Please check my understanding

letslearn

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11 Sep 2013

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• 17 May 2014

• #1

In a textbook they are talking about japanese similes involving 猫．
they use 猫の額ほどの庭あります． which is my garden is a small as a cats forehead.

That I understand. it is the next line.

猫にも額の広い猫と狭い猫がいると思うので、日本語の 分かる猫に聞かれたら、「失礼じゃないですか」と怒ら れてしまいそうです．

my interpretation is.

because when it comes to cats there are wide and narrow foreheads, if japanese understanding cats hear, they might likely say angrily "isn't that rude?"

よろしくお願いします

 

Mike Cash

骨も命も皆此の土地に埋めよう

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• 17 May 2014

• #2

Try rewording with "even among cats" and "if overheard".

 

letslearn

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• #3

because even amoung cats there are wide and narrow foreheads, if japanese understanding cats overheard, they might likely say angrily "isn't that rude?"

thanks mikesan

 

Mike Cash

骨も命も皆此の土地に埋めよう

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• #4

Happy to help. If I sound mean, don't be bashful; let me know.

Nouns modified by a preceding verb or verb phrase are usually rendered in English using relative clauses, so go ahead and "natural it up" a bit with "cat who understands Japanese" instead.

Also, develop the habit of always being alert to active/passive voice. (聞く vs 聞かれる for example).

 

letslearn

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• #5

thanks mikesan. describing nouns with subordinate clauses (before the noun as in japanese) has always given me trouble. i wish i could find or be shown a good exercise to help me out with study.

while i'm here i might as well ask a question.

in the following question.
そう言ったら，本当に猫が手伝ってくれるのでしょうか
Is there a good explanation of そう言ったら ? is it... "if it is/was the case".
if it is the case that a real cat helped you how/what would you say it...

 

Mike Cash

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• #6

The speaker is reminded of the expression 猫の手も借りたい , natural mental segue from one cat idiom to another. So just use a functional translation such as "come to think of it...." or "now that I think about it".

The transition assumes shared common knowledge of the idioms in both speaker and listener, so it isn't quite as abrupt as it may appear. If you want to be more direct, "having said that,...."

Not "that a real cat helped" but "a cat really helped". Look at that part again and you'll see it.

 

Toritoribe

松葉解禁

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Fifteen-year veteran

22 Feb 2008

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• 17 May 2014

• #7

そう refers to 猫の手も借りたい "if you say '猫の手も借りたい'".

@ OP, you should give us the context exactly, that you quoted A PART of a question.


次の短文を聞いて質問に答えなさい。
-----
忙しくて忙しくて、だれでもいいから一人でも多くの人に手伝ってもらいたいです。そんな時、日本語では「猫の手も借りたいほどだ」と例えて言います。たとえ猫が手伝ってくれてもそれほど役に立つとは思えませんが、何か口に出して言いたいと思って、こう言うのです。
-----
問２ そういったら本当に猫が手伝ってくれるのでしょうか。なぜですか。

 

Mike Cash

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• #8

I thought it was a continuation of the 猫の額 part.

 

letslearn

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11 Sep 2013

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• #9

is it because of that pesky particle の nomalising the last clause？

そう言ったら，本当に猫が手伝ってくれるのでしょうか

本当に really 猫が手伝ってくれるの cat helped.

 

Toritoribe

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• 17 May 2014

• #10

Mike Cash said:

I thought it was a continuation of the 猫の額 part.

Click to expand...

Yeah, it's understandable. The fact that you were reminded of 猫の手も借りたい only from the given context shows how deeply you understand Japanese language, not only the grammar.

letslearn said:

is it because of that pesky particle の nomalising the last clause？

そう言ったら，本当に猫が手伝ってくれるのでしょうか

本当に really 猫が手伝ってくれるの cat helped.

Click to expand...

That's the explanatory の, not a nominalizer.

 

letslearn

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• #11

ok sorry guys. I should have been more careful. i was trying to figure out what they were asking me to do.

 

Mike Cash

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letslearn said:

ok sorry guys. I should have been more careful. i was trying to figure out what they were asking me to do.

Click to expand...

I have no complaints. It made me look smarter than I really am.

 

letslearn

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• #13

the text book i have doesn't have the なぜですか part like yours does at the end. its from 中級から学ぶ日本語．

 

Mike Cash

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• #14

letslearn said:

the text book i have doesn't have the なぜですか part like yours does at the end. its from 中級から学ぶ日本語．

Click to expand...

Did you study the book before that one?

 

letslearn

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• #15

no. this book my friend just gave me to have a look at, its obviously to advanced for me but i thought i would make an attempt.

 

Mike Cash

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• #16

letslearn said:

no. this book my friend just gave me to have a look at, its obviously to advanced for me but i thought i would make an attempt.

Click to expand...

I could kinda tell by gaps in your knowledge relative to the level of the material. Good effort, considering. Your time would be better invested and you better rewarded by your efforts if you went back and did the first book first. There is no substitute for learning the basics thoroughly.

 

letslearn

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11 Sep 2013

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• 17 May 2014

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• #17

thanks for your help guys. Mikesan i think i will take your advice.