Oh look, here comes the "salaryman"?

Tokis-Phoenix · 8 Apr 2006

I was reading some posts on news articles on another site i am not a member of and somone posted somthing quite interesting about the use of the term "salaryman" in japan when a foreigner (or at least i assume he/she was a foreigner) referred to a crime case about a salaryman- the person said this;

"(insert name here), I don't mean to lambast you for your comment, but I make this comment now as a message to everyone who uses terms such as "salaryman" or "Hori the Salaryman."

The word "salaryman" is used to informally describe "an essentially useless, often inebriated japanese man, characterized by gray suit, blank expression, an inability to think for himself."

I don't know by your usage of that term whether you're inferring that all Japanese men are "essentially useless" or "inebriated" but for the sake of being CORRECT, I would suggest you just say "Japanese man" or "Japanese male" when referring to what you view as a "salaryman." It's a good way of "keeping the unkind and untrue sentiments inside" and "thinking before you talk.""

Is this true about the use of the word "salaryman" in japan :? ?

ArmandV · 9 Apr 2006

I always took the term to mean an average Japanese office worker. Most of them wear the standard dark gray suit. I did see one 2 years ago wearing a light tan suit.

gaijinalways · 9 Apr 2006

Same. Just like OL is used for an office lady, though they may have more to complain about (the ladies that is).

epigene · 9 Apr 2006

Strictly speaking, anyone paid a monthly salary is a "salaryman." The 2002 Japanese winner of the Nobel Prize in chemistry was a "salaryman."

People define words based on their own prejudices. Of course, there is a downside to being a "salaryman," but what job doesn't?

ArmandV · 9 Apr 2006

epigene said:
Strictly speaking, anyone paid a monthly salary is a "salaryman." The 2002 Japanese winner of the Nobel Prize in chemistry was a "salaryman."
People define words based on their own prejudices. Of course, there is a downside to being a "salaryman," but what job doesn't?

It is preferable to being jobless and homeless.

Sukotto · 9 Apr 2006

When we got of the last northern stop of the bullet train at Hachinohe we were "dragged into" a tavern which was owned by this woman's mother.
The woman said she was a "salaryman".

For me, I had the thought that a "salaryman" was the suited business man
and maybe a stereotypical one would go out drinking after work.
But, that was the impression I got of what most businessmen did after work.
I was not presented necessarily with the image of a drone.

yukio_michael · 9 Apr 2006

I've never heard salaryman used in a derogatory way, even in books teaching Japanese. In Japanese, there are the words ﾆ池ﾆ淡ﾆ値ﾆ湛ﾆ筑ﾆ停?慊 (bijinesuman), andﾂ eigyouman...

I think you would find more people using the word oyaji to describe drunken washed up salarymen... Since getting a job, wearing a tie, bringing home a wage, and performing all the perfunctory duties of work & social interaction are all expected of Japanese workers, salaryman seems pretty appropriate.

Maybe there was some sort of sea change in manga, but you can count Sarai-kun, Don't Cry, Tanaka-kun, & Furiten-kun, all as 'salaryman' manga... Pretty typical salarymen show up in manga such as Crayon Shin-chan as well...

nice gaijin · 9 Apr 2006

By the literal definition, as epigene said, anyone paid by a salary instead of a monthly wage is a "salaryman," but the stereotypes therein are numerous. I wouldn't try to group them all under an overarching definition, because that ignores the variety of salaried workers [in Japan].

Minty · 9 Apr 2006

I think you are over reacting, to me salary man = a Japanese cooperate businessman.

nice gaijin · 9 Apr 2006

Minty said:
I think you are over reacting, to me salary man = a Japanese cooperate businessman.

Are you referring to my post or the thread-starter's?

godppgo · 9 Apr 2006

I thought anyone who works for someone and receives monthly paycheck is qualified to be called salaryman?

gaijinalways · 9 Apr 2006

You mean I am one ?

godppgo · 9 Apr 2006

Do you wear a suit at work?

Minty · 10 Apr 2006

nice gaijin said:
Are you referring to my post or the thread-starter's?

The thread starter.

Pachipro · 10 Apr 2006

To me a "salaryman" is any male employed in a business, wears a suit to work, and who works in an office. For this they receive their monthly salary on the 25th of each month.

On OL is a woman who, when they get to work, often change into a company uniform and perform clerical duties and serve tea to customers and other men in the office.

Now there woman who are businesswomen who do not perform clerical functions and they also were (still are?) sometimes referred to as "salarymen" also.

In Japan it is easy to stereo-type a man or woman into OL or salaryman based on the clothes they are wearing and is often done by even the Japanese themselves.

Hiroyuki Nagashima · 10 Apr 2006

According to my memory....
The top of an expensive tax payer of 2004 was salaryman.

The amount of tax payment
3,700,000,000 yen
Estimate yearly income yearly income
More than 10,000,000,000 yen

It seems to be a fund manager of an adviser investment company of Tokyo.

godppgo · 11 Apr 2006

Hiroyuki Nagashima said:
According to my memory....
The top of an expensive tax payer of 2004 was salaryman.
The amount of tax payment
3,700,000,000 yen
Estimate yearly income yearly income
More than 10,000,000,000 yen
It seems to be a fund manager of an adviser investment company of Tokyo.

Is ﾂ青ｴﾅ陳ｴ窶傳ﾋ弸 the person you're talking about? I am reading this 2003 top 30 Japanese Tax payer list. He was listed 8th in 2003 with ﾂ焦?窶慊ｾ稅ﾅ?z of 8窶ｰﾂｭ557窶毒凪?ｰ~. I guess he did pretty well in 2004. It really came as a surprise to me there are quite a few salaryman among the top 30 tax payers in 2003.

gaijinalways · 11 Apr 2006

godppgo said

Do you wear a suit at work?

Yes, sometimes, or always a suit jacket with dress pants for my university jobs. But I didn't make the top 30 for income !

Mars Man · 11 Apr 2006

Yeah, in all my few years here, I've never heard 'salary man' used in a way that would insinuate what the OP had picked up on from somewhere else, though I have heard it used in expressions of dissapointment--oh, just a salary man....ka?

Tollen · 14 Apr 2006

hmmm seems in all that the orig post was jsut someone that wanted an argument or to be thought of as hard-done by or clevererererer than others...
far too many ppls pick fights for no reason rather than just accept things and not get offended... is irksome...

Ewok85 · 14 Apr 2006

The fact they haven't come back doesn't really inspire me to add much to the thread either, except I also call myself a サラリーマン and if I wanted to be rude I'd call someone オヤジ instead....

Tokis-Phoenix · 16 Apr 2006

Ewok85 said:
The fact they haven't come back doesn't really inspire me to add much to the thread either, except I also call myself a ﾆ探ﾆ停?ｰﾆ椎?ﾂーﾆ筑ﾆ停? and if I wanted to be rude I'd call someone ﾆ棚ﾆ停?榿淡 instead....

I'm sorry i didn't reply back to this thread earlier...So there's nothing wrong in being called a salaryman. What do the words in japanese in your post mean?

yukio_michael · 16 Apr 2006

Tokis-Phoenix said:
I'm sorry i didn't reply back to this thread earlier...So there's nothing wrong in being called a salaryman. What do the words in japanese in your post mean?

salaryman, and oyaji ...

Oh look, here comes the "salaryman"?

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