working holiday equivalent scheme, the requirements for which were basically a passport and a mildly extortionate "processing fee". If the job had been for more than three months I would have been screwed, though.

Seriously, this is not just a Japan thing. Governments live and die on numbers like immigration and unemployment and if the voters think both of these numbers are too high they'll assume the former is responsible for the latter. So unless there's a genuine shortage in their country of people who can do what you do or you have a large sack of money, they have no motivation to let you in. I can tell you plenty of Stupid Immigration Stories experienced by friends and relatives from around the world - arbitrary requirements, pointless paperwork, rules followed to the letter - and these are for the most part, English speakers immigrating to other parts of the world which are English speaking and it's still a cr☆pshoot. The best part about my naturalisation ceremony was knowing that I would never have to deal with the UK Home Office again - well, except for the post-naturalisation interview I needed to go through to get my new passport...

"A native English speaker with a job offer to teach and a degree in pretty much anything you like" is honestly a pretty low bar for a work visa. Yes, it's an arbitrary hoop to jump through, but metaphorically speaking the hoop is at a height which is possible to reach and is, at least, not on fire.

tl;dr: all immigration departments, regardless of location, are uniformly horrible pits of bureaucracy. Optimism does not help. Large sacks of money help. If you do not have large sacks of money-- sorry, "qualify for an investor visa", knowing the system well or paying someone to know it well for you also helps. Companies who regularly employ foreign staff will have someone they pay to know the system on your behalf. Companies who do not may not bother hiring foreign staff (unless they already have permanent residency or a transferable visa) because it is just too much hassle.

Also, if you were thinking of doing freelance transcription for US companies while residing in Japan, or otherwise would expect to have income from US sources while you were in Japan, you might want to look into tax laws (or again, pay someone to do this for you). Double taxation could become an issue. Start here if you really want to read up on taxation rules by yourself.

nekojita said:

tl;dr: all immigration departments, regardless of location, are uniformly horrible pits of bureaucracy. Optimism does not help.

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true, so true!

Large sacks of money help. If you do not have large sacks of money-- sorry, "qualify for an investor visa", knowing the system well or paying someone to know it well for you also helps.

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Even if you come here with a million dollars and pay someone to teach you what is needed to get an investor visa, it is no guarantee that you will get it. As you (nekojita) so extensively just wrote, it all requires that visa applicants jump through the right hoops. Can't do it? Don't fit the immigration requirements? Sorry, your money will be wasted, and you won't get a visa.

It's a matter of maximising your chances. I paid someone to go through my UK naturalisation papers instead of directly submitting them, and it was worth it because hey, turns out "five years residency" does not mean that you've held permanent residency/NTL status for five years, it means that you were physically in the country on the day on which the Home Office first open your application. I'd been on holiday about five years previously. The nice lady held onto my application for a week and sent in after the danger had passed, because yes, they can decide to reject you for that, and yes, bye-bye several hundred quid if that happens.

And this is why I will always get the opinion of a professional when it comes to immigration matters. (Still half convinced they do it on purpose to keep their reject rate up).

The funniest "immigration fail" anyone in my circle has experienced is when Australian immigration asked my mother for proof that her marriage was not a scam for immigration purposes. I think that when you look at the application and the marriage date is more than 30 years before the visa application date, you ought to be able to figure that one out for yourselves.

If husband and I move to Australia, I will definitely pay someone to fill out the spouse visa paperwork for him. There's no way I trust him to not get sarcastic with the forms.

nekojita said:

The funniest "immigration fail" anyone in my circle has experienced is when Australian immigration asked my mother for proof that her marriage was not a scam for immigration purposes. I think that when you look at the application and the marriage date is more than 30 years before the visa application date, you ought to be able to figure that one out for yourselves.

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Presumably, that was because your mother was married to a Japanese. Not the case with the OP here.

If neither of you has a college degree, you really need to consider that first and foremost. Sometimes you can get a work visa if you have a combination of 10 years of work experience and some sort of education, but both must be directly related to the type of work (and visa) that you seek. From what you have written so far, I don't see that you have this. An immigration lawyer may be able to help put the proper spin on things along this line, but unless there is information you haven't told us, I'd say get cracking (one or both of you) on landing a degree, otherwise all you can really hope for is a student visa or investor/business manager visa.

Thank you both for all of the information =) It's been very helpful.

We have actually spoken with a group that helps out with the student visa paperwork and are planning on studying at KICL.

After that if we decide we want to stay in Japan longer I am going to look into studying for a degree at a university.