Honorifics 敬語 Question

Supervin · 17 Apr 2007

Hello, I've just started on 敬語. Can someone please enlighten me on the difference in politeness amongst the following three 尊敬語 expressions of the same meaning? I've received mixed opinions on them. Can they be arranged in order of politeness?

In what context do you use which?

社長が食べられました。
社長がお食べになりました。
社長が召し上がりました。

Thanks.

nhk9 · 17 Apr 2007

Supervin said:
Hello, I've just started on 敬語. Can someone please enlighten me on the difference in politeness amongst the following three 尊敬語 expressions of the same meaning? I've received mixed opinions on them. Can they be arranged in order of politeness?
In what context do you use which?
社長が食べられました。
社長がお食べになりました。
社長が召し上がりました。
Thanks.

社長がお食べになりました。 is sometimes regarded as the more stiff keigo when compared to 社長が食べられました。 But the former is usually a mouthful to say so quite often 社長が食べられました would suffice in most circumstances. 社長が召し上がりました。 includes the verb meshiagaru, which is just a fancy keigo word that shows you know your keigo. If you are a shakaijin, you are expected to be able to use it, along with other fancier words like ukagau, omenikakaru etc.

Sometimes the forms can be mixed together. It is frowned upon by some purists, but in more serious circumstances, using the forms together just adds emphasis to what you want to express. I've seen phrases like お亡くなりになられました, which is a 三重敬語

Supervin · 17 Apr 2007

So are you saying that the first version is enough usually, if you had to choose between the first two? You said that 社会人 are expected to know the third kind, but when do you use it? Onto the mixed variation you mentioned, again, when is that needed?

Thus, when do you use which version?

Mikawa Ossan · 17 Apr 2007

nhk9;457197 said:
Sometimes the forms can be mixed together. It is frowned upon by some purists, but in more serious circumstances, using the forms together just adds emphasis to what you want to express. I've seen phrases like お亡くなりになられました, which is a 三重敬語

I suppose this makes me a purist, but I hate this kind of thing.

I think that お食べになる is not very good keigo. 食べられる is kind of a keigo-lite, or shall we say a mild form of keigo. Kind of like (although of course not the same) as ～はる in Kyoto dialect. 召し上がる is the preferred keigo form in most cases.

epigene · 17 Apr 2007

Mikawa Ossan said:
I suppose this makes me a purist, but I hate this kind of thing.
I think that お食べになる is not very good keigo. 食べられる is kind of a keigo-lite, or shall we say a mild form of keigo. Kind of like (although of course not the same) as ～はる in Kyoto dialect. 召し上がる is the preferred keigo form in most cases.

I second Mikawa-san.

nhk9 · 18 Apr 2007

Supervin said:
So are you saying that the first version is enough usually, if you had to choose between the first two? You said that 社会人 are expected to know the third kind, but when do you use it? Onto the mixed variation you mentioned, again, when is that needed?
Thus, when do you use which version?

The rareru keigo form is used quite often in Kansai or western Japan, especially in the form of -te orareru (instead of -te irassharu).
Mixed variations are generally not needed, as something like irassharu is often suffice. I'd say that most right wingers use them when talking about the emperor or the imperial family though. There are special keigo words for the emperor, but not for every verb that exists, so that's why people resort to using these mixed variations.
(edit spelling)

Mikawa Ossan · 18 Apr 2007

nhk9 said:
There are special keigo words for the emperor, but not for every verb there exists, so that's why people resort to using these mixed variations.

I think it's simpler than that. A lot of people (yes, even Japanese people) don't know keigo very well, and they try to compensate by using what they know, often with horrible results.

Supervin · 27 Apr 2007

Thanks all for the input.

Honorifics 敬語 Question

Supervin

先輩

nhk9

先輩

Supervin

先輩

Mikawa Ossan

いかんわ！

epigene

相変わらず不束者です

nhk9

先輩

Mikawa Ossan

いかんわ！

Supervin

先輩

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