誰も悪い奴なんていねえ

zuotengdazuo

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• 21 Apr 2020

• #1

Hi. I don't quite understand why いない (いねえ) is used here? Could you please explain it? I would expect either 人間には悪い奴なんていねえ or 誰も悪い奴じゃねえ here.
Thank you.

 

bentenmusume

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• 21 Apr 2020

• #2

Can you clarify exactly what your confusion is here?

The alternatives you propose aren't necessarily incorrect, but why do you think the line as written is wrong or unusually phrased?

edit: To elaborate, the first alternative you propose (without 誰も) has a similar meaning but is less emphatic, while the second (changing いねえ to じゃねえ) would change the meaning in the same way as changing ある/いる verbs to the copula (だ/です) would in any case, from "there aren't any X" (a statement of existence) to "none of them are X" (describing state).

cf.
悪いやつはいねえ/悪いやつなんていねえ = there aren't any bad people
悪いやつじゃねえ = [he] isn't a bad person

 

zuotengdazuo

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• 21 Apr 2020

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• #3

Thank you, benten-san. I see.
My confusion is since いる means "there is/are...", we need to specify a range. For example, "there aren't any bad people among them" (彼らには悪い奴なんていねえ). But 誰も悪い奴なんていねえ seems to mean "no one is there aren't any bad people", which doesn't make sense. So the pattern ～に/のうち～悪い奴なんていねえ seems better.
Is my thinking wrong? How does the pattern も～いない make sense?

 

bentenmusume

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• #4

I'm not sure if this is what's confusing you, but も (like は) is a discourse marker, not a grammatical subject marker. Your English sentence doesn't make sense because it's trying to make "no one" the grammatical subject of a sentence which contains another full sentence with its own subject, but the Japanese sentence doesn't have that strict grammatical limitation.

It's just like we can say「夏はやっぱり、冷たいビールが最高！」 in Japanese without this corresponding to "Summer is cold beer is the best!", or some similarly ungrammatical English utterance.

I'm also not quite sure why you think the range must be specified. I mean, we could say 何も問題はないよ to mean "there aren't any problems (with the situation at hand)" or "there's nothing problematic (about what's being discussed)" without it being interpreted as saying that literally no problems exist anywhere in the world, right?

 

zuotengdazuo

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• 21 Apr 2020

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• #5

Thank you. Yes, I understand what you said.

bentenmusume said:

I mean, we could say 何も問題はないよ

Click to expand...

But I'm not sure if 何も問題はないよ is comparable with the op example. 何も is an adverb (the も isn't a discourse marker), so your sentence is valid. But 誰も is not an adverb (the も is a discourse marker).
So wouldn't 誰にも悪い奴なんていねえ make sense?
Maybe I need to memorize the original sentence as a set pattern?

 

zuotengdazuo

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• #6

I mean, doesn't the original sentence mean "there are no bad people among you" (the range is implied in the context)? So we should use に, shouldn't we?

 

bentenmusume

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• #7

I'm getting confused with what you're asking. My example with 何も問題はないよ was directly in response to your suggestion "we need to specify a range", and to point out that the range does not need to be explicitly stated.

And as to your second point, yes, exactly, the range is implied in the context. If you were to explicitly state it, it would be （あなたたち／おまえたちには）誰も悪いやつなんていねえ. Putting the "range"-specifying would on 誰 would make it "there are no bad people in who." 誰 is not the range.

 

zuotengdazuo

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• 21 Apr 2020

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• #8

bentenmusume said:

I'm getting confused with what you're asking. My example with 何も問題はないよ was directly in response to your suggestion "we need to specify a range", and to point out that the range does not need to be explicitly stated.

Click to expand...

Ok. I see. It's me that got confused. Sorry.

bentenmusume said:

it, it would be （あなたたち／おまえたちには）誰も悪いやつなんていねえ

Click to expand...

This makes more sense to me. But I still need to memorize 誰も悪いやつなんていねえ as a set expression.

 

bentenmusume

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But...it's not one? This specific expression isn't common enough to be worth memorizing, and you could theoretically get similar patterns with different words, e.g. 何もたいした問題なんてないよ, etc.

 

Last edited: 21 Apr 2020

Toritoribe

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• #10

zuotengdazuo said:

I still need to memorize 誰も悪いやつなんていねえ as a set expression.

Click to expand...

As bentenmusume-san suggested, that's not a set expression at all. Actually, 誰も is also an adverbial phrase there, as same as 何も in 何も問題はない. Think about the difference between the following sentences.

1. 教室に誰もいない。
2. 教室に生徒が誰もいない。

誰 is the subject of いない in #1, while 生徒 is the subject in #2, not 誰も. Similarly, 悪いやつ is the subject of いない in your example. Here's other examples of "interrogative + も" as an adverbial phrase.

お酒なんて何も飲みたくない。
噂なんてどれも信じられない。
観光地なんてどこも行きたくない。

 

zuotengdazuo

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• 21 Apr 2020

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• #11

Thank you both. I see.