First~

Tomii515 · 10 Apr 2008

Hey everyone.
Just wondering how you would do... sorry, i'm an idiot and I don't knwo what the correct term is for it.

like...

first, second, third, etccc

What do you do?

just add -ban to the end of a number?

but what if you wanna use it in a sentence??

likee....

for example

"This is my first dog."

orrr

"That hat is the second hat I've worn today."

or something like that

would it be something like...
これは一番（の）犬です。
- this is my first dog. [dunno if its right, dunno if there should be a 'no' or not, or even if it's in the right place, or if even the word "first" is right ]

i have no idea how to translate the other sentence lol

Thank you to whomever helps ^_^

srintuar · 10 Apr 2008

First, second, third are: いちばんめ、にばんめ、さんばんめ、and so on.

"First", however, is often spoken as "はじめて" when you mean "My first ever"

So, my second dog: うちの二番目の犬

Elizabeth · 10 Apr 2008

Tomii515 said:
.
これは一番（の）犬です。 - this is my first dog. [dunno if its right, dunno if there should be a 'no' or not, or even if it's in the right place, or if even the word "first" is right ]
i have no idea how to translate the other sentence lol
Thank you to whomever helps ^_^

これは（この犬は）（わたしの）１匹目の犬です。 I would say probably or...maybe ?!

undrentide · 10 Apr 2008

The basic idea is as Srintur san explained.

As for "my second dog", when you're talking about something that needs counter, it becomes a bit complicated.
Instead of 番, you use counter (unless you're talking about the order.)

If you already have a dog and then recently you got another one, you'd say
二匹目の犬

If there's a dog race and you're talking about the one that reached the goal as the number 2,
二番目の犬(二番目にゴールした犬）

If there are several dogs lining up, and you want to point out the one which is second from left
左から二番目の犬

Edit: Oh, Elizabeth san, you beat me!

srintuar · 10 Apr 2008

二匹目の犬 does sound better if you have two dogs at the same time

All:
If your first dog had died, and now you bought a second one, would you prefer 二匹目 or 二番目 ?

undrentide · 10 Apr 2008

srintuar said:
二匹目の犬 does sound better if you have two dogs at the same time

All:
If your first dog had died, and now you bought a second one, would you prefer 二匹目 or 二番目 ?

I would prefer 二匹目, though I might use 二番目 as well depending on the context.

Tomii515 · 10 Apr 2008

ahhh ok thanks ^^

So, say i wanted to say....

Say i was making a blog and i wanted to say "this is my firt blog (ever)."

would it be
これは始めてノブログです。
Or・・・
このブログは初めてです。
？

oh oh.

i remember seeing something like this in the book. well, teaches aphrase

｢一つ目の角」を左に曲がる
turn left at "the first corner"

the conter in thing case before ~me is the thing for small items, and also isnt it the one you can use for anything like if u dont know a counter for a specific item?

&& how would you say "This is the second hat i've worn today" or w/e i put up there before?

Elizabeth · 11 Apr 2008

Tomii515 said:
ahhh ok thanks ^^
So, say i wanted to say....
Say i was making a blog and i wanted to say "this is my firt blog (ever)."
would it be
これは始めてノブログです。
Or・・・

You need 始めて no ノブログ

I'll go more into 1banme vs. daiichi vs. hitotsume etc. when I'm back with IME after work.

&& how would you say "This is the second hat i've worn today" or w/e i put up there before?

Kyou, (kore ha) nikaime ni kabutta boushi.

(This hat is the second one I've put on today) ???

Elizabeth · 11 Apr 2008

Tomii515 said:
oh oh.
i remember seeing something like this in the book. well, teaches aphrase
｢一つ目の角」を左に曲がる
turn left at "the first corner"
the conter in thing case before ~me is the thing for small items, and also isnt it the one you can use for anything like if u dont know a counter for a specific item?

Japanese often uses 「～つ目」 as a way of emphasizing strictly the number being counted. It's used a lot in the news for instance to analyze speeches and articles and stuff. Commentators will list out each issue point by point. First point （一つ目の点）, second point （二つ目の点）, third （三つ目の点）...etc, the numbering scheme becomes an organizational tool rather than necessarily a ranking of the importance of each item.

「～番目」, on the other hand, often conveys a stricter sense of something coming after another by order, rank, place, time, quality etc., although ～つ目 is sometimes used in this sense as well. Note again undrentide-san's dog examples.

「数える物」を強調するときは「～つ目」を使います。
「順番」を強調するときは「～番目」というように使い分けるのがいいと思いますた、これは「～つ目」と言うこともありますね。

でも、意味はほとんど同じですから、あまり気にせずどちらを使っても問題はありませんね。

undrentide · 11 Apr 2008

Tomii515 said:
Say i was making a blog and i wanted to say "this is my firt blog (ever)."
would it be
これは始めてノブログです。
Or・・・
このブログは初めてです。
?

１．これは初めてのブログです。
２．このブログは初めてです。

While both sentence make sense, they mean different things.

1. This is the first blog.
If you want to say this is "my" first blog, you should add 僕にとって (for me).
これは僕にとって初めてのブログです。
or
僕の (my)
これは僕の初めてのブログです。
or
これは僕の最初（さいしょ）のブログです。

2. This is the first blog.
It implies that it is the first (new) blog for you, i.e. you've never read it before, you've never seen such kind of blogs before, etc.
You see/read it for the first time.

Tomii515 said:
｢一つ目の角」を左に曲がる
turn left at "the first corner"
the counter in thing case before ~me is the thing for small items, and also isnt it the one you can use for anything like if u don't know a counter for a specific item?

You use 一つ目 simply because you do not use particular counter for 角.

ひとつめ、ふたつめ、みっつめ... are used first, second, third, they can be used in the same manner as
一番目の／最初の、二番目の、三番目の.
Elizabeth gave an excellent explanation on the difference.

First~

Tomii515

やった～！

srintuar

支離滅裂

Elizabeth

先輩

undrentide

Japa'n vagyok

srintuar

支離滅裂

undrentide

Japa'n vagyok

Tomii515

やった～！

Elizabeth

先輩

Elizabeth

先輩

undrentide

Japa'n vagyok

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