Professor says men may have only ten million years left

Dream Time

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News | The Scotsman

well thats not for me to worry about,i don't have ten million years of life to live
and if I do, then I would be getting all the girls because there would be so few men available,if they would still be interested in guys,that is

:D
 
yee, my mad biology teacher scared me about this... the Y is shrinking. :( I wouldnt worry though... i mean, common, 10 million years? we could probably realistically lengthen it by that time... could probably do it in 20 years. :D
 
Isnt it completely and utterly fascinating to know we are still evolving, and will continue to evolve so long as we exist?

Its incredible to think the current genome of male/female may not even be remotely familiar to what it has been in a few million years.

Oooooooh I love evolution/biological science!!!!
 
Well, since science already made great advances in fertilizing eggs without males involved, this news isn't near as threatening as it seems to be.
 
Human evolution continues? I really wonder how that should work.
Mutations occur, definitely. But for evolution to work mutations have to succeed in the whole species. Since there is no real selection anymore in modern human societies, the whole mutation business would have to be done through dominant genes. Which is a rather slow process.

Let's see: a mutation occurs now in one man, population 6 billion (& growing). Under optimal circumstances the mutation may need 1000 years to reach the whole population. Since optimal circumstances don't exist, it would actually take much much longer. & this would be only the 1st in a long line of mutations, which have to occur, be dominant & succeed. Can't really see that happening (probably wouldn't live long enough, anyway). Could of course be one big mutation which gulps the whole Y-chromosome, but how probable is that?

BTW, the first guys who actually aren't guys anymore will not be able to procreate (unless another mutation occurs), which might just possibly slow down the process even more.
 
remeber people... a male geneticist near you, is trying to stop the oncoming, although distant, extinction of the male homo-sapien(do we have another sapien yet?) Y chromosone... you should give him $200 million, and 10 years, and your great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great- great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great- great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great- great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great grand sons might just make it. :D

edit: ...cool, this post is really wide. :D
 
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I must say that it's rare to see such optimistic news, I mean 10 million years!!! It's hard to believe humans will still be on the face of the earth by that time. I mean modern Men has been on earth for what? about 10,000 years and look what has been done to the earth and the among themselves. I'm sorry to introduce a pessimistic message, I know that during that time humans also have made tremendous progress and progress faster and faster, but... is it enough?
 
The Y chromosome started life 300 million years ago with 1,438 genes, and has already lost 1,393. Losing the rest could spell the end for men, but Prof Graves believes they will not be totally wiped out.
A rudimentary grasp of the notion of species is what is at risk in Grave's academic training. Tsk, tsk...all the work for naught !
Speaking to the 15th International Chromosome Conference at Brunel University yesterday, Prof Graves said she believed other genes could take over the work of SRY.
The reason why the Y chromosomes have been losing so much of the previously meaningful GTAC sequences was that most of it was redundant in other parts; actually there is more redundancy in the whole of human DNA coding than one would imagine. Close to 90% I hear ? Someone please correct me if I am wrong, but we have a lot of repetitive dupilcates, or duplicates of duplicates all over the double helix.
She has conducted research on rodents, which have no SRY gene, and another chromosome has taken over the task of harbouring a gene that determines sex. If this happened with people, it could lead to two or more sex-determination systems, each based on a different gene. The result could be two species of humans.
Preposterous !
1) If indeed the redundant codes in the Y chromosome get down to the bare minimum needed to define a phenotypical male, any mutation that is detrimental to the development of a functional male will get stomped out because the mutation carrier will not be able to reproduce.

2) Even if (through some odd change, ie. a rearrangement of the higher order grammar of gene expression) there comes into existence an alternate blueprint for male development, the alternate males and the traditional males will compete-- to be precise the genes will compete, and out of that, a rapid replacement will occur regarding the two types of genes.

It will only take 30 generations for one successful Y chromosome carrier to have ca. 1 billion offsprings if he succeeds in leaving two successful males behind. Supposing he has two male offspring before 30 yrs of age, it only takes 30 x 30 = 900 yrs to propagate his gene to 1 billion offspring. 990 yrs would give enough time for the figure to rise to 8 billion human population. Therefore the period of coexistence of two competing definitions of male genes will be brief at best.

Never fear, all male forumers, for there is no such thing as the male species. The seemingly formidable Professor Jenny Graves may be more a politically oriented male-bashing feminist than a serious scientist. She may have succeeded in making you twitch in dread, but what she says will never happen the way she describes it. :devilish:
 
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Winter said:
Isnt it completely and utterly fascinating to know we are still evolving, and will continue to evolve so long as we exist?

Its incredible to think the current genome of male/female may not even be remotely familiar to what it has been in a few million years.

Oooooooh I love evolution/biological science!!!!

Oooooooh, so you want women to be the eventual evloution of man? :eek:

(there is sarcasim among us in this topic)

Doc
 
Doc said:
Oooooooh, so you want women to be the eventual evloution of man? :eek:

(there is sarcasim among us in this topic)

Doc
Do you mean winter was a girl ? 😲
I never noticed her showing any preference, what :? *sweats*

(you couldn't be implicating winter aka the doc pushing feminist ideology ??)
 
lexico said:
Do you mean winter was a girl ? 😲
I never noticed her showing any preference, what :? *sweats*

(you couldn't be implicating winter aka the doc pushing feminist ideology ??)

No, no, no! 😌 I was simply going along with Winter's post. 😌 As you can tell Winter's post was done in pure sarcasm, so I just went along with it with my own sarcasm just to spice things up. 😌 Personally I think that scientist really just needs to learn when to put up and shut up. God I hate feminists. They're nothing but a bunch of man haters when you get right down to the nitty-gritty; all because they're a bunch of insecure women. They truly piss me off royally. :eek:

Doc :-)
 
Give the prof a break!

I think you are being rather unfair to Professor Graves. Her remarks are being taken out of context to give the impression that she is a feminist nut, when she is actually a well-respected scientist doing important work in genetics. A quick google search is enough to make this clear. I think any 'feminist' comments she has made are somewhat tongue-in-cheek, such as:

far from being a macho entity with an all-powerful role in male development, the human Y chromosome is a "wimp." It is merely a relic of the X chromosome, and most or all of the genes it bears—including the genes that determine sex and control spermatogenesis—are relics of genes on the X chromosome that have other functions altogether.

Let's give credit where it's due to the woman who: was her family's sole breadwinner for four years; raised a new-born baby and held down a job with no maternity leave; continued to work despite a cerebral haemorrhage that nearly killed her; is a member of the Australian Academy of Sciences; etc, etc. Her work on gene mapping has possible applications in agriculture and medicine, including identification of genes responsible for certain birth defects. Take the time to read Jenny's CV. Does she come across to you as a man-bashing feminist extremist, or as an honest working mother who is a little self-effacing?
 
Thanks for digging up her CV; indeed she knows to humble herself. And I wish that humbleness also extends to scientific truth.

What bothers me most is not her political bent-- I would not have made the accusation unless she made really stretching statements that make one wonder, "Can she be serious ?"

She should really think deep about treating males (and females by the obvious logic of exclusion of the middle, or exclusion of what is neither male, female, or difficult to determine) as if it were a species or subspecies of its own. It is my understanding that males and females form one species. Males and females share at least one X chromosome; the male gets a Y to match that while a female gets another X. What is all this "two species" talk that is out of synch with basic, high-school level biology ?

It is possible, as we often see in the case of people misrepresented by journalists, that her words were taken out of context, and I understand that. I sincerely wish that were the case. I just can't let ignorant remarks rule just because they "supposedly" came out of a respected, hard working scientist of good standing amongst peers, or distorted through an ignorant journalist's biased perception. It must be corrected, not overlooked, for the sake of science.
 
lexico said:
What bothers me most is not her political bent-- I would not have made the accusation unless she made really stretching statements that make one wonder, "Can she be serious ?"

I thought the same thing. How can someone reach the top of her field and believe something that must be wrong? Then I thought, maybe she has been misquoted or misunderstood.

lexico said:
She should really think deep about treating males (and females by the obvious logic of exclusion of the middle, or exclusion of what is neither male, female, or difficult to determine) as if it were a species or subspecies of its own.

She doesn't treat males as a subspecies, IMHO. She claims that if the Y chromosome continues to lose genes, maleness may come to be determined in some other way. If several different new sex determination mechanisms evolved, humankind could separate into several different species that are unable to breed with each other. She doesn't (or not that I can find) claim that males and females are, or ever will be, different species. The idea that several different species could evolve from present humans is not so far-fetched - we know that in the past at least two species of hominid were co-existent.

I'm glad I found this thread, because it really got me thinking. At first I thought "What a nut", but now that I have looked into it I have found a huge amount about the great work she is doing, and the many benefits it could have for agriculture, environment and medicine. This interview is detailed, if you can cope with the typos.
 
Dream Time said:
News | The Scotsman

well thats not for me to worry about,i don't have ten million years of life to live
and if I do, then I would be getting all the girls because there would be so few men available,if they would still be interested in guys,that is

:D

Really? Damn! I'd better hurry up and earn that first million before I'm too old to spend it!
:D
 
I can't believe that any serious scientist would believe that we Homo sapiens sapiens still have 10 million years left before our next mutation. Just 3 million years ago, we were still Australopithecines, 1 million years ago we were Homo erectus and Homo sapiens only appeared less than 500,000 years ago. We the tremendous evolution of diet, lifestyle and habitat since the beginning of civilizations about 5000 years ago, and even more in the last few centuries and decades, I would rather bet than the Homo sapiens will have evolved to a new species within 100,000 years. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if our knowledge of genetic manipulation made us evolve to a higher species within just a few hundred years.

I am sorry but these professors are idiots. I wonder how they haven't lost their position already. I am not even a biologist, but simple logics can already prove them wrong after a few seconds of reflexion. Who knows, maybe homo sapiens have already evolved into different subspecies and those professors belong to some more retarded ones. 😌
 
bossel said:
Human evolution continues? I really wonder how that should work.

But people still die childless in wars, become sterile or just cannot find a spouse (because of their looks, personality or financial situation). This all contributes to evolution, especially in the past few decades since people have got more freedom to choose a partner they love (as opposed to forced or socially motivated marriages). Homosexuals can get married (in 4 countries so far), and many women decide not to get married or have children for their carreer. The number of single women in their 30's or 40's has never been so high in developed countries, which only contributes to more people ending up childless. Unfortunately, the current trend of society is such that evolution might favour the poorer and less uneducated that care less about their career or worry less about their potential children's well being, which in the long run could mean that humans will become less intellectually disposed than now.

Let us not forget that all humans are genetically different except real twins. This means that we could all be different "sub-sub-sub-species" Let say that the first subdivision of homo sapiens are the main ethnic groups (Caucasians, Mongoloids, Negroids, etc.), then the ethnico-cultural groups (Celtic, Germanic, Latin, Slavic, etc.), then the interpersonal genetical differences. We humans decided to classify life beings into species, races, etc. but nothing prevent us from further subdividing, in which case, we can clearly see that humans have evolved a lot since the time the first Homo sapiens left Africa to colonise the world. The best proof is that even children can distinguish ethnic groups fairly easily. So we are evolving, and into many different directions. This is not new. Cro-magnon and Neanderthals (two human species) have coexisted for a few thousands years. They were both originally the same species that evolve separately after a while. It just took a bit longer than to differentiate Caucasians, Negroids and Mongoloids from each others, but the principle is the same.
 
Maciamo, don't take tabloid reports at face value. Try looking at some of the links I have found above, or just google the professor's name, and you will find that she has been misquoted and misunderstood.
 
I don't know why people are worrying so much. I mean I know I'm not going to be around 10 million years from now. Of course who knows I may reincarnate myself just for the thrill of it. Who knows maybe the mutation will kick butt? If not then it would be a pretty big waste to come back. :(

Doc
 
how would this fricking scientist know that!?! GOD made us in his image! we dont evolve! besides even if dudes died out, women would die out right after us then.(no one to do it with) :-)
 
Maciamo said:
Unfortunately, the current trend of society is such that evolution might favour the poorer and less uneducated that care less about their career or worry less about their potential children's well being, which in the long run could mean that humans will become less intellectually disposed than now.
Actually, that's how I see it as well, but I wouldn't call that evolution. There is no selection at work. It's just that in modern societies pretty much everybody is able to successfully procreate. It's only the amount of reproduction that makes a difference. & since at the moment in industrialised societies those with lower IQ reproduce the most, there it may be going backwards. Yet, this is not true for the whole of humanity & where it is true, it's only a marginal trend, esp. since IQ is largely dependent on education & environment.

we can clearly see that humans have evolved a lot since the time the first Homo sapiens left Africa to colonise the world.
Again I agree, but this stopped some decades ago. There is virtually no population isolated enough to produce any new subgroup. Existing subgroups, whether you call them races, subspecies, subraces are levelling out, due to increasing interbreeding. If you want to call this levelling evolution, OK. But IMO it's not. There is simply not enough selective pressure.
 
I don't like the odds on man being around 10,000 years, or women

I give it 400 years tops
 
Protect the whales, the vegetables, and menkind !!

In an awesome vision I saw Portugal perish for its sins in 500 yrs, so I think both of you are a bit off. And there has to be life after Portugal unless it was meant to be a nuclear conflict. I could be wrong though.
To be on the safer side, I would have added "life on earth for us humans, and also for men unless women rise up against us." Even the legendary Amazons kept their men for procuring offspring and housekeeping while reserving the tough stuff like war for the more reliable, better equipped women folks. I think it's cheaper that way than genetic engineering. I wonder what might happen when the GE way gets cheaper. We need a declaration of men's rights and crimes against menkind by a responsible and forcible international body such as the United Nations to safeguard menkind from massacre by womenkind. :p
 
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